Amazon: New (to me) 1963 Volvo 122

[Laird Scooby]

Originally Posted by Derek UK

Silicone grease but many just use Vaseline. Don't forget the block to chassis earth I mentioned. That can get loose or greasy and make for a poor contact.

Silicone grease is waterproof and is often used as dielectric grease because it doesn't move. Vaseline is petroleum jelly and as such, hydrocarbon based. When it gets hot (on a high-current joint between the battery terminal and terminal clamp for example) not only does it melt but it carbonises and the carbon crystals find their way into any little gap there may be.
Repeated hot/cold cycles add more carbon crystals into the gap and eventually the carbon crystals build up and form a resistor. Naturally while this is happening the resistance of the joint is increasing, exacerbating the condition.

Along similar lines, WD40 is also a petroleum distillate so is likely to cause similar problems to Vaseline. Also there are growing concerns about the corrosion protection (or lack of) offered by WD40 as it seems to promote corrosion, rather than deter it. A silicone spray oil would be a good protective covering for the starter, distibutor cap and leads and is also a good general purpose lube for door hinges, locks, latches and protectant for door seals etc in winter.

[VolvoRoyS]

Originally Posted by Othen

b. The solenoid not operating the main switch. I can test this by jumping the two large terminals on the solenoid with a suitable large piece of metal next time it is in a fault state.

If it is a pre-engage starter this will spin the motor but it won't engage the flywheel in my experience. As you may know with a pre-engage starter motor, the pinion is levered into mesh before contacts inside the solenoid touch and energise the starter. Again, in my experience this sounds like a failing solenoid; those contacts take quite a beating. I have successfully taken a solenoid apart and cleaned up the contacts and put it together again, or just buy a new solenoid.

Roy

[Othen]

Originally Posted by Derek UK

Silicone grease but many just use Vaseline. Don't forget the block to chassis earth I mentioned. That can get loose or greasy and make for a poor contact.

I've just found the earth strap - that is all good.
Many thanks,

Alan

[c1800]

Consider ACZP for electrical connections from Ron’s article here:

http://www.sw-em.com/anti_corrosive_paste.htm

I use the Ox-gard type with good results. Some have ventured that it’s a conductive paste, but it’s not. Details in the article.

Enjoying reading your posts.

[Othen]

Originally Posted by Othen

So, das wichtigste zuerst...

... always do the cheapest and easiest things first: I've just taken the input and output leads off the solenoid input post and given them a good scrub up - the battery lead was a bit mucky. While they were off I gave the top side of the starter a good clean with brake cleaner, the terminals a good scrub up with some contact cleaner and a copper wire brush.

I've just tried the motor car and it started very easily, then repeated it 4 more times. It is possible that a bit of spring cleaning has fixed the problem and one poor connection took the starter cct just outside its error budget for voltage (and therefore current). The problem with intermittent faults is that I won't know whether I've fixed the issue or not for a while.

I hope there will not be any more to follow... :-)

So far so good: GAM started up from cold easily this morn, no clicking from the starter. I'll need to check if for a few more days before I'm sure I've fixed the issue.

Alan

[142 Guy]

As an observation, most greases are hydrophobic and are electrical insulators. The primary purpose on the heavy exposed electrical connections on a vehicle is to prevent corrosion. Slathering any grease with a reasonable temperature rating on the outside of your battery posts and the starter terminals should do nicely. Silicone grease is nice because it is plastic / rubber friendly which is why it finds use on the rubber boots on the ignition system. Its down side is that it is rather expensive relative to other petroleum / synthetic greases when it comes to slathering on bolted connections.

I agree with C1800 that something like Ox-gard is a good choice for the bolted electrical connections. It is / isn't electrically conducting. It is a zinc containing grease. If you stick the probes from an ohm meter into a blob of the stuff it is effectively an insulator. However, when clamped tightly between two metal surfaces the zinc enhances the electrical connection. You can apply the Ox-gard to your battery post and tighten the post clamp. The Ox-gard will enhance the electrical connection and the grease carrier will fill the voids reducing corrosion at the contact surface. You can smear the outside of the connection with Ox-gard if you want (it is hydrophobic and an insulator); however, it is a tad expensive when pretty much any grease will work for that. I also use Ox-gard in light sockets, on fuse terminals, and on electrical plugs that are not well protected.

Ox-gard is not snake oil. Power utilities use pails of the stuff (different trade names) when assembling compression fittings and bolted fittings on high current connections in switching stations. If you don't want a petroleum base grease there is this stuff which uses silicone oil as the carrier and carbon as the conducting element.

https://www.mgchemicals.com/products...uctive-grease/

[Othen]

Originally Posted by 142 Guy

As an observation, most greases are hydrophobic and are electrical insulators. The primary purpose on the heavy exposed electrical connections on a vehicle is to prevent corrosion. Slathering any grease with a reasonable temperature rating on the outside of your battery posts and the starter terminals should do nicely. Silicone grease is nice because it is plastic / rubber friendly which is why it finds use on the rubber boots on the ignition system. Its down side is that it is rather expensive relative to other petroleum / synthetic greases when it comes to slathering on bolted connections.

I agree with C1800 that something like Ox-gard is a good choice for the bolted electrical connections. It is / isn't electrically conducting. It is a zinc containing grease. If you stick the probes from an ohm meter into a blob of the stuff it is effectively an insulator. However, when clamped tightly between two metal surfaces the zinc enhances the electrical connection. You can apply the Ox-gard to your battery post and tighten the post clamp. The Ox-gard will enhance the electrical connection and the grease carrier will fill the voids reducing corrosion at the contact surface. You can smear the outside of the connection with Ox-gard if you want (it is hydrophobic and an insulator); however, it is a tad expensive when pretty much any grease will work for that. I also use Ox-gard in light sockets, on fuse terminals, and on electrical plugs that are not well protected.

Ox-gard is not snake oil. Power utilities use pails of the stuff (different trade names) when assembling compression fittings and bolted fittings on high current connections in switching stations. If you don't want a petroleum base grease there is this stuff which uses silicone oil as the carrier and carbon as the conducting element.

https://www.mgchemicals.com/products...uctive-grease/

That was a most erudite observation, thank you.

It would seem GAM's starter clicking issue was indeed caused by corrosion on the starter terminal (in that the intermittent problem has not reoccurred since I cleaned it). The starter lives in a fairly benign environment, but this experience has shown it is still prone to degradation, so it does make sense to give it some mechanical protection. I've used a silicone grease spray I happened to have in the garage; once I'm sure the gremlin has been vanquished (and before the winter) I'll put a layer of something cheap (like Vaseline) on top as a physical barrier.

Having cleaned up the solenoid I managed to read its Bosch part number (0331302023) and by chance found a NOS item on for sale at only £20 from an online electrical factor. I rather suspect there aren't all that many original Bosch items remaining on the shelf, so I've bought it for the spares box (as one does with 60 year old motor cars).

The solution to this issue has proven to be trivial, but it probably was worth exposing it - the discussion that ensued was worthwhile.

:-)

Alan

[Othen]

Originally Posted by VolvoRoyS

If it is a pre-engage starter this will spin the motor but it won't engage the flywheel in my experience. As you may know with a pre-engage starter motor, the pinion is levered into mesh before contacts inside the solenoid touch and energise the starter. Again, in my experience this sounds like a failing solenoid; those contacts take quite a beating. I have successfully taken a solenoid apart and cleaned up the contacts and put it together again, or just buy a new solenoid.

Roy

Thank you Roy,

See above: it would appear the issue was just some corrosion on the solenoid post. I hear what you say about the solenoid though, and I have found a NOS Bosch replacement for the spares box - just in case :-).

Alan.

[Othen]

Having (rather inadvertently) made £50 on the ZZ Top wheels I treated myself to a tyre changer:



... what a cool machine. It cost only £58 delivered (overnight by DHL) - that is a lot of metal for the money. The key to making machines like this work (and where many home mechanics fail) is securely bolting it down. Fortunately I had room on this concrete pad under the covered space behind the garage, so a bit of drilling and 4 through bolts later had it very secure indeed.

I know: I didn't need this, I can always get F1 Autocentre to remove and fit tyres for me, but I like the self sufficiency and removing a few tyres is quite satisfying. The first one took about 20 minutes to adjust the machine and get the technique just right... the next 3 took less than 10 minutes each. The 4 spare Amazon wheels I bought a week or so ago aren't too bad:



... three of them just needed degreasing (I used Screwfix own), cleaning with some acetone and the odd patch rubbing down. The fourth was a bit more corroded and needed a bit more treatment with a flap disc and wire brush in a drill. After half an hour I'd got down to solid metal everywhere:



I may end up stripping the wheel again and using some alloy wheel filler, but first I thought I'd experiment with some paint. I gave it a coat of silver Hamerite spray and maybe that will be good enough (after another coat this afternoon)?



I suppose whether this finish is good enough depends on what the intended use is. I'm thinking I might put a set of M&S tyres of these and use them in the winter to preserve GAM's nice red wheels and shiny chrome hubcaps. In that case a Hamerite paint finish is probably good enough. I've seen a set of new 175/60 M&S tyres advertised for only £130 - so cheap I'm tempted to just try them.

Having today set up my own tyre changing bay for both car and bike tyres, the only thing I won't be able to do is balance car tyres. I can easily get them done locally, but I'm thinking it might be worth acquiring a static (bubble type) balancer to complete the picture.

I'm pleased with the tyre changer - and also with the spare Amazon wheels :-). I probably wouldn't change tyres on my Porsche's expensive alloy wheels, but for steels wheels (so the Amazon and the Skoda's winter wheels) they are fine.

:-)

[Laird Scooby]

Excellent investment Alan!

A worthwhile improvement is a duck head tyre lever, makes life much easier! Also a tub of tyre soap and a 50p paint brush from Wilko (the ones with the big round head of bristles, i'll try to remember to find you a link later), a valve puller tool and some stick on balance weights.

Besides being better looking, the stick on balance weights can be fitted on the inside of the wheel close to the centre line to balance the whole wheel without introducing dynamic balance problems so that the static balancer (aka "Bullseye" balancer) is all you'll ever need.

You'll notice on new tyres, they usually have a red spot on the sidewall and often a yellow one as well. If only the red spot is there, position it opposite the valve when fitting the tyre. If the yellow spot is there, experiment with either the red spot diametrically opposite the valve or the yellow spot adjacent to the valve, one or other positions will give the closest to natural balance with a minimum amount of weight needed to correct it.