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Oil Consumption & Soot Filter Full - THE TRUTH

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Old Oct 11th, 2018, 01:16   #11
osullivant
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Alen View Post
2007 d5 oil consumption 1l/2000km
1. new egr
2. rebuild turbo
3. new throttle body -the car went in safe mode when it broke so can not say if the car
is nearly un-driveable while throttle closed
4. new valve, Crankcase breather
5. dpf off

Result -oil consumption higher

Nickthecook - what do you mean with short on the Throttle body connector plug? Would not a new Throttle body resolve that?

Next - new oil rings. If that resolves oil issue i will let you know.

1l in 2000kms is not really that high in terms of these engines when they are using oil. would you consider just doing the valve stem seals... this can be done with the head still on the engine obviously if this did not cure the issue you would be repeating much of the work but I suspect if you were set up you could do the seals in a few hours...
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Old Oct 11th, 2018, 01:23   #12
osullivant
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Originally Posted by 9000rpm View Post
I disconnected the breather pipe from the turbo inlet and the spigot from the valve. I left the alu pipe in place with the both ends free to air and coolant side of it unaffected.

I fitted a small piece of hose with a bung in it to cap off the turbo inlet pipe and then a long piece of hose straight from the CCV valve spigot into a catch tank.

Oil consumption like this was just as bad and no oil was collected into the catch tank.

Its still early days but I seem to have fixed my oil consumption issue at long last.

I've been reading all the posts I could on D5 oil consumption and tried the cheap fixes with no luck. I was very reluctant to strip the engine and fit new rings or valve stem seals and or fit a new turbo as someone had oil consumption even after all that!

It wasn't until I read someone said that you can check when the car is doing a dpf regen by watching what the EGR is set to. They said it sits at 94.9% while the regen is taking place.

I do mostly motorway miles so with an OBD2 reader and the torque app on my phone I discovered my car was going into a regen as soon as it was up to temperature and it did this for 20 mins. The egr valve would then start moving about depending on throttle position suggesting regen had finished.

But not more than 20 to 30 seconds later the EGR went to 94.9% again and another 20min regen!

this would explain why I never saw the fuel economy drop when trying to work out when it was in regen before because its been in constant regen for thousands of miles!

I worked out in the 8000 miles ive been having fuel consumption and oil consumption issues the dpf has tried to regen around 400 times when it should have been 10 to 16 times!

not once have I had a DPF full light on thought!

I think there is a fault with Volvo's DPF regen stratergy when the DPF is full of ash and needs cleaning or replacing (no amount of regens will burn off ash). There is no counter between regens to flag if there is a problem that the regens are happening too frequently.

I think there are a lot of d5 out there this is happening to and the oil is being diluted with diesel lowering its viscosity and increasing oil consumption.

Also I think the backpressure could be causing oil loss through the turbo seals.

I have removed the blocked dpf from my car and it wasn't full of soot but solid with light colour dust (ash?) but the downpipe to the dpf was in a horrible state, full of black wet diesel soaked soot.

a new unblocked DPF and there is now no measurable oil consumption so far!
and this is with the soot filter full light never coming on!
thats an interesting theory.. i cured my oil usage eventually with a pcv and a deep clean of the DPF but I still have high fuel usage.. (amazon are 10 days so far bring my timing pins to check the timing on the car) if the timing is ok I will investigate your pointer....

just hate the idea of pulling out injectors and paying to have them tested or repaired/replaced together with the pricking around with little bolts threaded into the aluminium head ( most of mine now have inserts)
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Old Oct 14th, 2018, 01:33   #13
Nickthecook
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Cool Re: Update 9n the Throttle Body Short

Sorry it's been a while since my last update, life's a bit mad at the momment between work, Home and the Moose.

So there was a change in noise when I was poking around by the EGR/Throttle area, suddenly everything reverts to normal again. Try as I may, I couldn't replicate the IncIdent again, although it's done it briefly of it's own accord.

This is work in progress and as such I have this very promising area to look at tomorrow, so promising infact, I'd put a small wager on this one.

We now know the Euro4 has this HPL EGR and as such the Turbo Vanes, Throttle and EGR work to create the best conditions for gases to pass from Exhaust to Intake. If you cut open the thickest section of loom, slightly ECM side of the spurs for the Throttle and EGR Connectors, you will find that the 12v switchedr supply to the EGR (not labled as such on VIDA's ECM connector pin identification, but possibly PIN A82 - LIN BUS) has other wires of the same colour (Green/Grey Stripe) spliced into it. The corresponding pin on the EGR would appear to be the 12v Switched Supply. Despite the following having a 12v Switched Supply, I can find no mention of such for any of the modules on either ECM connector A or B The units I believe to be supplied by these wires are, The Turbo Controller, The EGR, The Throttle and The Swirl Motor. I know for certain the first three of these are utilized for the HPL EGR. I'm no electrical expert, but sometimes my throttle works normally, other times it's in reverse, closing to 92.3%.today under even light acceleration. . Would the loss of 12v power make a PWM controlled motor behave such a way?

I haven't cut open the heat shrink to inspect the splicing yet, but it doesn't look or feel like it's been crimped. If it's solder, the join may be badly corroded after 13years. I'm not sure it would directly effect the 5v reference as it should run independently, but you never know with a volvo. The exhaust speed would briefly spike and DPF pressure with it, therefore explainimg the lift off 'Soot Filter Full' messages aswell has Boost ones.

I should point out the spliced wires in the loom are original Volvo and not an aftermarket job. They should be there on any 2005-2007 D5 185, possibly later ones too. I'll try and upload a pic, but I seem to recall they have to be compressed, so it will probably be tomorrow.

I'll update tomorrow evening to let you know how I get on.
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Old Oct 17th, 2018, 12:27   #14
Yobbo
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Have you considered that your throttle body actuator itself may have an intermittent fault?
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Old Oct 17th, 2018, 22:58   #15
Nickthecook
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Default ECM supply Voltage is too low - Modules & Sensor Problems.

So today I got a multimeter between the ECM supply wire and the alternator, with Ignition in Pos2 only 5v was getting through. It measured 12v when fed straight to a ground, but this was of course unloades. I didn't have time to check that today. There's Still some work to do, but I suspect a leak from the power steering pump is causing the in built Alternater Control Module to reduce the current in order to protect the battery. In my case, I know the DPF isn't blocked and the soot filter full messages are due to incorrect sensor data as a result of the low voltage supply. However, I've replaced the DPF twice and I believe these were blocked due to parameters for successful regeneration not being met. Once the new DPF Sensor went on, I immediately got a signal low DTC. If this fault remains for a couple of drive cycles, the ECM changes it to a High Signal fault to force regeneration. On these occassions I was blowing regen smoke out the back end in under a minute. This was the firat time I had ever seen any smoke during a regeneration. I don't doubt the fuel was being post injected, but the EGR and Throttle were in the wrong positions due to the incorrect voltage it's also possible the temp sensors were not accurate too. The Throttle is controlled by a PWM signal, my limited knowledge leads me to believe the final signal will be incorrect if the starting voltage is wrong. The majority of my Soot Filter Full messages do NOT only appear as a result of high boost, but mostly during lift off and gear changes. This is down to the HPL EGR System and the relationship between the Turbo Vanes, EGR Position Sensor and Throttle being all to **** and a sudden increase in exhaust gas speed. If the Voltage issue is due to a faulty overrun pulley and alternator regulator, lift off is when the clutch would normally engage. My throttle often closes under acceleration but there is boost working against it at this point. During lift off there isn't, and it was as I got back on the accelerator that I was seeing vast amounts of blue smoke exiting the exhaust. The vacuum generated by lift off and a closed throttle was litterally sucking oil past the pistons. Since using torque to monitor the throttle position, I have substantially reduced my oil consumption.

It is entirely possible the low ECM voltage supply is caused by something else, but VIDA is showing a message below the DTC's saying it's 'Checking the Alternator Freewheel Pulley.' I've also had a leak from the Power Steering Pump. The wire from the Alternator was green with a light coloured stripe, but I couldn't tell if it was a dirty white or a pale grey. I say this only because of the green/pale grey stripe wires I found in the loom. At least one of these is a 12v switchable supply for the EGR. I haven't had time to trace the other 5 wires spliced into it yet.

What does baffle me is the complete lack of relevant DTC's. Maybe it's because the entire ECM is affected and there simply isn't the safety net there to identify this problem. The ECM also adjusts it's values over time and it's possible this is why I only picked it up when I replaced the Pressure Sensor(s) I've tried two new sensors and both resulted in a low signal fault.

It's worth mentioning that according to VIDA, there were two different Alternators used in the Euro4. Maybe this is why only some cars are affected.

I appreciate a lot of this is speculation. However, the ECM voltage supply isn't, that's fact. It.may yet transpire that the Alternator and Governor are ok and it's a bad ground or short in the Supply,. Eitherway, substancially reduced ECM Voltage can occur amd mess with a lot of systems without any indication whatsoever that something is wrong.

It's possible the car will still use a little oil, but oil rings aren't known for being selective about when and where they choose to allow oil pass. In my car for sure, the oil consumption goes through the roof during regeneration, which of course is usually instigated by a high presssire signal, rather than counters. I'm struggling to get more than 10mins to 20mins a day to investigate matters further. However, I will not give up until I have concrete proof of what is going on under that bonnet.
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Old Oct 17th, 2018, 23:12   #16
Nickthecook
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Default ECM supply Voltage is too low - Modules & Sensor Problems.

So today I got a multimeter between the ECM supply wire and the alternator, with Ignition in Pos2 only 5v was getting through. It measured 12v when fed straight to a ground, but this was of course unloades. I didn't have time to check that today. There's Still some work to do, but I suspect a leak from the power steering pump is causing the in built Alternater Control Module to reduce the current in order to protect the battery. In my case, I know the DPF isn't blocked and the soot filter full messages are due to incorrect sensor data as a result of the low voltage supply. However, I've replaced the DPF twice and I believe these were blocked due to parameters for successful regeneration not being met. Once the new DPF Sensor went on, I immediately got a signal low DTC. If this fault remains for a couple of drive cycles, the ECM changes it to a High Signal fault to force regeneration. On these occassions I was blowing regen smoke out the back end in under a minute. This was the firat time I had ever seen any smoke during a regeneration. I don't doubt the fuel was being post injected, but the EGR and Throttle were in the wrong positions due to the incorrect voltage it's also possible the temp sensors were not accurate too. The Throttle is controlled by a PWM signal, my limited knowledge leads me to believe the final signal will be incorrect if the starting voltage is wrong. The majority of my Soot Filter Full messages do NOT only appear as a result of high boost, but mostly during lift off and gear changes. This is down to the HPL EGR System and the relationship between the Turbo Vanes, EGR Position Sensor and Throttle being all to **** and a sudden increase in exhaust gas speed. If the Voltage issue is due to a faulty overrun pulley and alternator regulator, lift off is when the clutch would normally engage. My throttle often closes under acceleration but there is boost working against it at this point. During lift off there isn't, and it was as I got back on the accelerator that I was seeing vast amounts of blue smoke exiting the exhaust. The vacuum generated by lift off and a closed throttle was litterally sucking oil past the pistons. Since using torque to monitor the throttle position, I have substantially reduced my oil consumption.

It is entirely possible the low ECM voltage supply is caused by something else, but VIDA is showing a message below the DTC's saying it's 'Checking the Alternator Freewheel Pulley.' I've also had a leak from the Power Steering Pump. The wire from the Alternator was green with a light coloured stripe, but I couldn't tell if it was a dirty white or a pale grey. I say this only because of the green/pale grey stripe wires I found in the loom. At least one of these is a 12v switchable supply for the EGR. I haven't had time to trace the other 5 wires spliced into it yet.

What does baffle me is the complete lack of relevant DTC's. Maybe it's because the entire ECM is affected and there simply isn't the safety net there to identify this problem. The ECM also adjusts it's values over time and it's possible this is why I only picked it up when I replaced the Pressure Sensor(s) I've tried two new sensors and both resulted in a low signal fault.

It's worth mentioning that according to VIDA, there were two different Alternators used in the Euro4. Maybe this is why only some cars are affected.

I appreciate a lot of this is speculation. However, the ECM voltage supply isn't, that's fact. It.may yet transpire that the Alternator and Governor are ok and it's a bad ground or short in the Supply,. Eitherway, substancially reduced ECM Voltage can occur amd mess with a lot of systems without any indication whatsoever that something is wrong.

It's possible the car will still use a little oil, but oil rings aren't known for being selective about when and where they choose to allow oil pass. In my car for sure, the oil consumption goes through the roof during regeneration, which of course is usually instigated by a high presssire signal, rather than counters. I'm struggling to get more than 10mins to 20mins a day to investigate matters further. However, I will not give up until I have concrete proof of what is going on under that bonnet.
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Old Oct 18th, 2018, 22:57   #17
Nickthecook
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Default Indication of ECM Power Supply Problem, not in handbook.

A little homework for all those with this problem. Keep a watchful eye on 'CHECK ENGINE' symbol (Orange engine symbol that signifies an Emission Control problem) when you turn the key to ignition Pos2. If this fails to illuminate, it means there's an ECM Power Issue. I came across this info in VIDA and had a quick scan, but couldn't see anything in the owners handbook.

Sometimes mine lights up, other times it doesn't. Out of curiosity, does anyone have an Antenna/Light Ring Fault? (Does the light around the ignition keyhole work?)
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d5244t4, egr, euro 4 d5, oil burning, soot filter full warning


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