D4 VEA 'check engine' light / EGR fault thread

[007]

Originally Posted by The Tinkerer

@007 - at the weekend, whip off your engine cover and have a poke around as I've described here: http://www.volvoforums.org.uk/showthread.php?t=229612

I will mate - I have seen your posts before and looked at the accessible pipe at the rear.

The dealer has done a full review of the car and reported no issues (2 weeks after the EGR work they had undertaken).

But I did see your earlier post and time allowing had planned to have a look over the weekend, would dearly love it to be so simple and get 'her' back

Cheers

[Arianne]

Probably because my local dealership feels so sorry for me.......they have kindly agreed to take our car back and have a good look at it again. They have explained, as has already been said, that they can't roll back the ECU updates and I get that.

I might ask them if they have any other VEA D4 XC60s that I can try. They themselves have previously stated that they have done side-by-side road tests and they can't tell any difference between the two car performance. I do trust these guys.

Polestar for the VEA D4 is coming in a few weeks and they've offered to let me try it on their car when it has had the upgrade. I'll need to think about that.

I remain convinced that the ECU update has blunted the low-end torque. The trouble for the local dealership is that their people are all whizzing around in Polestar'd D5's. So their personal experience of what great performance feels like is informed by a very different engine. Maybe I should have noticed that when I was thinking about ordering my own XC60? Aagh! Next time eh?

Oh well, off to footie now. The lad's driving so I'll be a passenger in his TT.

Have a nice evening folks.

Arianne

PS. The YouTube post is interesting and clearly shows a difference, albeit that it's a rough science. I don't think that's much more scientific that my 'gut instinct' that things are not the same since the 'turtle' fix.

[vadre]

To all you D5 AWD 215bhp owners out there........good choice! I'll have to put this one down to experience.

Arianne.
Have I made the right decision. Today I bade farewell to my D5 215 XC60 and picked up a MY16 D4 190 FWD Se Lux.

I have only driven it the 3 short miles from dealer to home but first impressions were good.
I have been following this thread, as I suspect have many, with much interest. In the coming days I will be comparing the new car with the old and will post my thoughts in due course.
I am assuming that if any changes to the mapping which may have been applied in an attempt to alleviate EGR issues, would come as standard to MY16 cars, so hopefully I will have something to measure my new car's performance by.

Any other MY16 owners out there with any thoughts?

[007]

Originally Posted by The Tinkerer

@007 - at the weekend, whip off your engine cover and have a poke around as I've described here: http://www.volvoforums.org.uk/showthread.php?t=229612

Originally Posted by 007

I will mate

Cover off last night and other than 'as designed' moderate holding areas which grip the pipes a tiny bit, there are no defined nips or clear reductions in section.

I did happen the find a broken plastic bracket though (top right of engine after air box) which must have been done when the work was undertaken so I will be getting that renewed at some point, clearly nothing to do with my performance problem tho

[Arianne]

Originally Posted by vadre

"To all you D5 AWD 215bhp owners out there........good choice! I'll have to put this one down to experience."

Arianne.
Have I made the right decision. Today I bade farewell to my D5 215 XC60 and picked up a MY16 D4 190 FWD Se Lux.

It depends. The VEA D4 will be more economical and VED is very cheap. It is a decent engine. The D5 215bhp drinks more fuel and the VED isn't cheap but it does, in my opinion, offer more thrills and a better engine note.

Let me be clear, I drive my XC60 mostly for thrills. Our XC60 is a 'trophy car' rather than a workhorse because we have a 'bog standard' family hatchback for the daily commute and another sports coupe in the family's fleet.

I'll not repeat what I've already said a thousand times about the temperamental performance of the VEA engine, especially during the winter months. It's a perfectly decent car but not quite what I thought I had bought as an alternative to the D5 XC60 that I was considering side-by-side.

I am sure you'll be happy with your new XC60. Enjoy it. I watched the video recently posted by another forum member on this site and the journalist is rightly very positive about it.

Best wishes.

Arianne

[Flux]

Originally Posted by 007

Have spoken to Polestar at length, they have very minimal power and torque gains for the D4 and they have stated their remap does not change the EGR in any way, I asked that given the sooting issues with the engine would they consider reducing or eliminating the EGR dosing and got a definitive 'NO'. My theory is that if you do get this map it may give you nearer the original performance but will also reinstate the sooting issue and reduce the time the EGR cooler will take to soot up again.

On the other hand I have also spoken to RICA at great length, they have had a D4 map out for some time with more palpable gains (I know someone running it who is very happy); but interestingly RICA are actively developing an EGR delete to enhance their offering in recognition of the sooting issues the D4 engine is having.

If Volvo do nothing, I think the only way to reinstate the original performance (or better) without clogging the engine/EGR cooler up will be with a map which reduces or eliminates the EGR usage (insurance & warranty considerations - ahem & environmental)

That's my thoughts & findings to date

ps I have also asked Volvo if they would give Polestar an EGR delete to at least give us a viable (in warranty) option - they declined to comment

Would seem a bit of a swizz if the Polestar upgrade on the D4 VEA just reinstated power prior to apparent remap at service/EGR replacement! So, pay north of £500 plus vat (one would assume based on current cost of polestar upgrade) to get what you had before and risk further possible issues with sooting up of the EGR. Uuumm, try selling that one to D4 owners! Maybe Volvo provide the polestar upgrade foc to those who already feel let down by the apparent changes to the driving experience.

[wimorrison]

I thought that the Volvo ECU was now password protected stopping the third party remappers from being able to change anything - at least that is what one regular poster who is in that game is always complaining about saying that Volvo is being unfair and putting him and his ilk out of business.

[007]

Originally Posted by harvsurrey

Also while the torque is good , don't kid yourself its like a V8 , i have one of those sitting outside and its not in the same league.

I did say a 3.5 Harv he he, and not a 4.2 fire breathing monster like yours. Although the book shows 410Nm torque for yours and 400Nm for the D4 VEA?

I'm sure you know what I was getting at though, in that before it delivered a very linear push in the back from the get go (like a V8 does). Once you are up on the the power end we would not see you for dust, it's just that initial wantant surge, almost over rewarding your throttle position that it used to give.

Where now your throttle position passes the torque line and you have to wait for it to catch up - for someone (like you & me) attuned to such the difference is MASSIVE !

It just oozed torque before and gave me such warm feel all over every time I eeked the throttle in a long gear (almost giggle worthy).

So hard to put into words; but equally I am sure some will notice it and others will not notice any difference whatsoever (which I'm inclined to think Volvo were relying on)

[harvsurrey]

Originally Posted by 007

I did say a 3.5 Harv he he, and not a 4.2 fire breathing monster like yours. Although the book shows 410Nm torque for yours and 400Nm for the D4 VEA?

I'm sure you know what I was getting at though, in that before it delivered a very linear push in the back from the get go (like a V8 does). Once you are up on the the power end we would not see you for dust, it's just that initial wantant surge, almost over rewarding your throttle position that it used to give.

Where now your throttle position passes the torque line and you have to wait for it to catch up - for someone (like you & me) attuned to such the difference is MASSIVE !

It just oozed torque before and gave me such warm feel all over every time I eeked the throttle in a long gear (almost giggle worthy).

So hard to put into words; but equally I am sure some will notice it and others will not notice any difference whatsoever (which I'm inclined to think Volvo were relying on)

never underestimate that 410nm and 365bhp(mines not standard ) gives a much bigger shove than 400nm and 181bhp

plus not having any turbo's to spool up no matter how quick

i await a chat with my dealer , however stacked out with work at the moment .

[volvorocks]

Originally Posted by 007

@Arianne

EGR (Exhaust Gas Recirculation) takes hot dead dirty gas which has been burnt and left your engine and puts a proportion of it back in the clean (intake) side of the engine to reduce Nitrogen Dioxide NOx emissions, to a level which meets EU directives.

EGR cannot be combusted and enters with the intake gasses so any fuel & air mix it replaces it directly and proportionately reduces the efficiency and the power by the proportional amount of combustible gas it replaces.

I understand this VEA engine uses large amounts of EGR, so they could also be dosing more EGR in the new map which would also reduce power but in my mind this would increase the sooting issue.

So they have possibly looked to reduce the NOx (and reduce the EGR) by reducing the combustible gasses to a lower (and possibly more efficient) burn level.

All this is hypothesis until we do actually understand when they have done

Quick question as you seem to know your stuff.

Some people on their cars (not necessarily XC60) deliberately block/plate off the EGR so as to not have issues, and to increase performance. Therefore if an EGR gets naturally blocked with gunge or whatever during use, would that not be the equivalent of deliberately blocking/plating off the EGR? If so - why the problems when the EGR gums up? If not,why no problems with a deliberately plated/blocked EGR?

Regards