Centre Lane Hogging

[volvorocks]

What are peoples thoughts about drivers on a motorway who sit (or rather drive) :lol: in the middle lane for mile after mile when the inside lane is clear effectively turning it into a dual carriage way and thus contributing to bunching effectively leading to tailbacks.

[volvorocks]

PS Not sure how Ive managed to get this topic labelled S70

[jetronic63]

OMG - drives me mad. It seems this type of driver needs to be one lane from the outside as on the four lane sections of the M27 around me, they can be seen travelling in lane 3 with 2 clear lanes on their inside. Often there speed creeps up when you try and overtake them as well which is also really really annoying. I am working on the front mounted rocket launchers and I will have my revenge one day !

Until then it should be a fixed penalty for occupying the wrong lane IMO.

[kebab10]

You mean members of the Middle Lane Owners Club. Funnily enough came up to one this week on the M5 near Exeter and then another on the M4 near Chippenham. Wakners that is what they are wakners.

[tt82]

OMG - drives me mad. It seems this type of driver needs to be one lane from the outside as on the four lane sections of the M27 around me, they can be seen travelling in lane 3 with 2 clear lanes on their inside. Often there speed creeps up when you try and overtake them as well which is also really really annoying. I am working on the front mounted rocket launchers and I will have my revenge one day !

Until then it should be a fixed penalty for occupying the wrong lane IMO.
Highway code (http://www.direct.gov.uk/en/TravelAndTransport/Highwaycode/DG_069862)

Lane discipline
264

You should always drive in the left-hand lane when the road ahead is clear. If you are overtaking a number of slower-moving vehicles, you should return to the left-hand lane as soon as you are safely past. Slow-moving or speed-restricted vehicles should always remain in the left-hand lane of the carriageway unless overtaking. You MUST NOT drive on the hard shoulder except in an emergency or if directed to do so by the police, HA traffic officers in uniform or by signs.

[Laws MT(E&W)R regs 5, 9 & 16(1)(a), MT(S)R regs 4, 8 & 14(1)(a), and RTA 1988, sects 35 & 186, as amended by TMA 2004 sect 6]

and penalty given should be

http://www.direct.gov.uk/en/Motoring/DriverLicensing/EndorsementsAndDisqualifications/DG_10022425 (http://www.direct.gov.uk/en/Motoring/DriverLicensing/EndorsementsAndDisqualifications/DG_10022425)

Careless driving

Offence codes CD10 to CD30 must stay on a driving licence for four years from date of offence.
Code Offence Penalty points
CD10 Driving without due care and attention 3-9
CD20 Driving without reasonable consideration for other road users 3-9
CD30 Driving without due care and attention or without reasonable consideration for other road users 3-9

or

Motorway offences

Offence code MW10 must stay on a driving licence for four years from date of offence.
Code Offence Penalty points
MW10 Contravention of special roads regulations (excluding speed limits) 3

[GMad]

These idiots are the bain of my life..
If I could have a pound for every one I see on my travels, there would be a Bentley parked outside my house rather than an S60:realmad:

[RCSH]

Off the ferry at Dover, onto the M20, 2.25am on a sunday morning, not a soul in sight.... except for the to$$er in a BMW 3 series sitting in the middle lane.

Why is it I have just travelled over 1500miles on the continent, which only has for the majority 2 lanes, and they don't seem to have the affliction that the car will not return to the left after over taking. Could it be because we drive on the opposite side do you think?

jetronic, if you get the rocket launcher done, market it on e-bay, you'll make a fortune....



Rob

[christheancient]

The following is not meant to be sexist or digging at any archetypal driver...

One fairly quiet and pleasant summer Sunday evening, I was driving down the M4 from London to Bristol in a car emblazoned with the logos and livery of a very well-know driving school (not BSM... but the other one that uses a lot of yellow!). Being a good person (oh yeah) and not in any particular rush, I was driving properly within the speed limit and with correct lane discipline (Lane 1 was quiet - next to no HGVs in it).

From just after the M25, I spent quite a bit of time 'trading places' with a Peugeot 307 who insisted on staying in lane 2 all the way at a speed of c65 mph.

On more than one occasion, I overtook that car and, with quite emphatic signalling, returned to an empty lane 1. After a couple of miles or so, that Peugeot would overtake me - even though I was at about a constant speed and then gradually slow down to 65 again.

This went on until J18 for Bath... at which point the Peugeot pulled into lane 1 - for the first time since joining the motorway from the M25 - and left via the slip road.

The crunch...

It was a young blonde female! (but not particularly attractive, though)

Did she not think that, perhaps, a driving instructor may well know the proper procedures for motorway driving and try and adopt them?

[Andy Northface]

I shall see dozens of these next week as I head down the M6 to Blackpool.Oh,I wish I had a Sidewinder behind the grill to launch up these idiots exhausts!!

[RobbieH]

You mean members of the Middle Lane Owners Club. Funnily enough came up to one this week on the M5 near Exeter and then another on the M4 near Chippenham. Wakners that is what they are wakners.
far better to use Centre Lane Owner Driver as a descriptor :rolleyes:

Why is it I have just travelled over 1500miles on the continent, which only has for the majority 2 lanes, and they don't seem to have the affliction that the car will not return to the left after over taking.
Exactly my thoughts after returning from a trip to the Alps earlier this month :mad:

The M62 between Manchester and Ferrybridge also seems particularly prone to these :mouth_closed: :censored:

[volvorocks]

These idiots are the bain of my life..
If I could have a pound for every one I see on my travels, there would be a Bentley parked outside my house rather than an S60:realmad:

:lol:

In my case there would be 2 Bentleys...!!

[craigoodwood]

i have a sign made up that i put on the side window for motorway journeys it simply reads;
'get in the correct lane idiot'
and a sticker in the back window that reads 'i hate middle lane drivers'
it bugs me more than anythin else anywhere, with all the camera's covering motorways now it would be easy enough to moniter drivers doing it and then fine them, it would cut traffic jams overnight.

[weble]

It all re-enforces the argument that the Motorway should be apart of the driving test. Or at least a few hours of motorway driving with an instructor is required by law after passing the test, as it stands u can pass your driving test having never been on a motorway. Then be let lose to cause as much chaos as you like!

Like said above, u cant tell when they want off the motorway, is when they actually get out of the middle lane!

[CTCNetwork]

Hi,

The only "reasonable" excuse for hogging the middle lane is that the condition of the first lane is such that it makes driving "uncomfortable"
The first lane does usually have rutting from the regular HGV traffic (and the road being constructed on the cheap so it can't handle the 40+ ton limit they are now subjected to).

What can be more awkward is when you have a regular stream of cars in the first lane but the gap between the vehicles make you question whether you should pull back in as you'll be pulling back out a few seconds (or whatever time) later.

But given that the police have enough trouble catching other offenders, what is the likelihood of them pulling people for this?

Des. . . ;)

[christheancient]

It all re-enforces the argument that the Motorway should be apart of the driving test. Or at least a few hours of motorway driving with an instructor is required by law after passing the test, as it stands u can pass your driving test having never been on a motorway. Then be let lose to cause as much chaos as you like!

Like said above, u cant tell when they want off the motorway, is when they actually get out of the middle lane!

The (very) unfortunate part is that there are vast area of the country that are not within reasonable striking distance of a dual carriageway - let alone a motorway. The nearest thing that can be achieved to testing on such roads is for a newly passed driver is to undertake the "Pass Plus" scheme. But until that is compulsory...

When I was a Fleet Driver Trainer, the most common 'excuse' given to me for sticking in the middle lane was that the driver felt very vulnerable and trapped if they were in lane 1.

[bigbadee]

being a hgv driver it is the bane of my life as im not allowed in the 3 lane (its not called the fast lane lol) which oftern forces me to undertake as unlike when in my car v40 if i come off the power for a split second in my lorry then i can change down a couple of cogs and some times struggle to make the next hill

[961]

You will never cure this until you allow overtaking on the left

[volvorocks]

Hi,

The only "reasonable" excuse for hogging the middle lane is that the condition of the first lane is such that it makes driving "uncomfortable"
The first lane does usually have rutting from the regular HGV traffic (and the road being constructed on the cheap so it can't handle the 40+ ton limit they are now subjected to).

What can be more awkward is when you have a regular stream of cars in the first lane but the gap between the vehicles make you question whether you should pull back in as you'll be pulling back out a few seconds (or whatever time) later.

But given that the police have enough trouble catching other offenders, what is the likelihood of them pulling people for this?

Des. . . ;)

Hi CTCNetwork

Yes indeed the first lane can make driving a bit bumpy and your point is good.

Regards a stream of traffic in lane one - this indeed is a valid point although I refer to drivers "centre laning" (or rather "self centred laning"..!!) when there is no traffic in lane one

I feel though that people stay in the centre lane as its simply "easy" for them to do so - a sort of "im alright jack" kind of attitude accompanied with a lack of education on the rules of the road and worry as to whether or not they will ever again be able to move into lane two should they retreat to lane one!!

Your point about the Police not pulling people is indeed correct and dare I say are guilty of "centre laning" themselves from time to time!!

Regards

[ade555]

Well I had the balls to ask one day driver like that after he p.... me of so much that I pulled in to services after him and asked him question why would he mach the speed of my truck at 56mph then sit along side of me with out giving my chance to overtake slower vehicles ect. and stoping me of moving to middle lane, as he was lets say mature gentalmen didn't want a argument and I was nice to him, he reply to me that lane 1 is slow moving vehicle and as he is not slow moving vehicle :err: he should stay in middle lane and the fast lane is to quick for him :err:, so lets think how many people have the same understanding on motorways.

[mhl]

Agree with previous replies - these middle lane hogs are a total PITA. They're one of the main reasons why our motorways appear so congested and average speeds are decreasing - the m'way is often reduced effectively to only two lanes. I've lost count of how often I have come up behind one with faster traffic outside me in lane 3 and nothing in the inside, flashed headlights without any effect, then got dog's abuse from them when I have finally managed to get into lane 3 and pass them.

I don't consider undertaking on the inside a safe option. Would love to see middle lane hogging a points offence.

[159john]

What pi$$es me off most about these inconsiderate drivers is that I risk prosecution if I undertake them, so I have to move all the way out to lane 3 to go past......and then risk prosecution because, on the way they get a good long blast on my horn and the benefit of my full headlights (well they obviously aren't aware of any other road users, so I want to be sure they know I'm around!). I do then acknowledge them by flashing my hazards once I've overtaken them, as I move back into lane 1 (again risking prosecution).

This may sound jovial or anti-social; but my serious point is that if all drivers did this, middle lane hogging would could become as frowned on as drink driving, and hopefully be greatly decreased.

[caveman_returns]

You all ought to see the M6 by jct 10 northbound, 4 lanes and 2 centre lanes for the idiots to hog now!

[Rowton]

Grrr.... yes this really makes my pee boil!

Always seem like the sort who will not go in the inside lane because they've read in the Daily Mail that the inside lane is for single mothers/council estate people/dirty foreigners/sweaty lorry drivers etc...

Either that or the sort who just sit there because it's the easy life, just sitting in the one lane reducing brain activity to zero.

And that pathetic excuse re. ruts from wagons on the inside lane. If you cannot cope with that should you really be on the road???

[GMad]

You all ought to see the M6 by jct 10 northbound, 4 lanes and 2 centre lanes for the idiots to hog now!

Every Friday, on my way home I see this bit of motorway and agreed, it's particularly bad:thumbs_up:

[Rowton]

Every Friday, on my way home I see this bit of motorway and agreed, it's particularly bad:thumbs_up:

So being from Telford you must be familiar with the two-lane M54?

Always annoying are the people who insist on dawdling along in the right hand lane holding up the entire motorway quite nicely...

[GMad]

So being from Telford you must be familiar with the two-lane M54?

Always annoying are the people who insist on dawdling along in the right hand lane holding up the entire motorway quite nicely...

I am indeed, a super fast, stupid speed, rush home, by the time I get to it...

[craigoodwood]

I am indeed, a super fast, stupid speed, rush home, by the time I get to it...

thats the only thing the m54 has going for it... :)

[pdrvolvo]

You will never cure this until you allow overtaking on the left

I'm usually towing my caravan when i'm on the motorway so i always just undertake them.Some dont even notice me as i look accross at them.



peter.

[Bill Edmondson]

Then you get those UBER NUMPTY's who sit in lane 3 of an empty motorway, only move eventually after being flashed and bullied over then pull straight back out again CHRIST!!!!!!
Me and a work mate used to travel separately with work in convoy, both of us used to carry out what we called the pincer movement which would be both leave lane 1 to trail the offender, then I would break left, he would break right both overtake the hogger then both pull back into the centre lane in front of him, then indicate left and both pull back into the 1st lane. 50% of the victims got it and pulled over.
God I could go on!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[stevo48]

Then you get those UBER NUMPTY's who sit in lane 3 of an empty motorway, only move eventually after being flashed and bullied over then pull straight back out again CHRIST!!!!!!
Me and a work mate used to travel separately with work in convoy, both of us used to carry out what we called the pincer movement which would be both leave lane 1 to trail the offender, then I would break left, he would break right both overtake the hogger then both pull back into the centre lane in front of him, then indicate left and both pull back into the 1st lane. 50% of the victims got it and pulled over.
God I could go on!!!!!!!!!!!!!

So you feel its wrong to "hog" the middle lane but ok (in your own words) to flash and bully another driver into moving over??
Not exactly considerate driving on your part is it?
As for your "pincer movement" it simply is illegal to undertake another car on the right then pull straight back into the middle lane, you and your mate by your own admission are no better than the people you are criticising.

[TheJoyOfSix]

I've often heard it said that the MLOC driver won't return to the inside as he/she fears that they'll never be able to get back out again on the rare occasion they actually need to overtake something.

This is all very well, and might (possibly) make the basis of some kind of excuse if it weren't for one thing - how the hell did they get into the middle lane to start with?????? If they can do it once then they can do it again. I (and several friends) have racked our brains to think of a single motorway trip that could be done in the Uk whereby you can actually join the motorway in the middle lane and stay there until it's time to leave and we can't think of anywhere where this is possible. Anyone got any ideas?

My personal view is that MLOC members should be dragged from their vehicles, shot, boiled in oil, decapitated, stamped on, shot again, drowned, hanged, beaten mercilessly, shot etc etc etc......

[XC60MY12]

http://www.smartdriving.co.uk/Driving/Attitude/Road_rage/RR_1.htm

[volvorocks]

Then you get those UBER NUMPTY's who sit in lane 3 of an empty motorway, only move eventually after being flashed and bullied over then pull straight back out again CHRIST!!!!!!
Me and a work mate used to travel separately with work in convoy, both of us used to carry out what we called the pincer movement which would be both leave lane 1 to trail the offender, then I would break left, he would break right both overtake the hogger then both pull back into the centre lane in front of him, then indicate left and both pull back into the 1st lane. 50% of the victims got it and pulled over.
God I could go on!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Hi

Not quite sure how the pincer movement would work on a 3 lane motorway with 1 undertaking and 1 overtaking as there is no 4th lane.

What you describe appears more of (half) Tpac in so far as you both get past the hogger and both pull into the centre lane in unison

Whilst hoggers are annoying we are not at war...:lol:

regards

Ps

Not that often I come across a 3rd lane hogger when both lane 1 and lane 2 are empty

Regards

[Mike 700]

What are peoples thoughts about drivers on a motorway who sit (or rather drive) :lol: in the middle lane for mile after mile when the inside lane is clear effectively turning it into a dual carriage way and thus contributing to bunching effectively leading to tailbacks.

I agree that middle lane driving is wrong and inconsiderate, but I wonder how many people who have replied to this thread are actually middle lane hogs themselves, but can’t recognise it ?
Are they flashing and swearing and boiling their blood because ‘they are in the middle lane’ and some one else is there too, but going a little slower – say 70 mph ?, and they want to go faster than the car in front ?

So, they come up the middle lane in excess of the speed limit, flash the guy in front to get out of the way, and then tear up the middle lane themselves.

You must have seen them

[craigoodwood]

my theory for some of them is;
'oh i gotta travel on the motorway and i'm a bit scared mum/dad'....
'dont worry just stay in the middle lane'...
and so the advice gets passed on, i dunno what the older generation that are older than motorway system are thinking though!

[tt82]

I've often heard it said that the MLOC driver won't return to the inside as he/she fears that they'll never be able to get back out again on the rare occasion they actually need to overtake something.

This is all very well, and might (possibly) make the basis of some kind of excuse if it weren't for one thing - how the hell did they get into the middle lane to start with?????? If they can do it once then they can do it again. I (and several friends) have racked our brains to think of a single motorway trip that could be done in the Uk whereby you can actually join the motorway in the middle lane and stay there until it's time to leave and we can't think of anywhere where this is possible. Anyone got any ideas?

My personal view is that MLOC members should be dragged from their vehicles, shot, boiled in oil, decapitated, stamped on, shot again, drowned, hanged, beaten mercilessly, shot etc etc etc......

I can beat that - M60 Jc25 anti-clockwise exit slip road joins the motorway and becomes lane 3, the Fast lane. It does make for some intersting journeys passing or joining at this junction.

http://img163.imageshack.us/img163/7239/m60jc25.jpg (http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/163/m60jc25.jpg/)

[XC60MY12]

[QUOTE=volvorocks;991242]Ps

Not that often I come across a 3rd lane hogger when both lane 1 and lane 2 are empty

Regards[/QUOTE

Indeed it does happen occasionally but they're usually doing well above the limit. Could be a plain police car, or just a complete merchant banker :)

[XC60MY12]

i dunno what the older generation that are older than motorway system are thinking though!

They're thinking "just because I'm old don't assume I'm thick, you young pillock!" :)

[mike210970]

after years of trying and failing to get these morons to move over using the combined effects of the air horns and 100 watt main beam i now just stay in the correct lane and continue at my cruising speed and under take the idiots cant be arsed with going from lane 1 to 3 and back again and its not just blonde women lost count of yhr number of cars between leicester and milton keynes lane hogging on a recent trip to the out laws driven by young asian males

[mike210970]

mike 700 the middle lane hog is usually doing 60 and you cant get into the outside lane for ****s in bmw's audi's and mercs ding about a ton

[fowlerman]

This summer on the 2 lane stretch of the M4 in South Wales with the caravan on the back I got stuck behind a Morris Traveller doing 45-50mph and was unable to get into the o/s lane due to a solid stream of traffic doing 70+. Eventually we got to a crawler lane on the n/s. So what does the stupid c*w in the traveller do? Stays in what is now the middle lane at the same speed, so I passed her on the inside, followed by a couple of the several HGVs who were bunched up behind me and probably cursing the "bl***y caravan" in front for holding them up, not being able to see the cretin in the traveller. As I passed the traveller, the "Hippy type" in the passenger seat just gave me a stupid smile.

Pete.

[weble]

So being from Telford you must be familiar with the two-lane M54?

Always annoying are the people who insist on dawdling along in the right hand lane holding up the entire motorway quite nicely...

Ah, the M54, Do that road twice a day everyday! Telford, then Shrews, then Telford again! Being in a lorry it's usually pretty stress free until u try and pass someone that just about finds enough throttle to make sure i cant when im already halfway past!! Not a problem on a 3 lane, BIG problem on a two lane!

[Rowton]

Ah, the M54, Do that road twice a day everyday! Telford, then Shrews, then Telford again! Being in a lorry it's usually pretty stress free until u try and pass someone that just about finds enough throttle to make sure i cant when im already halfway past!! Not a problem on a 3 lane, BIG problem on a two lane!

Bet it can't help when they do that on overtaking on the parts that slope up.

Yeah it must be annoying when they do that, during the day you often see 'elephant races' on the M54!

Great little road at night when it's empty tho!

[XC60MY12]

after years of trying and failing to get these morons to move over using the combined effects of the air horns and 100 watt main beam i now just stay in the correct lane and continue at my cruising speed and under take the idiots cant be arsed with going from lane 1 to 3 and back again and its not just blonde women lost count of yhr number of cars between leicester and milton keynes lane hogging on a recent trip to the out laws driven by young asian males

Well you've clearly thought that one out. Presumably you went to the "Attila the Hun" school of motoring.

[weble]

Bet it can't help when they do that on overtaking on the parts that slope up.

Yeah it must be annoying when they do that, during the day you often see 'elephant races' on the M54!

Great little road at night when it's empty tho!


I found my self setting my cruise at 52mph. The reason for that is the M54 aint that long, it dont cost anymore time over all. It also means that any truck that needs to pass me, can do so with a 4mph advantage in a couple of seconds rather than a 0.25mph advantage as is usually the case when two trucks are at 56 and take 20 miles about it. It also means if i do find someone to overtake at that speed (usually cars!!) I can pop it up to 56, pass, back down to 52 for a speedy over take.

All fun and games, Til earlier this year the company decided to LIMIT our vehicles to 52! So now if i need to pass anyone, im screwed :(

But hell they're saving £250,000 a year in Diesel that's all they're worried about.

[Bill Edmondson]

So you feel its wrong to "hog" the middle lane but ok (in your own words) to flash and bully another driver into moving over??
Not exactly considerate driving on your part is it?
As for your "pincer movement" it simply is illegal to undertake another car on the right then pull straight back into the middle lane, you and your mate by your own admission are no better than the people you are criticising.

Hello again, as I said "used to" be it 20years ago, and doing 70k plus miles a year took it upon ourselves yes, wrongly yes. You don't need to tell me the law mate. So now being much older and wiser do feel I have the right to comment on the moc, and as usual was only trying to be totally honest.

[christheancient]

When all is said and done, do you know how much time you are losing by being held up by a CLOD?

I saw a film on tv done (with police permission) involving three cars over about (I think) a 24 mile stretch of motorway.

Driver 1 drove like maniac to get to the destination services as quickly as possibly
Driver 2 drove in accordance with the rules of the motorway
Driver 3 stayed in the 'Granny Lane"


Driver 1 reached the end of the slip road into the services just as Driver 2 came into the slip road.

Driver 3 came in about one-and-a-half minutes later.

'Nuff said?

[volvorocks]

When all is said and done, do you know how much time you are losing by being held up by a CLOD?

I saw a film on tv done (with police permission) involving three cars over about (I think) a 24 mile stretch of motorway.

Driver 1 drove like maniac to get to the destination services as quickly as possibly
Driver 2 drove in accordance with the rules of the motorway
Driver 3 stayed in the 'Granny Lane"


Driver 1 reached the end of the slip road into the services just as Driver 2 came into the slip road.

Driver 3 came in about one-and-a-half minutes later.

'Nuff said?

Hi christheancient

Interesting that. Do you know where it can be viewed at all?

Also with me its not so much that I am in a rush to get past..more so that I simply may be travelling in lane 1 and approaching the 60mph centre lane hogger and its annoying that due to their "cluelessness" or lack of respect for other road users one has to move from lane 1 to 2 to 3 back to 2 and back to 1 again whilst they seem to proceed on their merry little selfish way without a care.

Had the lane hogger been in lane 1 he could still have proceeded in his merry way and I would also proceed in my merry little way in lane 2 and then back to lane 1...LOL

Regards

[christheancient]

Hi christheancient

Interesting that. Do you know where it can be viewed at all?

Also with me its not so much that I am in a rush to get past..more so that I simply may be travelling in lane 1 and approaching the 60mph centre lane hogger and its annoying that due to their "cluelessness" or lack of respect for other road users one has to move from lane 1 to 2 to 3 back to 2 and back to 1 again whilst they seem to proceed on their merry little selfish way without a care.

Had the lane hogger been in lane 1 he could still have proceeded in his merry way and I would also proceed in my merry little way in lane 2 and then back to lane 1...LOL

Regards

Unfortunately All I can remember is that I saw it on BBC1 a few years ago. I can't even remember the programme name.

As far as clueless drivers are concerned, I accept that they are like that and make appropriate allowances for their stupidity. After all, it takes (at least) two vehicles to be involved in a crash... and I don't want to be in a crash - there are too many people die with the conviction that they were the 'one in the right!'

[SIAMBLUE]

I come across these a lot on the A13 normally, i sit about a cars length off their nearside bumper and match their speed obviously if i am not in a hurry, if i am in a hurry i to do the across all of the lanes manouvere, most people are oblivious about traffic around them,

Gary.

[XC60MY12]

but hell they're saving £250,000 a year in Diesel that's all they're worried about.

Could help to save your job and a few others :)

[weble]

Could help to save your job and a few others :)

Very true. I work in Dairy and we have to stay cheaper than the compertition to keep the big contracts

[Rustee]

I agree, don't insist on your rites when driving...

[Bill Edmondson]

http://www.lum.co.uk/mloc/

[silverfoxcc]

I read somewhere on another forum is to do a doughnut on these people. this works best on a near empty mway so the maximum can be got from it. the record ,so far, is 5 before the message was received.

1) one drive normally
2) on approaching MLOC, doing less than speed limit, indicate to go round in a safe manner and pull back into lane 1
3) drop your speed slightly so he catches and overtakes
4) if driver does not go into l1 following his overtake go to 2 and repeat

not that i condone this but he time i did it (2 cycles) it was fun

[Marty Dolomite]

I used to find flashing the blue lights made people pull over:thumbs_up:

[dazlewis1970]

This is one of those things people care about for no real reason. I have good lane discipline and if I am in lane 1 and come up to some one in the middle lane I overtake and get on with my journey/life. It is unlikely having to move to the overtaking lane (or as I like to call it - the fast lane) will have been the worst thing that happened to me that day. A lukewarm cup of tea is more annoying Let it go y'all. Life's too short.

[XC60MY12]

I read somewhere on another forum is to do a doughnut on these people. this works best on a near empty mway so the maximum can be got from it. the record ,so far, is 5 before the message was received.

1) one drive normally
2) on approaching MLOC, doing less than speed limit, indicate to go round in a safe manner and pull back into lane 1
3) drop your speed slightly so he catches and overtakes
4) if driver does not go into l1 following his overtake go to 2 and repeat

not that i condone this but he time i did it (2 cycles) it was fun

That way there are only two fools on the road :)

[pdrvolvo]

You will never cure this until you allow overtaking on the left



When i,m towing my caravan and i encounter one of these middle lane idiots i have no qualms about passing them on the inside.Usually as i draw level with them i look across and most are oblivious too me.

peter.

[banksy66]

Unfortunately All I can remember is that I saw it on BBC1 a few years ago. I can't even remember the programme name.

As far as clueless drivers are concerned, I accept that they are like that and make appropriate allowances for their stupidity. After all, it takes (at least) two vehicles to be involved in a crash... and I don't want to be in a crash - there are too many people die with the conviction that they were the 'one in the right!'

It was either "So you think you're a good driver" or a very early edition of Top Gear. I think it goes back to late 90s/early00s iirc. I remember seeing it at the time

[XC60MY12]

When i,m towing my caravan and i encounter one of these middle lane idiots i have no qualms about passing them on the inside.Usually as i draw level with them i look across and most are oblivious too me.

peter.

So whose fault would it be if, being oblivious, they pulled over and hit you?

[Bendolfc]

Theirs as undertaking is not illegal and when changing Lane you are expected to check were you are moving to is clear.

[XC60MY12]

Not sure your insurance company would agree. Staying in the middle lane is not illegal either; plus it does not, in itself, create a potentially dangerous situation, which overtaking on the left does.

Do you really want to risk your and your family's safety to prove a point that, by your own admission, most are oblivious to?

[volvorocks]

Not sure your insurance company would agree. Staying in the middle lane is not illegal either; plus it does not, in itself, create a potentially dangerous situation, which overtaking on the left does.

Do you really want to risk your and your family's safety to prove a point that, by your own admission, most are oblivious to?


Not illegal, although an offence of due consideration....?

[XC60MY12]

Not illegal, although an offence of due consideration....?

So are two people being thoughtless and inconsiderate better than one?

[volvorocks]

So are two people being thoughtless and inconsiderate better than one?

Undertaker could find a charge of dangerous, or due care whilst hogger may face a due consideration.

(passing on the left may also give rise to the use of an undertaker! - passing/undertaker...!) ;)

[XC60MY12]

Undertaker could find a charge of dangerous, or due care whilst hogger may face a due consideration.

(passing on the left may also give rise to the use of an undertaker! - passing/undertaker...!) ;)

My point precisely.

[Bendolfc]

Passing on the left will not get you done for anything unless you are driving like a **** changing lanes to the inside for the sole reason to pass. In fact if you are towing on a 3 Lane motorway then passing on the inside is the only legal way to pass.

[Dibble]

Passing on the left will not get you done for anything unless you are driving like a **** changing lanes to the inside for the sole reason to pass. In fact if you are towing on a 3 Lane motorway then passing on the inside is the only legal way to pass.

I wouldn't risk it. It is an offence to pass on the left and you would be prosecuted while the person who causes it gets away with it. They are overtaking lanes and not 'fast lanes' and usually in this country we are required to overtake on the right. The people who hog the middle/right hand lanes are totally out of order and why should everyone else be held up because they either don't know the rules or are too idle to comply with the rules. Who teaches them?
They do it because they get away with it.

[XC60MY12]

Passing on the left will not get you done for anything unless you are driving like a **** changing lanes to the inside for the sole reason to pass. In fact if you are towing on a 3 Lane motorway then passing on the inside is the only legal way to pass.

I can see how that is frustrating. Some would say serves you right for towing a caravan. I wouldn't be so insensitive :D

[Mr Sam]

When all is said and done, do you know how much time you are losing by being held up by a CLOD?

I saw a film on tv done (with police permission) involving three cars over about (I think) a 24 mile stretch of motorway.

Driver 1 drove like maniac to get to the destination services as quickly as possibly
Driver 2 drove in accordance with the rules of the motorway
Driver 3 stayed in the 'Granny Lane"


Driver 1 reached the end of the slip road into the services just as Driver 2 came into the slip road.

Driver 3 came in about one-and-a-half minutes later.

'Nuff said?

was that with quentin whats his face i recal seeing it


thankfully i dont ofen go on motorways so what annoys me the most is people on B and even A roads that dither along at 40 on open straight roads, then carry on at 40 in villages

[XC60MY12]

was that with quentin whats his face i recal seeing it


thankfully i dont ofen go on motorways so what annoys me the most is people on B and even A roads that dither along at 40 on open straight roads, then carry on at 40 in villages

Oh yes, specially when you are trying to catch the ferry from Wemyss Bay to the isle of Bute! The limit on the road past Inverkip is 60 but, because it's near a built-up area, people assume it must be 30, so they drive at 40. Then, when it is 30, they still do 40.

Like your house, by the way; very impressive!

[baggy798]

40 is a nice speed to go at, isn't it. :D

[Bendolfc]

I wouldn't risk it. It is an offence to pass on the left and you would be prosecuted while the person who causes it gets away with it.

Really, I am quite curious as to what this offence is as there is no specific offence for undertaking.

[stevo48]

Highway Code rule 268 advises against undertaking: "Do not overtake on the left or move to a lane on your left to overtake." On other roads you can "only overtake on the left if the vehicle in front is signalling to turn right" (rule 163). On all roads, undertaking is permitted if the vehicles in the lane to the right are queueing and slow moving. Undertaking in an aggressive or reckless manner could be considered Careless Driving or more seriously Dangerous Driving, both of which are legally enforceable offences

[Moosejaw]

Highway Code rule 268 advises against undertaking: "Do not overtake on the left or move to a lane on your left to overtake." ........

Undertaking in an aggressive or reckless manner could be considered Careless Driving or more seriously Dangerous Driving, both of which are legally enforceable offences

Being picky, I'd point out that failure to observe the advice given in the Highway Code in itself isn't an offence, and as far as I'm aware there is no specific offence of overtaking on the left mainly due to the several caveats offered above.

You're right that doing so in an unsafe manner could lead to a charge of due care/careless driving, which is a points offence.

For what it's worth if I've spent the last few miles in lane 1 closing in on some middle lane dodderer who shows no inclination to move over I'll usually stay put and pass to his nearside rather than move 3 lanes over to the right and back again.

[stevo48]

Being picky, I'd point out that failure to observe the advice given in the Highway Code in itself isn't an offence, and as far as I'm aware there is no specific offence of overtaking on the left mainly due to the several caveats offered above.

You're right that doing so in an unsafe manner could lead to a charge of due care/careless driving, which is a points offence.

For what it's worth if I've spent the last few miles in lane 1 closing in on some middle lane dodderer who shows no inclination to move over I'll usually stay put and pass to his nearside rather than move 3 lanes over to the right and back again.

and that ^^^^ is quite acceptable, the law (police) say if you are in lane 1 and the car in lane two is at a lower speed than yourself it is ok to pass as long as you are staying in lane.
To 'undertake' dangerously is to deliberately switch lanes with the sole purpose of passing another car on the left side only then to switch back into the lane from which you originally came.

[XC60MY12]

and that ^^^^ is quite acceptable, the law (police) say if you are in lane 1 and the car in lane two is at a lower speed than yourself it is ok to pass as long as you are staying in lane.
To 'undertake' dangerously is to deliberately switch lanes with the sole purpose of passing another car on the left side only then to switch back into the lane from which you originally came.

That would make the police at odds with the highway code:

"268

Do not overtake on the left or move to a lane on your left to overtake. In congested conditions, where adjacent lanes of traffic are moving at similar speeds, traffic in left-hand lanes may sometimes be moving faster than traffic to the right. In these conditions you may keep up with the traffic in your lane even if this means passing traffic in the lane to your right."

This clearly does not give carte blanche to overtake on the inside. I understand the frustration if you are towing a caravan (or driving a lorry). If you are going to take the chance of passing on the nearside I would give a toot, or a flash of the lights to alert the other driver of your presence (but not aggressively).

[JimG]

Being picky, I'd point out that failure to observe the advice given in the Highway Code in itself isn't an offence, and as far as I'm aware there is no specific offence of overtaking on the left mainly due to the several caveats offered above.

You're right that doing so in an unsafe manner could lead to a charge of due care/careless driving, which is a points offence.

For what it's worth if I've spent the last few miles in lane 1 closing in on some middle lane dodderer who shows no inclination to move over I'll usually stay put and pass to his nearside rather than move 3 lanes over to the right and back again.

Quite right Moosejaw, and as Stevo48 eludes, we do use breaches of the Highway Code as evidence to support a prosecution for Careless/Dangerous driving. :thumbs_up:

I wish we could have the ability to issue FPNs for minor careless driving infractions. Controversial, I know, as its subjective, but I'm sure something could be worked out.

[960kg]

It is all very well driving how we want on the roads or Motorways but at the end of the day it is travelling safely which is paramount to all and different people drive there own way for different reasons.

I drive fast and will stay in the middle lane when too many lorries are conveying up the M20.

In the middle lane there is further space to go off the road if one gets a puncture or whatever

I look in my mirror all the time and if someone is going faster than me then i move over to the 1st lane until he has gone then move out again.

What about when coming up to passing junctions where the racer comes down the ramp to get in the 3rd lane as quick as possible if your in the 1st lane he probably won`t see you and bang

If you undertake you do it at your own risk as if the car pulls over as you go by then you are the fool and you are guilty of causing an accident

If someone rides the centre lane and i am coming up behind them i just wait until i can pull out and go by, what is wrong with that! if they are on the speed limit then just wait as you would wait in the 1st lane.

We can all say how we drive and members will always disagree with how the other drives but at the end of the day i drive my car as a car and not as a travelling disco with thumping bass or use it as a cafe eating sandwiches or drinking pop, i have seen drivers shaving, putting make up on, combing there hair, good luck to them but the law of averages will eventually catch them up, but then they will only blame the berk they hit and blaming the accident on them but will never admit it that they were in the wrong.

Sadly we are all Human Beings and animals don`t treat there own the way we do!

[Steve and his 244]

I absolutely hate middle laners. One of my number one pet hates, and also people in the outside lane that span ridiculous gaps in the middle lane without pulling over to let the traffic by.

At the moment my travel to work on the M62 is 90% 50mph average speed cameras, but i know you can get away with about 57mph on the speedo safely (speedo inaccuracy, and the 10%+2 rule makes that safe) but sooooo often you get an outside lane hogger, more often than not in a poser car, that sits at what is exactly 50mph on my speedo when the middle lane is free.

Also, when i come across a middle laner, I sometimes like to prove a point when the motorway is clear - cross over to lane 3, overtake, then pull back over to lane 2 then lane 1. I like to think im teaching them, but rarely does it seem to work.

I find it slightly amusing but also slightly annoying that me in my 20 year old vw polo 1.3 can drive better than 90% of UK car motorway drivers, and that most people in fancy cars like range rovers, X5s, XC90s, minis etc that are presumably half interested in cars and their driving!

One other thing that annoys me in town centres, is taxi drivers that quite clearly dont know which lane to be in! I mean, in a town centre in which they work, they should stand out above the rest and be teaching the rest of us how to drive!

[Bill_56]

I'll add my voice to the consensus that lane-hogging is just wrong. That said, I'll muddy the waters just a smidgen by pointing out that there are some occasions, other than overtaking, when it is appropriate to use the outer lanes...

...That is, when you have the road to yourself, and the road ahead bends such that visibility is significantly impaired . There are some sections of M74 for example, where driving in the right hand lane considerably extends visibility on left hand bends, and similarly lane 1 extends visibility in right hand bends.

I stress such lane-hopping is only acceptable when you are certain it will not inconvenience or confuse other road users. I may be wrong, but I thought I remembered seeing it sanctioned by IAM, and maybe also in the 'Driving' manual (don't have a copy)?

One thing that always makes me smile (and dismays me) is to see somebody tearing down an empty motorway at a speed way over the limit, and refusing to deviate from lane 3. They invariably remain glued to lane 3 even on right hand bends, when lane 1 would be a far safer place to be (longer visibility) at such speeds.

[stevo48]

Also, when i come across a middle laner, I sometimes like to prove a point when the motorway is clear - cross over to lane 3, overtake, then pull back over to lane 2 then lane 1. I like to think im teaching them, but rarely does it seem to work.

I find it slightly amusing but also slightly annoying that me in my 20 year old vw polo 1.3 can drive better than 90% of UK car motorway drivers, and that most people in fancy cars like range rovers, X5s, XC90s, minis etc that are presumably half interested in cars and their driving!




I don't want to p#ss on your bonfire steve but what makes you think for one minute that someone (yourself) who has only been driving for a relatively short period of time can drive as well as or better than the majority of (probably) older and more seasoned drivers than yourself?

You also like to "think" you are teaching the afore mentioned drivers how to drive on the motorway????? May I politely suggest you concentrate on your OWN driving rather than trying to "teach" other road users how to drive/behave. :)

[volvorocks]

If someone rides the centre lane and i am coming up behind them i just wait until i can pull out and go by, what is wrong with that! if they are on the speed limit then just wait as you would wait in the 1st lane.



Nothing wrong with you waiting patiently then overtaking in lane 3.

Thing is the lane 2 hogger is driving with no respect or consideration for others and that is the real reason that people approaching from behind are so annoyed by it.

BTW centre lane hoggers cause traffic jams,effectively causing 3 lane roads to become basically single carriageways as everyone ends up bunching in the 3rd lane,which has a ripple effect eventually bring traffic miles behind to a stand still.

Ever wondered sometime when one is stuck in traffic on the motoprway which then miraculously clears and there seems no reason for the jam in the first place?

Regards

[Steve and his 244]

I don't want to p#ss on your bonfire steve but what makes you think for one minute that someone (yourself) who has only been driving for a relatively short period of time can drive as well as or better than the majority of (probably) older and more seasoned drivers than yourself?

You also like to "think" you are teaching the afore mentioned drivers how to drive on the motorway????? May I politely suggest you concentrate on your OWN driving rather than trying to "teach" other road users how to drive/behave. :)

Well, i dont mean it in a big headed way, but quite frankly, the proof is in what i see (okay, so 90% may be an overestimation)

And I never lose concentration on my own driving. In actual fact im doing the correct thing, because if i have crept up on a middle laner, then i need to overtake them in the outside lane otherwise that would be undertaking (I know this is a slightly grey area on this thread which i am reading with interest)

[jamesferns]

Well, i dont mean it in a big headed way, but quite frankly, the proof is in what i see (okay, so 90% may be an overestimation)

And I never lose concentration on my own driving. In actual fact im doing the correct thing, because if i have crept up on a middle laner, then i need to overtake them in the outside lane otherwise that would be undertaking (I know this is a slightly grey area on this thread which i am reading with interest)


"Never lose concentration" thats some claim sunshine

[Moosejaw]

If you are going to take the chance of passing on the nearside I would give a toot, or a flash of the lights to alert the other driver of your presence (but not aggressively).

That's the very last thing I'd be doing to be honest.

If someone has been bumbling along in the middle lane, mind in neutral, listening to Mogadon FM for the last 20 miles the chances of them suddenly deciding to move over just as I'm passing are about a million to one*, if you come up behind them flashing your lights and tooting, you'll wake them up and then God knows what they'll do.
*Not actual odds, consult bookmaker/Karma/Flying Spaghetti Monster/God/Allah etc....

It's not something I'll do often, but there are times where I'll decide it's easier and safer to carry on at the same speed in the same lane and not try to merge with two lanes of successively faster traffic and then back again just to get past some numpty doing 60 in the wrong lane, but I don't get worked up about it.
There are far worse examples of bad driving than not taking the correct road position.

[XC60MY12]

That's the very last thing I'd be doing to be honest.

If someone has been bumbling along in the middle lane, mind in neutral, listening to Mogadon FM for the last 20 miles the chances of them suddenly deciding to move over just as I'm passing are about a million to one*, if you come up behind them flashing your lights and tooting, you'll wake them up and then God knows what they'll do.
*Not actual odds, consult bookmaker/Karma/Flying Spaghetti Monster/God/Allah etc....

It's not something I'll do often, but there are times where I'll decide it's easier and safer to carry on at the same speed in the same lane and not try to merge with two lanes of successively faster traffic and then back again just to get past some numpty doing 60 in the wrong lane, but I don't get worked up about it.
There are far worse examples of bad driving than not taking the correct road position.


Me too. But if I were going to make a potentially dangerous manoeuvre I'd let them know. Your chances of winning the lottery jackpot are about 14 million to one (actual odds) but people do it twice a week.

[Ralphead]

You are not allowed to drive on a motorway without a full licence so no-one taking driving lessons will go on one. After you have a licence there are no more mandatory lessons. You can opt to take pass plus but not many do.

My rambling point is that people aren't taught how to drive on motorways. You'd think common sense would make more people use their initiative and find a way learn themselves but I guess that's optimistic. There's no point to rules of the road if everyone's driving according to their own interpretation of them.

I wasn't taught how to drive properly, parallel parking, road markings and three point turns, great. But car handling, speed/distance perception, reading the road. Nothing, nada. I'd been riding bike and driving things off road for years so..
Q: What do I do when I have to stop on mud? A: ABS.
Q: What about if I run out of grip in a corner? A: ESP and ABS.
But I drive a Vauxhall Viva. Hmm.

It's just not good enough, all the safety aids in modern cars are a waste if the people who are going to use them aren't taught to do so in a way which is safe.

[tt82]

I find it slightly amusing but also slightly annoying that me in my 20 year old vw polo 1.3 can drive better than 90% of UK car motorway drivers, and that most people in fancy cars like range rovers, X5s, XC90s, minis etc that are presumably half interested in cars and their driving!


I don't want to p#ss on your bonfire steve but what makes you think for one minute that someone (yourself) who has only been driving for a relatively short period of time can drive as well as or better than the majority of (probably) older and more seasoned drivers than yourself?

Tbh Stevo, I think young Steve has a very good point. Having undergone driver training recently he is probably far more aware of the rules for driving.

Indeed if a section of society or this forum had to repeat the the driving test. Young Steve is more likely to pass than the older seasoned drivers, those who developed bad habits and think they know everything when in fact they don't.

Experience is extremely valuable but if you have been doing the same thing for 30 years but been doing wrong all the time then it doesn't count for much.

[tt82]

So whose fault would it be if, being oblivious, they pulled over and hit you?

Not sure your insurance company would agree. Staying in the middle lane is not illegal either; plus it does not, in itself, create a potentially dangerous situation, which overtaking on the left does.

Do you really want to risk your and your family's safety to prove a point that, by your own admission, most are oblivious to?

Lets be realistic here. Most MLOC or CLOD's are only aware of the lane they are in and the traffic directly in front of them. I've seen convoys of them in the middle lane on otherwise deserted motorways, usually following far too closely and dangerously. The most amusing are those who catch other traffic in the middle lane and due to poor driving, have to brake as they approach them instead of slowing down early or moving to the outside lane to overtake. Sometimes they will follow for a short while before realising there is a 3rd lane they can use to overtake. Others will stay there behind that car until it moves out of their way and then they accelerate back to their desired speed.

There is very little chance they will move left on you unless you are approaching the junction at which they wish to exit. Personally when I undertake them I only do it if I have the hard shoulder is clear, then I have room to avoid them if they did start to move other.

Lets not forget though that your are obliged to check - using mirrors and looking over your shoulder - when changing lanes regardless of the direction. If they did move over on you then that would be a second offence of driving without due care and attention.

[volvorocks]

Thing is the lane 2 hogger is driving with no respect or consideration for others and that is the real reason that people approaching from behind are so annoyed by it.



Further to my post above,from my experience,the reason people also get annoyed with centre lane hogs is that they take it personally. I try not to,although it is difficult.

I have previously carried out the "Steve and his 244" teaching procedure of overtaking and then returning to lane 1, (cmon havent we all ?) although notice it has little or no effect.So I do not bother with that.I simply ignore them, and overtake as usual. I have found there is not much point being a "one man self appointed police force"!

Thing is, apart from the lack of respect and consideration that centre lane hoggers have for others, I think some hog the lane due to ignorance of the rules,fear of being stuck in lane 1 and "never being able to pull out", and just being blissfully unaware in general. (not good!)

However some centre laners are hypocritical. Try this.

You have been following a centre laner at a safe distance for a few miles on a clear motorway.Overtake centre laner and pull back in to centre lane in front of them (normally not dangerously!).Slow down a bit and see whether said centre laner is cross with you for now being a centre laner.You may find centre laner flashes you or becomes annoyed.This is very irritating as they think its ok for them to centre lane yet no one else.Another result of doing this is that you may find centre laner slows down to your speed once you have overtaken them and opulled in in front of them.This indicates that they may be fearful of motorway driving and changing lanes and not out "to get you"..!!

However should they be on the motorway in the first place???

Regards

[XC60MY12]

Tbh Stevo, I think young Steve has a very good point. Having undergone driver training recently he is probably far more aware of the rules for driving.

Indeed if a section of society or this forum had to repeat the the driving test. Young Steve is more likely to pass than the older seasoned drivers, those who developed bad habits and think they know everything when in fact they don't.

Experience is extremely valuable but if you have been doing the same thing for 30 years but been doing wrong all the time then it doesn't count for much.

Couldn't have put it better myself. However young Steve will soon realise that his attempt to "teach" other drivers is futile and does nothing to improve the situation.

[XC60MY12]

Lets be realistic here. Most MLOC or CLOD's are only aware of the lane they are in and the traffic directly in front of them. I've seen convoys of them in the middle lane on otherwise deserted motorways, usually following far too closely and dangerously. The most amusing are those who catch other traffic in the middle lane and due to poor driving, have to brake as they approach them instead of slowing down early or moving to the outside lane to overtake. Sometimes they will follow for a short while before realising there is a 3rd lane they can use to overtake. Others will stay there behind that car until it moves out of their way and then they accelerate back to their desired speed.

There is very little chance they will move left on you unless you are approaching the junction at which they wish to exit. Personally when I undertake them I only do it if I have the hard shoulder is clear, then I have room to avoid them if they did start to move other.

Lets not forget though that your are obliged to check - using mirrors and looking over your shoulder - when changing lanes regardless of the direction. If they did move over on you then that would be a second offence of driving without due care and attention.

Given what you've said above do you really want to rely on them doing that? I don't care about whether they commit an offence, just my own safety and level of driving. Why take the risk of having to swerve on to the hard shoulder because you can't be bothered to do it properly, or to make a point that will be wasted on them?

[XC60MY12]

Further to my post above,from my experience,the reason people also get annoyed with centre lane hogs is that they take it personally. I try not to,although it is difficult.

I have previously carried out the "Steve and his 244" teaching procedure of overtaking and then returning to lane 1, (cmon havent we all ?) although notice it has little or no effect.So I do not bother with that.I simply ignore them, and overtake as usual. I have found there is not much point being a "one man self appointed police force"!

Thing is, apart from the lack of respect and consideration that centre lane hoggers have for others, I think some hog the lane due to ignorance of the rules,fear of being stuck in lane 1 and "never being able to pull out", and just being blissfully unaware in general. (not good!)

However some centre laners are hypocritical. Try this.

You have been following a centre laner at a safe distance for a few miles on a clear motorway.Overtake centre laner and pull back in to centre lane in front of them (normally not dangerously!).Slow down a bit and see whether said centre laner is cross with you for now being a centre laner.You may find centre laner flashes you or becomes annoyed.This is very irritating as they think its ok for them to centre lane yet no one else.Another result of doing this is that you may find centre laner slows down to your speed once you have overtaken them and opulled in in front of them.This indicates that they may be fearful of motorway driving and changing lanes and not out "to get you"..!!

However should they be on the motorway in the first place???

Regards

Should you, VR, if you play silly games like this? I'm quite sure you are not recommending others to do this, merely illustrating your point. You make a valid and useful point in your second paragraph. Unfortunately it risks being obscured by the rest, IMHO.

[volvorocks]

Should you, VR, if you play silly games like this? I'm quite sure you are not recommending others to do this, merely illustrating your point. You make a valid and useful point in your second paragraph. Unfortunately it risks being obscured by the rest, IMHO.

No,I do not play silly games XC60Fan,I would have thought you know better than to suggest that, and yes I know you refer to the "slow down procedure" here,that I outlined, but I willl say this ( just for general reading)

To travel in the first lane at a speed that becomes apparent that one needs to overtake a centre lane hogger,the correct procedure is to pull into lane 2,then pull into lane 3,then back into lane 2,then finally back into lane 1. This is CORRECT procedure,and should indicate to the centre lane hogger the error of their ways.

Regards the slow down in front of a centre lane hogger,no I do not do this,I have better things to do..!! It has been done though!

Road rage has always intrigued me and I have found it interesting to study behaviours giving rise to such - Why people get angry in the first place,with what they get angry, and why they then do what they do! A normally calm collective person can change and become an aggressive thug when behind the wheel and this can be due to what they perceive as a lack of respect, bullying, invasion of personal space by and from others etc etc.

Same goes for lane hogging.People get angry with them and take it personally.To study a lane hogger I cannot realistically pull them over and interview them..lol..so it is interesting to note the reaction when one slows down in front of them (not in a sudden or dangerous way,simply a progressive slow down). Not something I do nor recommend,just pointing out (in a hidden way I suppose,if you read between the lines of the suggestion) that whilst centre lane hogging is annoying,its best to ignore and understand that centre lane hogging is not a "direct personal attack" on another motorist!

Regards

[TurboZutek]

I'd like to see the MLOG taken out and given a solid kick in the dick or a good punch in the tits (depending on gender).

/That'll sort the problem! :thumbs_up:

Chris...

[XC60MY12]

Of course I know exactly what you mean, VR, but the words "try this" caught my attention. I also know that you think a lot about a) what you read, b) what you post. Unfortunately not all others do, so thank you for taking the trouble to clarify and for not misconstruing my comment.

[volvorocks]

Of course I know exactly what you mean, VR, but the words "try this" caught my attention. I also know that you think a lot about a) what you read, b) what you post. Unfortunately not all others do, so thank you for taking the trouble to clarify and for not misconstruing my comment.

Thanks XC60Fan

Yes I agree "try this" appears to be a call to action and could have been worded better by me, perhaps along the lines of "imagine this"..!!!!

Regards

EDIT:
Actually not "could have been worded better" - instead "should have been worded better".....I am slipping..lol..!

[XC60MY12]

Of course I know exactly what you mean, VR, but the words "try this" caught my attention. I also know that you think a lot about a) what you read, b) what you post. Unfortunately not all others do, so thank you for taking the trouble to clarify and for not misconstruing my comment.

I'd like to see the MLOG taken out and given a solid kick in the dick or a good punch in the tits (depending on gender).

/That'll sort the problem! :thumbs_up:

Chris...


@volvorocks. I think this proves my point quite nicely.

[Anadinolin]

if you have a middle laner, flash them once or twice and they usually move over if you cannot be bothered to go round them...you usually get the odd d8cks though that try and get in your way once you have flashed them

according to my ADTI you can undertake at the speedlimit of the road you are traveling on without any rebuttal from the police or insurers, if they swerve into you it is their own fault for not being aware of what is around them and that is then deemed as driving without due care and attention and its normally becuase they are on "autopilot" - ps hard shoulder is an emergency lane, which includes allowance for evasive action

i undertake at the speedlimit quite often, tbh if you cannot be bothered to go round the middle lane hog then you may aswell put up with it, because they arent going to change just on your say so. they have to be given a reason as to why its wrong, or the police nab them and even then they probably wont change their ways

its annoying but hey theres 3-4 lanes that you can use now.

[Axionknight]

I'd ban the whole lot of 'em. Swines!

But I'm a reasonable guy like that, *shrug*

[TurboZutek]

@volvorocks. I think this proves my point quite nicely.

Which point? An inability to parse humour or something else I've missed?

Chris...

[XC60MY12]

if you have a middle laner, flash them once or twice and they usually move over if you cannot be bothered to go round them...you usually get the odd d8cks though that try and get in your way once you have flashed them

according to my ADTI you can undertake at the speedlimit of the road you are traveling on without any rebuttal from the police or insurers, if they swerve into you it is their own fault for not being aware of what is around them and that is then deemed as driving without due care and attention and its normally becuase they are on "autopilot" - ps hard shoulder is an emergency lane, which includes allowance for evasive action

i undertake at the speedlimit quite often, tbh if you cannot be bothered to go round the middle lane hog then you may aswell put up with it, because they arent going to change just on your say so. they have to be given a reason as to why its wrong, or the police nab them and even then they probably wont change their ways

its annoying but hey theres 3-4 lanes that you can use now.

Why risk it? OK you can say it's their fault but is that any consolation? I'd rather go by the Highway Code than somebody else's say-so.

[tt82]

Given what you've said above do you really want to rely on them doing that? I don't care about whether they commit an offence, just my own safety and level of driving. Why take the risk of having to swerve on to the hard shoulder because you can't be bothered to do it properly, or to make a point that will be wasted on them?

Let me give you a real situation as an example.

A few weeks ago when the snow hit, I was travelling up the M6 from Stoke to Manchester in the snow. The outer 3rd lane was not being used much, except occasionly in periods of heavy traffic by me and my father who I was following. (I had winter tyres fitted to all wheels, my father on his front wheels.) On our way we encountered a white XC60 - anybody we know????? - which was hogging the middle lane and travelling slower than the speed both me and my father felt comfortable with.

My father was the car in front, he undertook the XC60 and carried on. Due to the conditions we felt safer travelling in convoy and thus I needed to pass the XC60 as well. I was aware that being undertook could have 2 actions on the XC60 driver -

1) They would be alerted by my fathers manouvre and realise they were needlessly in the middle lane. They could have then moved over to lane 1 which could have caused them to move over on me accidently if I too attempted to undertake them.

2) They would be alerted by my fathers manouvre and become incensed by it. Any attempt by me to follow and undertake them could have been met with a deliberate move into lane 1 to block me.

So I was forced to correctly move into lane 3 from lane 1, into a lane covered with slush which was fairly tricky to drive on in order to pass them. There was also ruts in the slush on lanes 1 & 2 where the wheel tracks had cleared the snow. Anybody who has drove in these conditions knows that it is when crossing the ruts that it is the most dangerous part of driving in the snow, beside driving in the snow/slush covered lane 3.




Of course I did not need to do that but if I was to obey all driving rules and be a courteous motorist what options were open to me. Would flashing and pipping my horn be seen as aggressive? If I followed them in lane 2 I would then just be simply as guilty as them of middle hogging. So all I could do is follow at a safe distance in Lane 1. So the end result is I would be delayed in getting home by the poor or inconsiderte driving of 1 person.

So I ask, what others would have done in my situation?







ps. XC60 person still didn't move over when I returned to lane 1 infront of them. Wether that is through inconsideration or lack of awarness we'll never know. Bl00dy Volvo drivers. :wac_realmad:

PS. having just seen this thread - Worst accident ever (http://www.volvoforums.org.uk/showthread.php?t=146673) - the road conditions were similar and being forced to change lanes could have led to a similar loss of control.

[XC60MY12]

Which point? An inability to parse humour or something else I've missed?

Chris...

Of course I can parse humour; it's a noun. Didn't see it in your post.

[Harvey1512]

In your position I would have followed your father and gone up the inside. You ended up putting yourself potentially in danger by going to the third lane (this is not a criticism by the way). Your priority is your own safety which is why your father went in lane one and not the slushy lane three.

I never feel 100% comfortable going up the inside lane, a very British thing I think, but there are times when it is safer and that is the key. This for me is one of those instances.

[XC60MY12]

Let me give you a real situation as an example.

A few weeks ago when the snow hit, I was travelling up the M6 from Stoke to Manchester in the snow. The outer 3rd lane was not being used much, except occasionly in periods of heavy traffic by me and my father who I was following. (I had winter tyres fitted to all wheels, my father on his front wheels.) On our way we encountered a white XC60 - anybody we know????? - which was hogging the middle lane and travelling slower than the speed both me and my father felt comfortable with.

My father was the car in front, he undertook the XC60 and carried on. Due to the conditions we felt safer travelling in convoy and thus I needed to pass the XC60 as well. I was aware that being undertook could have 2 actions on the XC60 driver -

1) They would be alerted by my fathers manouvre and realise they were needlessly in the middle lane. They could have then moved over to lane 1 which could have caused them to move over on me accidently if I too attempted to undertake them.

2) They would be alerted by my fathers manouvre and become incensed by it. Any attempt by me to follow and undertake them could have been met with a deliberate move into lane 1 to block me.

So I was forced to correctly move into lane 3 from lane 1, into a lane covered with slush which was fairly tricky to drive on in order to pass them. There was also ruts in the slush on lanes 1 & 2 where the wheel tracks had cleared the snow. Anybody who has drove in these conditions knows that it is when crossing the ruts that it is the most dangerous part of driving in the snow, beside driving in the snow/slush covered lane 3.




Of course I did not need to do that but if I was to obey all driving rules and be a courteous motorist what options were open to me. Would flashing and pipping my horn be seen as aggressive? If I followed them in lane 2 I would then just be simply as guilty as them of middle hogging. So all I could do is follow at a safe distance in Lane 1. So the end result is I would be delayed in getting home by the poor or inconsiderte driving of 1 person.

So I ask, what others would have done in my situation?







ps. XC60 person still didn't move over when I returned to lane 1 infront of them. Wether that is through inconsideration or lack of awarness we'll never know. Bl00dy Volvo drivers. :wac_realmad:

PS. having just seen this thread - Worst accident ever (http://www.volvoforums.org.uk/showthread.php?t=146673) - the road conditions were similar and being forced to change lanes could have led to a similar loss of control.

In those exceptional circumstances I agree with you.

[Anadinolin]

Why risk it? OK you can say it's their fault but is that any consolation? I'd rather go by the Highway Code than somebody else's say-so.

thats fair enough, i wouldnt argue with your decision, because thats something that you do not wish to chance. Im only going on what iv been told by someone who should (in theory) know better than me and would/should not lead me into trouble - wouldnt make them a good ADTI would it? :) not to say its legal, but iv found that police are normally ok with it and never tugged me when iv undertook them on the m-way doing the speed limit of the road, as long as it is safe to do so, i see no problems :)

the hard shoulder is normally there to cater for their poor observational skills provided you make sure that the hard shoulder is clear for yourself, and if you dont want to chance it, overtake on the right or just hang back behind the MLH on the left lane if you wish you can remind them by flashing once or twice and waiting for a reaction

[TurboZutek]

Of course I can parse humour; it's a noun. Didn't see it in your post.

Then you may have lived in Johnstone for far too long. It's a common problem and why I moved from there a few years ago! ;-)


ps. XC60 person still didn't move over when I returned to lane 1 infront of them. Wether that is through inconsideration or lack of awarness we'll never know. Bl00dy Volvo drivers. :wac_realmad:

That's really dangerous and your post is a prime example of exactly why I'd endorse a government backed ****-punching programme for the type of driver you mention.

Feckless, ignorant, selfish, putting others at risk, dangerous morons. Sad thing is, the Police don't care and there are plenty of people who'll stick up for their behaviour on forums, so what can you do?

In those exceptional circumstances I agree with you.

There's nothing exceptional about it, the exact same risks (changing lanes for no reason to avoid one idiot) and all the associated risks STILL exist in perfect conditions. It's less unsafe, but it's still unsafe.

Chris...

[Anadinolin]

Then you may have lived in Johnstone for far too long. It's a common problem and why I moved from there a few years ago! ;-)



That's really dangerous and your post is a prime example of exactly why I'd endorse a government backed ****-punching programme for the type of driver you mention.

Feckless, ignorant, selfish, putting others at risk, dangerous morons. Sad thing is, the Police don't care and there are plenty of people who'll stick up for their behaviour on forums, so what can you do?

Chris...

police dont care? you should take a evening or early morning drive down the m11, they'd soon book or warn you for floating like a pansie in the middle lane

[loki_the_glt]

I've just finished looking through this thread and am disappointed that no-one has identified the REAL reason why MLBs and RLBs (Middle Lane Bandits and Right Lane Bandits) act as they do: the materials used to surface the inside lane have been scientifically proven to rot car tyres. These people want to keep their tyres pristine (it's a safety thing) so minimise their exposure to the inside lane.

[andy_d]

roof box
with twin .50cal's
zero em to 200yards
,,,What MLOC w'nker?

and its not like the 1/2 inch holes in the road will make the surface any harsher than they are already,,,

[XC60MY12]

Then you may have lived in Johnstone for far too long. It's a common problem and why I moved from there a few years ago! ;-)

But we do know the meaning of "parse" :)

That's really dangerous and your post is a prime example of exactly why I'd endorse a government backed ****-punching programme for the type of driver you mention.

Feckless, ignorant, selfish, putting others at risk, dangerous morons. Sad thing is, the Police don't care and there are plenty of people who'll stick up for their behaviour on forums, so what can you do?

Chris...

So not really meant as a joke then.

[XC60MY12]

thats fair enough, i wouldnt argue with your decision, because thats something that you do not wish to chance. Im only going on what iv been told by someone who should (in theory) know better than me and would/should not lead me into trouble - wouldnt make them a good ADTI would it? :) not to say its legal, but iv found that police are normally ok with it and never tugged me when iv undertook them on the m-way doing the speed limit of the road, as long as it is safe to do so, i see no problems :)

the hard shoulder is normally there to cater for their poor observational skills provided you make sure that the hard shoulder is clear for yourself, and if you dont want to chance it, overtake on the right or just hang back behind the MLH on the left lane if you wish you can remind them by flashing once or twice and waiting for a reaction

I agree, it wouldn't. Neither would recommending something potentially dangerous, just because it's not illegal. Smoking's not illegal but I wouldn't recommend it as it may damage your health.

[Anadinolin]

sheep drivers are the worst though :)

found a webby here: http://www.howmotorwayswork.co.uk/sheep.htm

XC60, im happy to take that risk :) as i say, there is always the hard shoulder to fall back on hehe

[XC60MY12]

sheep drivers are the worst though :)

found a webby here: http://www.howmotorwayswork.co.uk/sheep.htm

Love this Anadinolin! I'm going to stop trying to preach to the unconvertible (cries of hurrah!) and spend the rest of the day reading it.

[TurboZutek]

police dont care? you should take a evening or early morning drive down the m11, they'd soon book or warn you for floating like a pansie in the middle lane

Not here mate, I've never seen anyone being pulled for sitting in the middle lane; even when it's super obvious. Police drive on by. I've also never seen anyone being pulled over for failing to indicate on roundabouts (another dangerous one) again, they drive by.

Go a few MPH over the speed limit and you'll be on the hard shoulder quick smart though.

Just my own personal observations in and around Glasgow and Paisley, there might be official statistics which would tell you for sure.

But we do know the meaning of "parse" :)

But perhaps not as it applies to Psycholinguistics? :party:

So not really meant as a joke then.

That too, was a joke. A little satirical hyperbole, if you will. (Sometimes known as 'a wind up')

Although, now that you mention it, the plan possibly does have some practical (real world) merit. Like burning your hand in the fire, a good fist to the dick does often have that magical 'you won't do that again' educational touch - and it's how I learnt many valuable lessons growing up.

Chris...

[XC60MY12]

But perhaps not as it applies to Psycholinguistics? :party:

So it was you who put the psycho into psycholinguistics?

Although, now that you mention it, the plan possibly does have some practical (real world) merit. Like burning your hand in the fire, a good fist to the dick does often have that magical 'you won't do that again' educational touch - and it's how I learnt many valuable lessons growing up.

Chris...

Did you spend a lot of time doing this as a youngster?

[TurboZutek]

Did you spend a lot of time doing this as a youngster?

We all did, they even made a film about it!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yQKAydHA4J4

:thumbs_up:

[XC60MY12]

We all did, they even made a film about it!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yQKAydHA4J4

:thumbs_up:

Oh. Not the kind I thought you indulged in ;)

[tt82]

Love this Anadinolin! I'm going to stop trying to preach to the unconvertible (cries of hurrah!) and spend the rest of the day reading it.

Hurrah!!!!


Only joking. You do have balid points in your arguement and I thank you for voicing your opinion. Just because I dont agree with you doesn't mean I'm not willing to listen to your point of view.






Btw, is your XC60 white by any chance? :wac_wink:

[XC60MY12]

Hurrah!!!!


Only joking. You do have balid points in your arguement and I thank you for voicing your opinion. Just because I dont agree with you doesn't mean I'm not willing to listen to your point of view.


You sir, are a gentleman.



Btw, is your XC60 white by any chance? :wac_wink:

Ha effin ha!!

[TurboZutek]

Oh. Not the kind I thought you indulged in ;)

I have nothing against it if it's your thing man, but no, not that way! :thumbs_up:

[Dibble]

Really, I am quite curious as to what this offence is as there is no specific offence for undertaking.

Hi Ben, Unfortunately I no longer have access to the precise legislation which covers this subject but it would be covered by careless driving - Section 3, RTA. We had a Procurator Fiscal in our Police area who wanted anyone being reported for undertaking to be reported for Section 2 RTA - Dangerous driving - and one motorcyclist was disqualified for six months.
On one occasion I was driving north on the Forth Road Bridge on patrol and there was a lengthy queue on the right hand lane (two lanes only). I could see cars passing the slower moving car at the head of the queue who was hogging the right hand lane and basically turning the A90/M90 into a single lane road. Eventually I managed to pull her in and she was totally unaware of the inconvenience and frustration she was causing.
She was left in no doubt as to what was required of her and tearfully she promised she would be more careful in future. Unlike England she could not be reported as I was unaccompanied.