Engine 850: B5234TR/2.3/20v/T5R: Loss in boost

[bb54]

Originally Posted by jod t5

lol, or get someone else to do it......
cheers
jod

i can smell a mini meet.
im not working this weekend jod so im free to hook up and have a play with a poorly T5.

wayne

[AndysR]

Cheers for the offer guy's, would be nice to meet up but unfortunately I am working this weekend. After having a though check of the relevant boost hoses as instructed. I am confident that the bcs is the fault so I have ordered it today. I plan to fit it at some stage over the weekend but obviously between work. If it doesn't cure it then I have a sharp knife handy just in case........ lol

[Jod T5]

Originally Posted by andyrs

Cheers for the offer guy's, would be nice to meet up but unfortunately I am working this weekend. After having a though check of the relevant boost hoses as instructed. I am confident that the bcs is the fault so I have ordered it today. I plan to fit it at some stage over the weekend but obviously between work. If it doesn't cure it then I have a sharp knife handy just in case........ lol

never mind andy, i think as wayne has pointed out you do need to check the actuator is working correctly, if the spring is weak you will leak boost...
Wayne i will pm you later in the week, sure we will squeeze a stella in....
cheers
jod

[AndysR]

Originally Posted by jod t5

never mind andy, i think as wayne has pointed out you do need to check the actuator is working correctly, if the spring is weak you will leak boost...
Wayne i will pm you later in the week, sure we will squeeze a stella in....
cheers
jod

Yeah will give that a good check over as well, went out to the car after it was suggested about the wastegate actuator and I can't see the whole rod because of the turbocharger heatshields. I did try and pull on it but didn't really get a good hold on it and it wasn't interested in moving so will give it a bit of a closer look at the weekend if I can while changing the bcs. If you two are local will have to arrange a mini meet

[irf]

Originally Posted by andyrs

Yeah will give that a good check over as well, went out to the car after it was suggested about the wastegate actuator and I can't see the whole rod because of the turbocharger heatshields. I did try and pull on it but didn't really get a good hold on it and it wasn't interested in moving so will give it a bit of a closer look at the weekend if I can while changing the bcs. If you two are local will have to arrange a mini meet

to remove the heatshield you need a 12mm ratchet spanner. i'm sure you could just use a ratchet but i just find it very easy with the ratchet spanner. two bolts on the right, two arsey bolts connected to the engine side.

[AndysR]

Right fitted the BCS tonight connecting each vac pipe one by one to make sure they are in the same place as the original. Been out on road test and I feel sick, what a waste of money that was!! Still I guess I know its not the bcs and that I have a brand new one so should be ok for a while, fingers crossed, anyway...

I decided to recheck my work around the throttle body being as I have had that all apart at the weekend and it all seemed fine. Once again I removed the pipework between the throttle body and intercooler top hose paying special attention to the pipe itself to make sure it was ok. On inspection there where no splits evident what so ever. So I refitted it and also made sure the fixing clips where nice and tight.
Also removed the pipe between the top of the idle control valve and the vacuum tree to make sure this wasn't split. Again all ok refitted the pipe making sure the clips where nice and tight.
Thought just quickly take it for a spin to make sure all is still as it was and to see if by some strange freak of nature that I hadn't cured the fault and it was still exactly the same.

So I have managed to rule out the bcs and am confident that its not anything I did at the weekend when I cleaned the throttle body out. Going to try and rob a pressure gauge from a friend at the weekend to make sure the wastegate actuator is holding pressure ok and that the wastegate arm isn't seized but apart from doing those two tests I am absolutely stumped looks like a garage visit is on the cards!!

[itguy]

I'd test it with an MBC first to see if its holding pressure when 'preset'.

All PCV hoses ok?

I couldn't believe how many hoses there are to check as part of the vac system.

From memory on my 850 are; (in no order)

Inlet manifold to PCV Heater (small tube)
Intercooler top hose to throttle body alu tube
Intercooler bottom hose to alu tube
Turbocharger outlet hose (silicone) to alu tube over the engine
Alu tube over the engine to intercooler bottom alu tube hose
Vac Tree to turbo blow-off valve
Throttle body to turbo boost gauge (white plastic hoses)
Throttle body to Brake Servo
Throttle body to Cruise Control vac pump
Throttle body large intake hose (including air control valve)
Air control valve to vac tree
Lots of vac pipes under the drivers side footwell for cruise control (although these are only applicable when the cruise is activated and it's holding pressure)
Plastic intake hose from airbox to turbocharger - including the PCV heater+rubber gasket it sits in
Larger bore hose that goes from flametrap to PCV heater
All other flametrap hoses


Apart from this,
Inlet manifold gasket leaks
Vac tree leaks (has a rubber o ring in it)
Throttle body gasket leaks

I'm sure if I've missed any of the hoses etc then someone will remind me !

[Jod T5]

Andy, as i tried to point out the other day you really need to test you existing components before you go spending money on parts you suspect are faulty....i have seen and worked with many turbo'd engines with hesitation issues and on very few i have found the solonoid to be at fault...
The reason why the engines judder is basically because the AFR (air fuel ratio) is too RICH, which in 80% is down to
a) there is a air leak
b) the plugs are shagged or incorrectly gapped or the rotor/dizzy is arcing
c) the wastegate is incorrectly set or stuck
d) the MAF or Outside temp sensor is faulty
I have experienced one ecu fault which was caused by a ETM reprogram and IIRC no more then 3 dodgy BCS's
You need to check the actuator and most importantly the inlet manifold elbow/pcv pipe...,
Pm georgie and ask him to forward the MBC i have loaned him and try this in-line to eliminate a lazy actuator...You will be able to set the MBC to hold the boost to any pressure before it releases pressure to the actuator..This will show you that your pipework is sound or not.....
I would like to meet with you and the second in command with regard to MBC work BB54 and im sure we can sort this out with you.....
There cannot be too much wrong with you car and with a little jiggling im sure you are not far away from getting your car sorted...
Any chance of a "sickie" on saturday.....
cheers
jod

[AndysR]

Originally Posted by jod t5

Andy, as i tried to point out the other day you really need to test you existing components before you go spending money on parts you suspect are faulty....i have seen and worked with many turbo'd engines with hesitation issues and on very few i have found the solonoid to be at fault...
The reason why the engines judder is basically because the AFR (air fuel ratio) is too RICH, which in 80% is down to
a) there is a air leak
b) the plugs are shagged or incorrectly gapped or the rotor/dizzy is arcing
c) the wastegate is incorrectly set or stuck
d) the MAF or Outside temp sensor is faulty
I have experienced one ecu fault which was caused by a ETM reprogram and IIRC no more then 3 dodgy BCS's
You need to check the actuator and most importantly the inlet manifold elbow/pcv pipe...,
Pm georgie and ask him to forward the MBC i have loaned him and try this in-line to eliminate a lazy actuator...You will be able to set the MBC to hold the boost to any pressure before it releases pressure to the actuator..This will show you that your pipework is sound or not.....
I would like to meet with you and the second in command with regard to MBC work BB54 and im sure we can sort this out with you.....
There cannot be too much wrong with you car and with a little jiggling im sure you are not far away from getting your car sorted...
Any chance of a "sickie" on saturday.....
cheers
jod

I hear what you say and obviously bow to experience, this is obviously way above my diagnostic techniques as I had alot of faith that the characteristics the car displayed was down to an electrical fault namely the bcs. Meeting up on Saturday is a possibility for the afternoon as I maybe able to shoot away by lunchtime if that helps. However still won't have a bcs to test the system. When I was changing over the bcs I noticed that the vac lines to it where in poor condition and perished although didn't appear to be split. I am hoping that it isn't a pcv system fault as this was all renewed by a volvo dealer in November last year.

[Jod T5]

Originally Posted by andyrs

I hear what you say and obviously bow to experience, this is obviously way above my diagnostic techniques as I had alot of faith that the characteristics the car displayed was down to an electrical fault namely the bcs. Meeting up on Saturday is a possibility for the afternoon as I maybe able to shoot away by lunchtime if that helps. However still won't have a bcs to test the system. When I was changing over the bcs I noticed that the vac lines to it where in poor condition and perished although didn't appear to be split. I am hoping that it isn't a pcv system fault as this was all renewed by a volvo dealer in November last year.

I have BCS, 4mm hose, wayne has mbc and other crap so i guess we have everything bar you on saturday....Give me 20 mins to rig up a new inlet/pcv hose....
Meet at a garage with water and parking....sorted......
NEXT...? lol
All the best
jod