S40 Broken Cambelt

[Darlo 1]

Hi,

I was wondering if anyone can help me... My cambelt snapped today while I was driving down the road at about 45mph in 4th gear. Ouch! I have a 2 litre, 16 valve, non-turbo S40.

I am wondering how much it is likely to cost - best case and worst case scenario. I am hoping to get someone to have a look at it this week but I think I'd like to be prepared and start looking for a new car if it's likely to be over about £1000, as that's about what the car's worth.

Any help would be much appreciated. Thank you in advance.

Neil

[mharriso]

Hey neil sorry to hear that.

Its not possible to say total cost as it depends if any internal damage took place due to the belt going.

If its belts only, then you are looking at about 300quid to replace x2 belts and tensioner at an independent. About 120 quid for parts if memory serves..

If the valves made contact with the pistons then if you are lucky its repairable, even still you could rack up another 500 quid easy, else its a new or re-con / breakers head replacement... anything between 500 and 1500 quid from breakers to main dealer....

Best thing to do is whip the head off yourself and look in side... then you'll get a good idea a to economical to repair or not....

[Clan]

The main question here is WHY did it break? Volvo cam belts dont break unless they have been seriously neglected . Missed the change interval?

There are bound to be bent valves , A Cheap way out may be to get a used engine and fit the whole unit quicker and cheaper than fixing your own . I have seen these from £100 to £300 via e-Bay and volvo breakers ...

[Chris1Roll]

The main question here is WHY did it break? Volvo cam belts dont break unless they have been seriously neglected . Missed the change interval?



I would say the main question as far as the OP is concerned is how to fix it now it has. Perhaps afterwards he could spend time conjecturing as to why.

I would say thats a fairly bold statement which is rather tempting fate anyway! The cambelt interval is calculated based on the cost versus the statistical likelihood of it breaking in service - it is possible for you to have the belt changed when required and then for it to fail, say 20K later, thats just life I'm afraid. in this case the OP may just have been one of the unlucky ones. (i'll retract this if he's on 150K on the original belt!)

Missing the interval as you say, is just asking for trouble, and if you don't get evidence of the belt having been done when you buy a car, do it ASAP.

The cambelt intervals these days do seem massive to my mind, 80K on a diesel engine, theres no way I'm leaving it that long!
The cynic in me suggests that due to the extra labour and cost involved in changing belts on these modern cars compared to the older ones (30mins for a 700/900), that volvo have just pushed the service life to the limit.

And yes, the engine is bound to have lunched itself - depends how handy you are with a spanner as to the route you want to take from here.

[Clan]

[QUOTE=Chris1Roll;290571]I would say thats a fairly bold statement which is rather tempting fate anyway! The cambelt interval is calculated based on the cost versus the statistical likelihood of it breaking in service - it is possible for you to have the belt changed when required and then for it to fail, say 20K later, thats just life I'm afraid. in this case the OP may just have been one of the unlucky ones. (i'll retract this if he's on 150K on the original belt!)


The cambelt intervals these days do seem massive to my mind, 80K on a diesel engine, theres no way I'm leaving it that long!
The cynic in me suggests that due to the extra labour and cost involved in changing belts on these modern cars compared to the older ones (30mins for a 700/900), that volvo have just pushed the service life to the limit.

QUOTE]

Not a bold statment at all , Its a statement based on fact over many years experience the belts dont break like on some other un mentionable makes ! The later ones are kevlar hence the cost , change at the correct interval that Volvo state and you simply dont get a problem . Volvos calculation is very very conservative for example I had an 850 belt break recently a 1993 , 110000 miles and it was the original belt .... that is a good example ... It should have been on its third belt by then. Volvo havent pushed the service life to the limit at all , quite the opposite .

Technology moves on 90000 - 110000 miles is fine the belts are much wider than the 200-900 belts and so less stressed , the interval for the older belts hasnt changed , still 50000 ( 200 - 900) - 60000 (400)

Regarding the diesel belts , the old audi/Vw diesel in the V70 had belt problems at first inherited from VW , Volvo sorted it out and never a problem afterwards .

Labour isnt that much more these days , 54 minutes for a D5 cambelt or 80 mins for a S60 petrol not too bad . My record for a pre 1984 240 was 7 mins for a cambelt change .

Anyway old technology is making a comeback, belts are on the way out again in favour of the chain , together with screw on oil filters in favour of replacable elements !

[Realist]

This remonds me to change my belt on my S40. Purchased the car in 2005 and it needed changing then, still not done it.

Around my parts here in South Wales, the cheapest change and service I can find is around £400.

Fingers crossed for me and I wish the OP best wishes in getting his car back on the road.

Regards.

[Clan]

what is the age and mileage?

[Realist]

Of my Volvo?

what is the age and mileage?

[Darlo 1]

Thanks for the help guys. I've decided to cut my losses and go for a T4 instead of messing around with this one.

The car is almost 10 years old and done 140,000 miles. Bought it in Feb this year and the (private) seller assured me it had had a cambelt change in the last 40,000 miles (it was on 136,000 then - teach me to listen and trust them). Needless to say I will not only be asking for proof from the next seller but also changing the next one dead on schedule.

As an aside, does anyone want to buy an S40 with 12 months MOT (last Thursday - 3 days before it went bang!), lovely bodywork, 4 brand new tyres, new pads and discs all round and a new catalytic converter 4 months ago, but with a knackered engine (haven't looked yet so it might even be salvageable). Would need towing away from Newcastle under Lyme, Staffordshire (near Stoke on Trent). Long shot, I know, but you never know who's reading this....

[Darlo 1]

Forgot to say, if anyone wanted me to, I could take some pictures and upload them. Let me know.

Neil

[LankyTim]

Im in Stoke, if its cheap enough ill have it.

[Darlo 1]

As promised, here is the link to the gallery I have made.

http://www.volvogallery.org.uk/showphoto.php?photo=4549&cat=3172

Sorry for the quality and the wet car - it wasn't exactly sunny at 7.15 tonight and I wasn't planning on taking them, so excuse the dirtiness of the car.

Just to point out, I'll be removing the Sony stereo and K&N air filter and refitting the originals before sale. I've just posted it on the "for sale" boards, link below:

http://www.volvoforums.org.uk/showthread.php?p=290882#post290882

Neil

[mharriso]

mate just took a lokk at your pics, that has got to be worth someone chucking a re-con block in... its in good shape....

whoever picks this up, once she's rolling again let us know, be a shame to let it die....

[jop00]

my s40 cam belt just broke.
I got the AA to take me to the garage where cambelt was changed in Febuary. they stripped it and have found that the idler pulley bearing has completely disintegrated and the idler pulley has siezed.
They say that i may not get it on the warranty, (its done 11500mls) because i should have 'heard a noise and taken it to a garage before it broke'. I heard nothing!

any comments?

have you looked to see why your belt broke? dodgy batch of pulley bearings?

how can i make sure it gets done on warranty. top end rebuild 1k+ !

thanks

[LankyTim]

Some car have tensioner and idler pulleys that should be changed every time the belt is done. Dont know if the S40 is one of them but if it is theres a case of negligence against the garage Id say.

[jop00]

the pulleys were replaced. it could be that they were fitted badly, but i'd expect them to fail sooner if that was the case(?)

i can't explain why it happened other than bad parts supplied by volvo.

what do you think about it making a noise? how can they say this for sure?

[LankyTim]

They cant expect you to hear a noise as the first you hear may be the idler disintergrating and the cam belt falling off! It can happen very suddenly- and they know it.

[Chris1Roll]

Well. After this thread, I decided to leave the cambelt this last service (130k), and do it at the next major service (140k) this would still have been 20K before its time, and "just" 40K after the current one was fitted by Volvo for the previous owners.

So after having just spent £550 on parts for an MOT, driving home last night at 130,700 miles, the cambelt snapped, producing the most godawful metallic clunking (worse than the 1.9D sounds normally!)
I think I said something along the lines of "oh bother"
Had to get father to come and tow me home

So tomorrow night its off with its head and see whats bent! (Probably a lot as vadis says there are three thicknesses of headgasket depending on how far the pistons come above the block)

Then decide whether to rebuild it, get another engine, or get another car and swap all my new stuff and the cruise control over....None of which I can actually afford to do given the aforementioned expense, but at the same time, given that expense I can't afford to just scrap it either!

I haven't really had much luck recently.


That will teach me not to listen to myself!!


So, change your cambelts and tensioners well before time people!

[mharriso]

Well i have just done the belts on the s40 at home with basic tools and a couple made for the job as described in haynes...

Auxilliary belt is easy to remove / replace.
Auxilliary bely spring tensioner is a dog requiring the removal of x1 rad fan unit (easy) and the alternator (easyish), only then can you get the 14mm deep draw ring spanner (which i had t get especially) on onto the bolt which holds the tensioner on... it is a pig to get at and tight... expect some swearing...
The main Cam belt is easy to get off once you have loosened the main crank pully center bolt (not easy)... at this point you will have the inlet and exhaust cams dial them selves out of position due to the springs.... now you need some one to hold the new belt on temp while you dial the cas and sea the belt... fiddly but doable... re-check the phasing of the cams and crank to the marks on the vehicle (x3 times to be sure), then rebuild... a very tentative firing up when your done praying the belt is in the correct position and doesn't hop... if all sounds well then a gentle run to aid the bedding in...

All in it took a day, and saved approx 300quid...

Its the second belt change so we are well on the way to 300,00kms now....

[LankyTim]

Just to add, it always pays to turn the engine over a few times by hand via a socket on the bottom pulley bolt as opposed to just starting it up.. just in case!

[Clan]

[QUOTE=mharriso;314887]The main Cam belt is easy to get off once you have loosened the main crank pully center bolt (not easy)... QUOTE]


You don't need to get the crank pulley off a petrol ( only the D5) . The belt will come off between the pulley and covers .. You did replace the nut and 4 bolts with new ones? "use once only stretch bolts" again ....

[Darlo 1]

My s40 is still for sale looking for about £400 to cover the cost of the parts that i put on her. With a bit of work this will make a nice motor for someone. Also have a cambelt off my T4 to see if the engine is still viable as a runner if anyone is interested.

[OVLOVS40]

MY VEHICLE IS A VOLVO 1.8i SE WITH A MITSUBISHI ENGINE. IT IS RECOMMENDED THAT SUCH BELTS ARE CHANGED AT 60,00 MILES. MY OWN VEHICLE HAD DONE 99,000 AS I HAD BEEN INCORRECTLY ADVISED THAT IT SHOULD BE CHANGED AT 80,000 MILES. IT IS THE VOLVO S40 1.6 ENGINE CAMBELT WHICH SHOULD BE CHANGED AT 80,00 MILES AND NOT THE MITSUBISHI 1.8i ENGINE. I WAS QUOTED £600 + VAT BY VOLVO TO DO THIS CHANGE AND THEY STATED THAT IT COULD TAKE UP TO FIVE HOURS. MY LOCAL LARGE INDEPENDENT TOOK 3 HOURS AND REPLACED BOTH BELT, BEARINGS ETC ALL FOR £240. THE CAMBELT CHANGE ON A VOLVO S40 1.6 TAKES ONE HOUR AND IS MUCH SIMPLER AND I HAVE SEEN INDEPENDENT QUOTES OF £150.
INCIDENTALLY THE BELT THAT CAME OFF MY VEHICLE SEEMED TO BE IN PERFECT CONDITION WHICH IS A CREDIT TO VOLVO.

[Clan]

The time for a cambelt service on the GDi is indeed over 5 hours as it includes other items as well as the cambelt which is the longest most involved belt change on any volvo vehicle , with several points to be aware of The tensioning is crucial too . It lasted well , it is a very wide belt so this helps.. a credit to Mitsubishi in this case though!

[mharriso]

1 hour for a 1.6 with volvo block... i'd love to see that done...and put back together.
In additon if it was 1 hour then why do garages typically charge 300 labour for both belts...

If you doing this yourself I would allow 3-4 hours, that is for cam-belt, auxialliary belt, aux belt tensioner (the tensioner requires the alternator off, which is alot easier with the LHS electric fan removed... it also requires a deep 14mm ring spanner with off-set to get at....) factor in 30mins to go down the tool shop to get one... :-)

Very happy now as just done mine so no worries for another 80k.....

[Clan]

The timing belt change alone is 2.1 hours on the 4 cyl 1.6 maybe that explains the cost ...
the GDi is 3.1 hours .. thats JUST for the belt not the rest of the service .... Cambelt tensioner doesnt need to be changed on the GDi or very early V40 up to mid 1998 . Neither does the Auxilary belt tensioner ... thats an un-necessary expense .

[Darlo 1]

This car is still for sale simply to good to send to a scrapyard with ten odd months mot on it. Anyone interested?