Amazon: New (to me) 1963 Volvo 122

[Derek UK]

I'd be checking battery condition and properly clamped on terminal connections first. Earth lead to body from the battery and lead from bell housing to chassis close to where your feet are. Fully charge battery and check the starting. Try jump leads from a running car. If you still get clicking then think about the starter. Intermittant usually means poor connections.

[Othen]

Originally Posted by JP 1800

Firstly check the battery voltage as it should be 12.6V, any less it needs charging. A voltage drop of 0.4 signifies an issue with the wiring, the voltage drop is not as important as the associated current drop which can have an impact. Clean up contacts and earths to bring the voltage drop down. The solenoid can be checked in place as you said. If you are still having problems then take the starter off and bench test it as others have said. When on the bench you can also remove the solenoid and check. In my experience a lot of electrical problems arise from bad or poor connections. If the issue still stands you can get the unit checked at a shop which does alternator repairs.

Originally Posted by Laird Scooby

The strter itself provides the earth return for the solenoid pull-in coil Alan, once the solenoid is in it makes the contacts between the two large terminals on the solenoid and also feeds a hold-in coil on the solenoid that takes much less current.

Shorting the two large terminals is best done with an old spanner or preferably screwdriver, wire can be clumsy to use especially when bent over a wing and isn't always easy to remove. If shorting those terminals doesn't make it run, then it's another indication it's the brushes.

You'll need to get the 10-digit Bosch number off the motor, should start "0 0001" and then look up the brush pack.

https://www.woodauto.com/group/156/B...ter-Brush-Gear

Likely to be one of those. Possibly even this one :

https://www.woodauto.com/bom/67383/BOSCH-0001311103

That's the BOM for an 0 001 311 103 starter as fitted to early 140 cars - they don't list the 120 series but if memory serves late 120 and early 140 used the same starter. If so, this is the brush pack

https://www.woodauto.com/product/BOS1004336036

Could also be just a dirty comm and some brake cleaner followed by emery tape and more brake cleaner will fix it - you won't know until you pull it out.

Originally Posted by Derek UK

I'd be checking battery condition and properly clamped on terminal connections first. Earth lead to body from the battery and lead from bell housing to chassis close to where your feet are. Fully charge battery and check the starting. Try jump leads from a running car. If you still get clicking then think about the starter. Intermittant usually means poor connections.

Many thanks chaps,

So we have a few views on the likely cause, none of which is a faulty solenoid, so it is a really good thing I asked this question rather than just rush off to Brookhouse Volvo to buy a new one!

The money is on either an external fault (battery, wiring, switches or earths) or worn brushes within the motor. It is always best to check the free stuff first, so I'll apply myself a bit and do some proper diagnosis. We can discount a flat battery; when the motor car first did the 'dead man's click' the first thing I did was to check the battery voltage. Since then I've also charged it fully (which took little time, it being fully charged by the alternator).

Aside from cleaning up all the connections and earths, it would seem that there are three likely causes:

a. A fault at one of the switches (the key switch or Ron Kwas button). I can check this by bypassing them with a wire from the battery to the solenoid terminal next time the motor enters a fault state.

b. The solenoid not operating the main switch. I can test this by jumping the two large terminals on the solenoid with a suitable large piece of metal next time it is in a fault state.

c. The brushes to the commutator in the motor are worn. I can check this by first measuring the voltage at the output post of the solenoid with it in a fault state, then by measuring the impedance to earth of that post with the solenoid not energised (so an open cct to that side). If it is an open cct (or a high impedance) then the fault will be with the connection to the commutator.

So, the plan is:

a. Check the connections to +ve and earth (there aren't that many).

b. Work out the voltage drop at each connection (key switch output, starter button input and output and solenoid terminal) to see where our 0.4v is going).

c. Wait for the motor to enter a fault state then:

i. Bypass the switch wiring to the starter solenoid.

ii. Jump the solenoid posts.

iii. Measure the voltage at the solenoid output post.

iv. Measure the impedance through the starter motor.

Many thanks chaps. My feeling is that I'll probably end up changing the brushes and cleaning up the commutator (but that is only a gut feeling, we'll do the diagnostics first).

:-)

Alan

PS. First see below.

[Othen]

So, das wichtigste zuerst...

... always do the cheapest and easiest things first: I've just taken the input and output leads off the solenoid input post and given them a good scrub up - the battery lead was a bit mucky. While they were off I gave the top side of the starter a good clean with brake cleaner, the terminals a good scrub up with some contact cleaner and a copper wire brush.

I've just tried the motor car and it started very easily, then repeated it 4 more times. It is possible that a bit of spring cleaning has fixed the problem and one poor connection took the starter cct just outside its error budget for voltage (and therefore current). The problem with intermittent faults is that I won't know whether I've fixed the issue or not for a while.

I hope there will not be any more to follow... :-)

[Burdekin]

Originally Posted by Othen

So, das wichtigste zuerst...

... always do the cheapest and easiest things first: I've just taken the input and output leads off the solenoid input post and given them a good scrub up - the battery lead was a bit mucky. While they were off I gave the top side of the starter a good clean with brake cleaner, the terminals a good scrub up with some contact cleaner and a copper wire brush.

I've just tried the motor car and it started very easily, then repeated it 4 more times. It is possible that a bit of spring cleaning has fixed the problem and one poor connection took the starter cct just outside its error budget for voltage. The problem with intermittent faults is that I won't know whether I've fixed the issue or not for a while.

I hope there will not be any more to follow... :-)

You need to give it all a liberal coating of anti-gremlin spray. 👍

[Othen]

Originally Posted by Burdekin

You need to give it all a liberal coating of anti-gremlin spray. 👍

Good idea, were you thinking of a WD or perhaps silicone?

[Laird Scooby]

Originally Posted by Othen

Good idea, were you thinking of a WD or perhaps silicone?

Silicone spray would be better.

[Othen]

Originally Posted by Laird Scooby

Silicone spray would be better.

Thank you Dave,

I agree silicone, would be less transient than WD.

Alan

[Laird Scooby]

Originally Posted by Othen

Thank you Dave,

I agree silicone, would be less transient than WD.

Alan

Indeed and also remains waterproof.

[Derek UK]

Silicone grease but many just use Vaseline. Don't forget the block to chassis earth I mentioned. That can get loose or greasy and make for a poor contact.

[Othen]

Originally Posted by Othen

Thank you for that chaps - 4 valued responses in the time it has taken Bob and I to walk 2 1/2 miles!

I think the majority vote is to leave GAM with the original steel wheels. I tend to agree having tried the alloys for looks (if not for fit).

This was an opportunity, the seller wanted to get rid of the wheels for very little money, so it was worth taking the chance to see if I liked the look. On reflection I'm not very taken (a bit too ZZ Top) but I'm glad I went through the process of having a look before I embarked on expensive machining and tyres.

The ZZ Top wheels can go onto eBay, they will compliment a boy racer very well :-)

... the good news is the ZZ Top wheels have been sold and collected today, they will suit the 20 year old buyer's Lexus V6 perfectly when he gets it chipped and wrapped :-)

PS. I even made £50 on the deal!