Dynomec Locking wheel nut removal system

[MrCrusher]

Hi All.

Just wondering if any of you North East Volvo owners know of any garages, preferably around the DL postcode area, that use the Dynomec locking wheel nut removal tools.

Actually, I'm that hacked off with not being able to remove my offside front wheel, do any of you know of any garage within 50miles of Darlington that uses Dynomec tools? I've had this trouble with locking bolts before, on another car and this system sorted it extremely easily. I don't want to buy the full kit either as its about £125. If you're wondering what the Dynomec tool is: http://www.dynomec.co.uk

I think the locking wheel bolts made are by McGard. The bolt has a rotating collar around the top of the centre shaft where the key inserts, a solid flange between the collar and a rotating cone seat.

Problem is, some Muppet has air ratcheted the wheel bolts in and the key has been chewed up trying to get this last bolt out. I'm stuck with not been able to remove one wheel.

If the worst happens, I'll have to try DIY removal.

I've looked at all the traditional methods of bolt removal:-

Hammering an "undersize" double hex socket on will not work because of the rotating collar around the centre of the bolt and also, there is not enough room between the collar and the wheel bolt hole to allow the socket in.

I don't really want to start drilling yet though I thought that if I was able to drill down through the rotating collar a couple of times, to the solid flange, I would be able to crack then remove the collar then use a simple reverse thread bolt removal socket or even the "undersize double hex" method.

If I used a 10mm drill bit, I could drill down through the centre of the wheel bolt to just beyond the flange then break the head off the bolt. Wheel pops off then easily remove the remaining shaft of the bolt.

Chiselling the bolt head off would definitely lead to wheel damage.

I don't really want to go down the welded nut to bolt method.

I don't really fancy the "loosening the other bolts and then going for a drive" method to loosen the locking bolt either.

If anybody could suggest any other easy, and cheap, method to remove this bolt, I'd be very grateful.

Cheers.

Oh BTW, I do NOT work for, or have any affiliation with Dynomec. Just an appreciative fan of this tool as it got me out of the sh1t with a previous car.

[brodgar]

I don't really want to go down the welded nut to bolt method.====
===== just this looks the best way forward, apart than from the dynomec
tool

[Clan]

the dynotec tool will be useless on these bolts . tried it!
There is NO easy or cheap way of getting these off .

It isnt the power guns which make these bolts stick, it is that over the years the taper mates too perfectly with the wheel and you have to overcome this friction of the taper with the key nut . later bolts from about 2006 have a washer which means you only have to overcome the friction of the washer .
I would advise anyone with the 2000 - 2005 type locking nuts to throw them away and replace them with the new type whilst you can still get them off , remember they can still sieze on even when torqued correctly .
Having spent 3 hours yesterday removing 4 of these locking bolts there really is only one way out for you .

go to machine mart buy 2 sets of cranked ring spanners about £20 .. use the largest 18 / 19 mm spanners that leaves you with 4 ends you can weld to the top of each nut . Also buy there some HSS drills , 3 , 5, 7 , 8 , 10 , 11 , 12 mm about £20 .
you need a 100 amp conventional arc welder to weld inside the ring part of the spanner to the top of the locking bolt . fill the ring part of the spanner with weld , use the highest current you can ie around 100 amps . The whole end of the spanner should be glowing red hot .

when it is cool tap the spanner with a big hammer sideways whilst pulling and pushing this will loosen the hardened cap which will come off eventualy .

you are left with a nice countersunk bolt centre which you drill firstly with the 3 mm pilot drill . gradualy increase the size of the hole with the drills available , the drills will just last long enough to do the 4 bolts .
be very careful if you break the drill off in the hole end of story !

you MUST have a powerful drill at least 1000 watts and have a mechanical low gear on it with variable speed motor . this is so you can run it at as slow a speed as possible
(200rpm) yet have lots of torque available . if you over speed the drill bit the drill will instantly blunt . its HARD work , the bolt is still hard but at least drillable . with the 12 mm hole and other bolts removed , lever off the wheel from behind and the head of the bolt will break off .

This is the ONLY method i have found over the years that will get them off . This isnt a DIY job due to the welding and professional type drill you will need , you need the car at chest height so you can get your whole body weight against the drill , so go to your friendly garage show them this method and good luck ...

don't be put off by fitting new volvo ones , they are a new design now from italy , the wavy pattern is around the outer edge of the bolt which means the key nut has far more grip than the old type .volvo have at last ditched the McGuard ones .

[Anadinolin]

mc guard anti-theft wheel nuts? are these the ones that came with the X40's of 1998-2004?
http://i31.twenga.com/garden-diy/locking-nuts/s40-v50-c30-newc70-tp_1495141284563084979b.png

like this - with the "flower" pattern? I was talking to GATOS about this when i saw him the other day, they are really weak keys and nuts, its best to take them off the car when you give it over to kwick-sh*t or someone similar, and do the locking nuts yourself...

i should replace mine soon, what do the new ones look like and what price from volvo?

ps...a thread on the subject :)
http://www.volvoforums.org.uk/showthread.php?t=13114

[friedfrog]

There is an ATS in Malton that did mine for a fiver.

[MrCrusher]

SUCCESS.

I called Dynomec yesterday, the lady who answered couldn't have been more helpful and provided me with addresses and phone numbers of garages local to me who use their kit.

Took the car to one today. Guess how long it took the lad to get the wheel bolt out.

Bearing in mind, various other garages had quoted me various prices and their intended method of bolt removal: a couple of hours work, drilling the bolt out, removing the wheel at the suspension to be able to drill the bolt vertically- I kid you not, the welding a nut on method, etc, etc, etc.

15 seconds. The lad hammered "blade 3" on to the bolt, then had to put his full weight on to end of a 4' breaker bar to loosen it off.

Job done- that'll be £12 please. I know its £2 over the going rate per wheel but I'm happy and can now change the tyre.

One thing struck me thoughout this whole palaver, the general consensus regarding locking wheel bolts and nuts is that they're cr@p and more trouble than they're worth. Also, Volvo seem to suffer the worst when problems arise. When the lass at Dynomec found out the bolt was on a Volvo, she told to tell the garage to phone them if they couldn't remove the bolt with the Dynomec kit- apparently, there is a lifelong aftercare service and a regular bulletin issued with advice to overcome problems.

I'm pretty impressed with this kit as its saved me from a load of hassle again. Maybe the Mods on this site should sticky the details of the Dynomec kit and/ or website in the general forum area because there still seems to be a lot of people who have had trouble with locking wheel bolts and nuts as well as seized and rounded off standard wheel bolts, there'll be more in future no doubt.

It might just save people some time and effort putting this info out where its easy to find and the kit works.

[capt jack]

Have had this trouble with both Volvo and after market locking wheel nuts.

Laser do a tool which does work on the 'flower head' types nuts, but you pretty much end up sacrificing the tool - and at £17 for a set of two, one of which is too small and useless, it ain't cheap.

Garages and trye shops round where I live are very unhelpful - they don't want the bother.

Machine Mart do a couple of different sets of remover, one of which successfully removed the aftermarket StopLock nuts on my V70.

Personally, before I ever buy a car again I will ask the vendor to remove all the locking wheel-nuts or it's no deal.

These damn things are such a PITA to sort that I would rather run the risk of having the wheels nicked than bother with these silly devices.

Let's face it, there was a time when alloys were a luxury - now they're fitted to just about every car on the road, and available by the thousand at your local scrappy for peanuts.

You can buy a set of aftermarket wheels and tyres at any one of thousands of motor stores around the country for just a few £100.

They just ain't as nick-worthy as they once were.

Cheers

Jack

PS: As has been pointed out on here, with the right kit locking wheel nuts can be removed in seconds - something that every self-respecting wheel-thief will already know....!

[Clan]

Brilliant news !
Can you give us some more details of which type of locking bolt you had stuck on your car maybe a photo? were they actualy volvo ones ?
When you say "The lad hammered "blade 3" on to the bolt, then had to put his full weight on to end of a 4' breaker bar to loosen it off." It makes me think you had the early type ..


There are three types used :
the early type up to 2001 are cylindrical one piece
the second type from about 2001 - 2005 have a hardened spinning ring around the outside but otherwise one piece so the cone is part of the bolt .
the third type from about 2005 - 2009 have a smaller head with the spinning ring and the cone part is a rotating washer , so you are not fighting the friction of the cone in the alloy wheel just the friction of the bolt on the cone washer .
There is a latest type out now , italian with the wavy pattern around the outside of the bolt and the hexagon spins ... much better prospects of removing after a few years ...

type 1 is fairly easy to get off , types 2 and 3 are not ..

it would be interesting to know which type yours were . When the cone is siezed in the taper of the alloy wheel and the threads are dry with some rust no amount of torque will undo them ...

[Gazzza]

went to the Link and watched video Like it says as used by the AA :lightbulb:

Join the AA for a month £7.08 or £67 a year

[MrCrusher]

Judging by your description Clan, the bolts were the "3rd" type.

Must of been added "after market" though as the car is a 2001 V70. Maybe added because its on 17's which weren't that common back then.

Gazzza, didn't think of calling the AA out, I'm already a member. Argghhh!!!

[Clan]

Judging by your description Clan, the bolts were the "3rd" type.

Must of been added "after market" though as the car is a 2001 V70. Maybe added because its on 17's which weren't that common back then.

Gazzza, didn't think of calling the AA out, I'm already a member. Argghhh!!!

the current type at any point in time will fit earlier models so it seems someone got rid of your type 2 and fitted type 3 which helped you a lot .
I was struggling with the type 2 where the cone of the bolt was siezed in the cone of the wheel .
If anyone has this type without the washer it is advisable to get them off whilst you can and replace by the current type.
why volvo left it 10 years to perfect these locking bolts in small stages is a mystery .

It isnt just volvo which use these bolts , just about every premium European manufacturer does so presumably have the same problems ..

[capt jack]

Judging by your description Clan, the bolts were the "3rd" type.

Must of been added "after market" though as the car is a 2001 V70. Maybe added because its on 17's which weren't that common back then.

Gazzza, didn't think of calling the AA out, I'm already a member. Argghhh!!!

Don't know about the AA, but the RAC will attend to seized wheel nuts, but only if you've got a puncture and are stuck.

Cheers

Jack

[linesi]

all 4 locking wheel nuts on my 2001 v70 were locked on tight. The tyre garage messed up my locking wheel nut socket and then looked at me like I was going to magic the answer out of the air! These are the hardened bolts with the flower type pattern in the top.
After a quick bit of research it seemed that the Dynomec tool was the thing to use. After a call to the guys at Dynomec - they said "we can do it no problem". The helpful Rachael gave me some local stockists who I didnt like the sound of, so i stopped in at Dynomecs place in Castleford and they set about removing the bolts.
2 guys later a bit of sweat and the 4 locking wheel nuts were in the bin - I set off for my short break to North yorks.
prior to that I'd bought 4 new wheel bolts from Volvo and I put those in - who is going to nick alloys off a Volvo I ask you !!
Seems like a great tool to do the job - if anyone is in doubt ask Dynomec for their advice. (ps I dont work for them - just a great tool)

[Clan]

It seems you had the old "easy to remove " type too as the dynomec tool seems to hammer around the outside of the nut to remove them whilst the later type have hardened tops and a hardened spinning ring around the outside to prevent this.., i would really like to see what Dynomec make of the 2002-2008 types ...

[MrCrusher]

The way I understand it, the "blade 3" tool is the Dynomec"socket" in which you place a double sided "blank" which is made of an alloy that, when hammered onto the socket, forms a "new" key. This new key is apparently good to remove all four bolts usually. The "blank" is reversible, when one end has been used, it can be flipped out of the socket then reinstalled "other way round" so it can be used again fto form a different "key". The "socket" is merely a shroud that contains the "blank" and protects the wheel. The socket/new key can then be rotated with a 1/2" ratchet or breaker bar. You can even use an impact driver for more "seized" bolts.

I'll post some picks of my removed bolts when I get a chance. You'll notice that there is no damage to the bolts so technically, I could use them again.

If I was mental.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GFXfEhTi8VU

The 3 alloy "coloured" items in the bottom of the pack are the "blanks".

[Clan]

Many thanks for that , an excellent description together with the video makes it clear how this works and which nuts it can remove ..

However It will only be of use for locking bolts which are still intact , in good condition with clean threads , not excessivly tightened and not with the cone siezed into the alloy wheel cone ..
I have been dealing with removing these bolts for 10 years now and the above method i described is the only way i have found which will remove the worst cases , which luckily are not too common , maybe 2 sets a year for me . In these worst cases no amount of torque will free the bolt that is why the key breaks and sometimes the head of the locking bolt cracks , due to the huge torque applied and the bolts still will not undo . I have found the cars where the bolts are siezed are always high mileage where the bolts have been on and off a lot of times for tyres and brakes and the cones have mated perfectly to the cone of the bolts together with some corrosion .The dynomec tool wouldnt be able to deal with these huge torques on siezed bolts or with damaged wavy slots ..
The Dynomec tool would be great on newish cars where the key has just been lost ... but volvo have a way of dealing with this , you get a new key ...

so anyone with the locking nuts from 2001 to 2005 get them off whilst you still can and replace them with the current new type available from Volvo ..

[capt jack]

I have found the cars where the bolts are siezed are always high mileage where the bolts have been on and off a lot of times for tyres and brakes and the cones have mated perfectly to the cone of the bolts together with some corrosion

My nuts :animal-smiley-037: are old and been on and off many times - or rather the bolts holding the wheels on my car are old and have been on and off lots of times!

As a precautionary measure I've ditched the locking ones, the lubricated all 20 with a bit of copper grease before torquing to 110NM. Is this enough to keep the bolts from seizing or would I be as well ditching the lot in favour of new bolts?

Cheers

Jack

As for the nuts, I guess I probably need to ask on a different sort of forum..........?

[Clan]

140 Nm is the correct torque for S80 V70 S60 XC90 2000 onwards ...

[capt jack]

140 Nm is the correct torque for S80 V70 S60 XC90 2000 onwards ...

Hells Bells!

The handbook and Haynes for my 1997 V70 says 110NM, and my torque wrench only has settings up to 130NM!

The local tyre place did them up to 130, and that's what seized the locking one.

Jack

[Clan]

Hells Bells!

The handbook and Haynes for my 1997 V70 says 110NM, and my torque wrench only has settings up to 130NM!

The local tyre place did them up to 130, and that's what seized the locking one.

Jack

The pre 2000 V70 etc had 12mm threads the later after 2000 had 14mm threads ... that explains it :-)

[steventoon]

Reading this thread too late! The removal tool is mishapen on my 2003 S60. I've booked it in with a Dynomec using garage next Friday. I'll let you know how I get on.

Volvo were going to weld a nut on to the nuts and remove but want a £100 for all four to be removed.

[Sanzomat]

Thought I'd copy this over from the >07 V70 forum in case its is useful to anyone else who might not look there http://www.volvoforums.org.uk/showthread.php?t=73937 . I've also had a refund from McGard of the 18 euro I spent on a replacement key so all good.

Might not work if if your bolts are really seized but certainly worked for me...

Okay, I've got the bolt off! Hooray! Thanks for the advice but I thought I'd try a simpler version first before digging my old welding kit out of the back of my shed and sacrificing a trusty old ring spanner.
After sleeping on it I thought that maybe some two-part epoxy to glue the key to the bolt might do the trick and I'd got some araldite already. As the rounding of the key causes the key to lift out of the bolt when torqued I thought that as long as the glue bonded sufficiently to hold the clover leaf in then there should be enough contact for the cloverleaf pattern on the key to do the actual turning. As such there is a lot of contact surface between the inside of the key and the sides/face of the slip ring as well as the cloverleaf itself so there was a reasonable chance of success. I also thought that if it failed the likely result would be that the key would detach itself by the key lifting off the bolt so I'd be no worse off and the welding trick could still be done.
As it happened it has worked a treat. I cleaned both surfaces as best I could, marked the key and the wheel to note the position in which the key engaged, mixed up some araldite and smeared it liberally around the inside of the key. After pushing it in with the marks lined up I gave it a couple of hours to set firmly and then simply undid it. As it happens it wasn't particularly tight so I can't imagine why the bolt had damaged in the first place, must have been made of chocolate.
The damaged bolt and key are now permanently attached to one another but as they were going in the bin anyway thats no problem and no spanners were harmed in the process.
As an aside, I have had an email back from McGard offering to lend me a "drill-out kit" free of charge as long as I promise to send it back. They have also offered a free replacement for the key (and presumably the bolts) as long as I send back the damaged parts, but as I won't be installing them there doesn't seem much point in that. I've asked for a refund of my 18 euro so I'll see what response I get... .. to be fair, even though their product is rubbish, their customer service is faultless.

[T6 Power]

the dynotec tool will be useless on these bolts . tried it!
There is NO easy or cheap way of getting these off .

It isnt the power guns which make these bolts stick.

Clan I suggest that before you start knocking methods of locking nut removal, you actually try them yourself with professionally trained staff using the tools.

To everyone's reading this post:

I took my car to Castleford near Wakefield from Manchester just so the specialists could do the job directly using the Dynomec tool. Within minutes the staff had removed a seized locking wheel bolt of the McGard type from Volvo S80 T6 with absolutely zero damage to the wheel, the car or the locking bolt.

Within a further 5 minutes the remaining locking bolts were removed too with even less trouble..

This system works 99% of the time according to staff doing the work. For £10 a wheel compared to possible the cost of replacing a damaged wheel through welding spammers etc this is work every penny and minute of my time.

Thanks to the guys at Dynomec in Castleford, who ever soooooo kindly removed the locking bolts for me.

Don't be put off with the BS going about that Volvo McGard locking wheel bolts cannot be undone. This is totally untrue. I was skeptical initially, until I let them try and I honestly tell you this. "You are safe and assured removal of those McGard locking bolts." (Assuming they are not mangled beyond recognition, they must still have some form of key pattern in the head even if the head is damaged)

T6 Power
manchester