They are already with the xc90 T8.

Not for me personally but I know a lot of people like hybrids.....they usually hate big suv's though.

Yes they will. Forthcoming EU legislation will force them too.

I disagree with that.

I don't mean to be argumentative but it will never happen.

You could also argue that that a smaller engine is constantly under strain, working hard in a big car(hence producing more pollution), where as the bigger bmw and audi diesels effortlessly waft around town.

The legislation has already been passed.

We will see if they stop making 3 litre V6 Diesels.

I'd bet everything I have they won't. Not a chance.

These hybrids will cost a fortune to repair a few years down the road.

Really? Some said that about the Prius but so far it has proven very reliable.

Really need to see some facts or is this just the crystal ball? The facts are out there about the Toyota Prius's reliability.

I think Volvo have been bold to adopt the 4cyl or less approach, I personally think the D4 VEA I have in my V40 is a great motor, fantastic performance and a decent range in the tank dues to its consumption.

The EGR issue in mine cost £345 to repair under warranty, I think in years to come these will be economical enough to repair by an independent.

The fact is we just do not know how the latest gen of cars will fair as second hand purchases in the future, if the second hand market in used cars just outside of warranty is anything to go by people are still confident in used Diesels of any brand.

I think the 2lt new engine is perfect for a V40....but should be nowhere near a XC90.

The 120d is a great little car, but I wouldn't want that engine in a 5 series or X5.

I think most buyers looking to spend £50k on a big SUV will think the same.

I predict big discounts within 12 months.

I appreciate your point on the Prius...but it isn't a big suv, will never go off road, and doesn't have over 350bhp like the T8.

With regard to any modern car. I wouldn't buy a expensive one out of manufacturers warranty. Risk of huge bills is too big.

I guess you've not heard of the Lexus RX 450h or the saloon GS 450h.
Both use a 3.5litre V6 petrol mated to an electric motor, kind of the Prius' big brother. The GS will cover 0-100km/h sub 6 seconds and on to a limited 155mph. How much more wil your V6 diesel give ?

Manufacturers have agreed to an average of 95g/km emissions by 2020, that is just the start. Granted V6 diesel is not your everyday car but they are going to have to sell an awful lot of Up and Polo models to keep the V6 diesel viable in a big two tonne truck or that truck is going to have to get serious in the gym and drop the weight.

I've heard of them but I'm not a fan of Lexus tbh. I would imagine both have huge repair bills. I've read the rx450 does 20 mpg.

Toyota have more experience than anyone in this area I suppose.

The BMW i8 caught my attention when it was launched, but the real world mpg is nowhere near what is claimed.

These cars just aren't for me. I prefer big engines, and IMHO opinion most buyers of big, expensive cars do.

The manufacturers always find a away around the regs and I don't think that will change.

I personally think hydrogen cells are a much better option than electric motors for the future.

I had a m3 that had electric throttle actuators at £1200 (£2400 for a pair) a go. They are made by Siemens and are a flawed design that fail and need replacing.

It continues to make money for Siemens and they have never corrected the fault.

I wonder how many of these components for hybrids will be made by external companies?

Edit* quick google search shows inverter failure is common on the rx400 and costs £4k to replace.

Granted a Toyota or Lexus are not everyones cup of tea.

The hybrid has been around for decades now, the first hit the roads in '93 I think it was. We'd have heard by now if there were major issues.

Inverters are about the only thing I have seen reported on them and its sometimes the water pump rather than the inverter itself that is the issue.
Granted, not a cheap fix but there again neither is a new D5 engine when the aux belt takes a reroute via the cam belt.

Garages will adapt to whatever tech comes along otherwise they will not survive.

You'll probably see more 3rd party companies coming to the fore when more manufacturers arrive. Volvo are there with the D6, Peugeot/Citroën have hybrids available, Ford are there now with the new Mondeo to name a few.

There's not much to do with the hybrid in my wife's car. It's a bit like a washing machine. It might need a new belt, the coolant will need replacing every few years otherwise not really much to do with an electric motor and a battery pack. Servicing quotes are no more expensive than for the standalone petrol.

I think hybrids have their place. Even if the battery argument (pollution they cause being made) is a fair one.

Hydrogen makes more sense to me as the long term solution.

It just upsets me that they have gone 4 cylinder with the xc90 (I couldn't afford a t8 in the spec I'd want anyway).

The car itself is stunning inside and out. No direct rival has a interior anywhere near as nice and the sound system is the best I've heard.

The 4 pot diesel is just wrong in that car. It's like putting one in a Rolls Royce (slight exaggeration :)).

Getting back on the original subject again.

Sure enough after the 2nd year service the Engine warning lights is still there.

Volvo Aberdeen (Arnold Clark) say they updated the software and it fixed the issue.
Personally I don't think they even checked the EGR

Any way spoke to the head tech engineer and he took the car away for another check.
Sure enough error codes refer the EGR error's so they will order up new parts.

2nd attempt to fix this issue.

To be fair to the guy he did say that cars that where fixed over 6 months ago are still having issues , but ones that where fixed under 6 months seem to be fixed , but as he say time will tell.

My real concern will be what happens at the end of the 3 year warranty
If the EGR faults are still there.
Will Volvo continue to try and fix them at there expense or will they expect customer to pay to fix the issues.

Repeated EGR faults after the three year warranty expires are an invitation for a smart Volvo-owning lawyer to start a legal action. I wonder what Volvo's defence will be ? They will have to open their internal files for legal and public scrutiny. Could be interesting.
Alternatively they will simply settle 'out of court' to save time, embarrassment and legal costs.

My new XC60 may be on its way to my dealer as I write this on holiday abroad. Despite receiving their assurances on this matter, and having had a long discussion with their lead tech guy when I said I was considering cancelling my order, I am once more asking myself why would I get involved with Volvo's technical problems?

On another post someone pointed out that it's clear how to avoid DPF issues but in this case it seems to strike at random without a clear relationship to driving style. The dealership said it seemed to only affect cars driven too gently. I don't know about the rest of you but I tend to drive an automatic differently to a manual ie constant, but quite gentle, throttle allowing the gearbox to use the torque. I very rarely need to use kickdown by suddenly flooring the throttle.

Edit* quick google search shows inverter failure is common on the rx400 and costs £4k to replace.[/QUOTE]

I have owned both Lexus RX300 and 400H cars, both were totally reliable and a luxurious drive.
The 400h has experienced just a few inverter failures but to their credit, Lexus issued a recall and any suspect ones (including mine) were changed free of charge.
The RX has grown too big for me now, and the XC60 sized NX has a very choppy ride and weedy engine.

V60 D4 64 plate amber check engine warning light reset twice within about 3 hrs and subsequent limp mode on the 1 day that we needed reliability - heading to airport on hols....

9 months old and nearly 13000 miles.

Volvo courtesy (Taggarts) nil points.

..........this post sums up the problem perfectly. Volvo should ooze reliability. The egr issues risk killing that brand value. However, for the time being my xc60 is fabulous since the last Clelands fix. Arianne.

My engine warning light has just come on again. My EGR etc was changed around 12,000 miles and I have now done 19,100. It will be very disappointing if this is happening a second time. Even more irritatiing as in the next two weeks I have some major miles to do and do not want to be worrying about my car or have to do them in a courtesy V40 rather than my chunky mile munching XC60.

We need to start making Volvo pay attention, get your car booked in ASAP call Volvo assist to come out and do a check they will get it booked in the next day for you, and make sure they give you an equivalent courtesy car. With my V40 the courtesy car was a fully loaded Mitsibushi ASX the second an alright Vauxhall Insignia, I also had my fuel paid for in the form of a cheque from Volvo HQ on the second fault, fuel was not covered the first time.

It's not acceptable to have this happen twice, my colleague has had his brand new BMW 340 touring arrive with a broken sunroof, he has had a fully loaded BMW X5 3.0 m sport this weekend for his holiday in Cornwall, and will have an M3 next week as a courtesy car for his journey to the lakes. It's all well and good being given a nice car but all he wants is his 340.

It's not only paying attention - it's actually telling us what the heel is going on!

I have been fighting the good fight for nearly eight months and even though they have black & white RR data from my car, they have yet to communicate with me in any way (other than vagueness via the dealer)

No matter who plays it down on here, make no mistake this issue is very much current, Denial is all I am getting from VOLVO and have had nothing different in the last 8 months

This problem is far from solved, until Volvo actually tell me it is !

(V40 D4 VEA)

I doubt they will admit anything.

Normally in these type of circumstances with mass produced cars. They are repaired under warranty and once out of warranty you are on your own.

I had a car with a few known defects that were expensive (still not rectified by BMW and never will be.). The general consensus on the forums for that car was to get a good warranty through warranty direct.

I never had to make a claim so I can't say how good they are.

Seems a sensible thing to do with a modern diesel out of warranty anyway. So many expensive things can go wrong with them these days.

I remember similar issues to this when VW introduced their 170bhp pd diesel.

Until someone actually has the opportunity to file a County Court 'Small Claim' for the cost of a defective EGR, Volvo will never admit to anything which could 'open the floodgates'. Even if a claim was filed, I would expect them to very quickly settle 'out of court' to avoid any public discussion of 'the problem'. Maybe this is something to consider in the future once the EGR problems exceed the 'three year' warranty.
Two further points to mention / question.
1. If an EGR is replaced under warranty at 2 years 11 months, then fails within the following 12 months, is it covered by any form of warranty ?
2. How does the extended (4/5 year) warranty stand wrt to these EGR failures ?
Both questions for the future, but I'm sure we will be talking about them when the time comes.
For the legally-minded, I make this further comment. When taking out a County Court claim, it is vital to claim against the correct entity. So, is this the dealer, or VUK ? Get it wrong, and it will be thrown out of Court. I, for one, would feel uncomfortable taking a 'good dealer' to court, but I rather suspect the 'contract' which I would be claiming had been broken (ie, the fitting of a further defective EGR) would be with the dealer, not with VUK.
I'd be more interested in taking VUK to court, but on reflection this might be difficult.
Any professional legal eagles reading this post care to comment ?

I'm no legal expert. But there have been far worse problems than this is in the past and I'm not aware of anyone being successful with this type of thing in the UK.

I'm wary of mentioning this again. But the well publicised porsche issue is a prime example. Those problems caused engine failure.

I know US customers were in a much stronger legal position than UK buyers at that time, and were treated much better as a result.

New cars a repaired under warranty and once a car is over 3 years old I would imagine it's difficult/impossible to prove other factors haven't caused the issue. Especially if it was bought used....I'm guessing though.

I think that your sales contract is with the dealer not VCUK.

VCUK is the franchise operations centre for the dealer network as the dealers are completely independent of Volvo. They charge Volvo for the work that they undertake as warranty.

I think therefore that you would need to sue the dealer as your supplier, who would (or could) sue Volvo as their supplier.

Very, very difficult to work this though as there are many ways that they can wriggle out - especially given that it doesn't affect all cars - in fact it may be a quite small percentage that it does affect.

You say a small percentage, but it appears those with a D4 on here are just a small percentage, and how many Volvo owners with a D4 are even on this or any other forum, probably a small percentage

So by going by the sample size of D4 owners on here how many have had issue?

I have the D4 and love my engine and hope this thread or others does not put people off or give those looking/just purchased cause for concern, as at present I am not concerned just hate modern companies (not just Volvo here so let's not just bash them) deal with it by denial or blaming the owner, if the dealership one more time try's to tell me it's the way I use the car I will go potty.

The XC60 sales for 2015 up to August are 100,594 against 85,339 for the same period last year.

The new D4 is clearly a popular engine and I am sure it is a big chunk of that 100k new XC60s which could make the numbers reporting issues here a rather small percentage, perhaps small enough for Volvo to consider this not be the catastrophic issue that might be suggested here.

As has been suggested, without some real numbers showing that this is affecting a significant number of engines Volvo is able to deny that there is an issue.

Problem is, forum users like us are more likely to identify and report these problems, simply because we're more interested in our cars ... so we represent a skewed sample, if you see what I mean.

And if the dealership does try and tell you it's your driving style, give them both barrels!

This 'driving style' issue sounds a bit like the perpetual 'best advice for exercising to keep fit'. Should we have brisk walk for 20 minutes each day, or a one hour run twice a week (or any variant in between) ? Every month the advice seems to change, just like so many things medical, dietary and lifestyle. What hope do we have for definitive advice on driving style, or indeed would it ever be given in such terms, as to do so would imply the car was 'unsuitable' for driving in a non-recommended way -- which would be plain daft.

Had the EGR and cooler replaced on mine today. There doesn't appear to be any difference in performance or the way it drives. They did say the mpg should improve, even though it's not really been that bad.

Had a Fiesta courtesy car:( but it did the job.

Has any body had a look at removing the EGR ?

A quick search shows up companies like this

http://www.sinspeed.co.uk/egr-remova...on-egr-delete/

Of course there would then be issues with Insurance and modified car.

Any thoughts once the car is out of warranty ?

Took the EGR of my Landover Defender a few years ago, still passes MOT without issue - luckily warranty was finsished many years ago :)

With the amount of people who are removing their DPF and EGR, and a number of companies that openly advertised that they delete both.

I think it's only a matter of time before they start checking both are still present at MOT.

They check for physical DPF fitment already, EGR is done on emissions ;)

The mention of MOT has made me wonder if I have had a brain shunt, as I am sure that I read somewhere that the first MOT will not be required until the car is 4 years old.
Cannot find anything on the web regarding this.
Am I wrong?

Thanks.

tem.

It is just a proposal at the moment - looks as though it is being suggested to cut down on motoring costs.

Not seen them but worth giving them a call, please post your findings

RICA are working on an EGR delete at the mo

Said before but EGR delete will be the only effective answer me thinks

And was it then every two years ?

The MOT test does not monitor NOx. It's a very simple particulate test and easy for any old engine to pass provided it's not totally knackered.

Government is working on tech that will measure it though so don't expect a non working EGR to pass when they eventually start testing.

I would not think accurately testing EGR operation / NOx would be easy as would mean a monitored road test or custom RR setup to do it accurately

Emissions test?!
You floor it in the test centre car park and it'll pass.
EGR or not.