From XC60 to Porsche Macan or BMW X3?

[NigelDay]

Arianne - your ears must have been burning. Just this last Wednesday, we took a pleasant trip up the A68 through Jedburgh and onto Duns. Passed the Lloyd JLR garage in Kelso. Thought to myself, we are in Arianne country. Wonder how he is getting on. Its been a bit quiet recently.
I would echo SuffolkBoy. If you can 'exit' before 23 March with minimal financial loss (apart from the wheels, which I am sure you can sell next Autumn), then I would press the 'QUIT JLR' button. I just feel they have a fundamental (and similar ?) problem with both the F-Pace and the Velar. It's a great shame but it is NOT the job of the early adopters of new models to perform fault-testing.
Where do you go from here ? I don't know. Having just mentioned 'early adopters', do you think a fully loaded 'new' XC60 would be worth a look, with Polestar added ? Certainly cheaper than £70k. Having read most of the reviews of the new XC60, they are nearly all very positive. That's a good start.
There's a new-platform Macan just around the corner, but if Mrs A doesn't like the look of it, then you can't go down that route - and again it would make you an 'early adopter'. There's also the new X3 which is getting good reviews, but as always it needs an extended test drive to know if the reviews are really truthful.
Have you any winter holiday photographs to share ?
Good luck with your forward decision.

[K5 Gus]

Still not understanding why you don't just put a nice set of 20" wheels on if you like the rest of the car so much. Will it really look that terrible ?

And my previous suggestion from back in November still stands, lease for a year an Audi A6 Allroad Sport BiTDi. 320bhp. List £56k, but someone said DtD were doing them for £47k back then

[Crockers]

Time for the Skoda Superb and put this thread to bed

[Arianne]

I know, I know. The Skoda Superb (which Mrs A won’t accept). I have a few days to mull this over before the six month deadline. I have tried examining this logically.....

Plus side:

1. Mrs A is in love with the Velar
2. It is generally a lovely car, performed brilliantly in the recent heavy snow and on our winter ski holiday in Austria
3. Doing nothing and just letting the 23 March deadline pass is easiest as it’s the Do Nothing Option
4. We’re all exhausted so just Put Up and Shut Up might be best (that’s our family although you guys might be feeling the same with this thread)

Down Side:

1. Cost to get out, I have no idea but that worries me
2. I have £300 of snow chains in the garage
3. And £1,000 of winter tyres
4. What if this half-shaft problem is more than just a noise but turns out to be a wear & tear item in due course?
5. It just keeps droning on (sorry, couldn’t resist that)

In some ways it’s also the principle of the matter that is important to me. I have acted in good faith throughout and I expect likewise. To promise something, in writing, and then renege upon it is just plain wrong. It’s wrong on a Vauxhall Astra and it’s certainly wrong on a £70k+ Range Rover Velar. See attachment.

[NigelDay]

A revised A6 is coming soon, so a fully loaded A6 Allroad as suggested will be available with very keen pricing. The A6 is a well established model. Worth a test drive before 23 March ?

[simonjedrake]

Hi Arriane.
Welcome back my friend, it’s a great pleasure to hear your latest news which unfortunately was “kind” of expected as both of your new cars shared the same drivetrain.
So were do you go now:
1. Just accept the current car but get JLR to supply FOC the next size down wheels that will eliminate the problem but keep the existing wheels until/when/if JLR can produce the fix at some future point in 2018/19..........
2. Accept that your desire for 101% perfection in the car is impossible to attain and just accept it as it if which will be almost 99% perfect.
3. Move on from the whole JLR saga and look at another manufacturer.
4. Or better the devil you know than the one you don’t - and return to Volvo.

The reviews of the new XC60 have been amazing with it winning award after award and is now into its 2nd version with the MY19 orders now being taken for May delivery.
Are you been following the new XC60 sub-forum group and the thread towards the top on the new MY19 XC60 that is very useful. https://www.volvoforums.org.uk/showthread.php?t=278247

For what’s is worth, my 2nd XC60 will soon be 3 years old needing a replacement. So after having explored alternative SUV’s in the £50k to £60k range over the last 6 months including the F-Pace which was my preferred choice (in 20” wheels!) until the new XC60 came out which was such a leap in design to be an equal match to anything Germanic that my decision was made for me........the only question was timing. I am in regular connact with Volvo UK’s Head of Customer Experience trying to determine if/when Volvo UK will make available for MY19.5 the T6 Powertrain (that is available in almost all the rest of the world) otherwise my 3rd XC60 will be the T5 option.

My secret wish would be to have you back as a fully paid up member of this forum........so I have to ask - have you and the family had a test drive in the new generation XC60 yet?

[MikeIOW]

Originally Posted by Arianne

I know, I know. The Skoda Superb (which Mrs A won’t accept). I have a few days to mull this over before the six month deadline. I have tried examining this logically.....

Plus side:

1. Mrs A is in love with the Velar
2. It is generally a lovely car, performed brilliantly in the recent heavy snow and on our winter ski holiday in Austria
3. Doing nothing and just letting the 23 March deadline pass is easiest as it’s the Do Nothing Option
4. We’re all exhausted so just Put Up and Shut Up might be best (that’s our family although you guys might be feeling the same with this thread)

Down Side:

1. Cost to get out, I have no idea but that worries me
2. I have £300 of snow chains in the garage
3. And £1,000 of winter tyres
4. What if this half-shaft problem is more than just a noise but turns out to be a wear & tear item in due course?
5. It just keeps droning on (sorry, couldn’t resist that)

In some ways it’s also the principle of the matter that is important to me. I have acted in good faith throughout and I expect likewise. To promise something, in writing, and then renege upon it is just plain wrong. It’s wrong on a Vauxhall Astra and it’s certainly wrong on a £70k+ Range Rover Velar. See attachment.

Hi stranger, glad to hear you on here....although this is terrible to read: I feel for you

Frankly, if Mrs A loves it, I think you will be living with it. I would still ask firmly what the cost to reject is: as you say, you have acted in good faith and they have failed you badly.

Once you decide to keep (which I believe you will), heading over to Auto Express is not a bad shout. Are others (I assume you are on a Velar/JLR forum!) also experiencing it?

If different wheels solve it, I would insist they supply you with them until they resolve the issue to keep your custom.

Very very tricky. I feel the winter tyres/chains are a bit of a red herring when you are at that level of motor.

Good luck!!

[taylorc]

Hi Arianne
Just my tuppence worth, whilst I left the world of Volvo some 5 months ago now (and had hardly used this site for some time before that) I have been keeping a close eye on this post as it has been a very informative and interesting topic.....

I have moved back to the world of Audi to an Audi A4 Black Edition (where my heart belongs) and my daughter has literally just taken delivery of a Jaguar F-Pace R-Sport. Having spent a few hours as a passenger I feel that I can comment.... in short the Jaguar does not come close to the quality of the Audi in both build and comfort!!

Have you not considered the new Q5? I was going to order one until I found out the lead time as I absolutely loved it but couldn't wait 9 months (I was desperate to get out of the Volvo!). Another option would be the Q7 which whilst more money than a Q5 is on another level for comfort...... may be worth considering??

[isleaiw]

Arianne

Sorry to hear that its not gone as well as you hoped and indeed it should have done. I actually found you on the Velar Forum, partly as I was thinking of one (only half heartedly given the costs involved and as my son in law to be had rejected his company lease F Pace due to electrical gremlins....) and so I have answered there but will repeat here - reject. The costs should be minimal (aside from the wheels and chains which can be sold secondhand) as it is JLR's fault that they cannot remedy the issue.

As for what next, the Superb obviously. Failing that, a new XC60 or 90 may be worth a look - the 90 is also coming as a T5 shortly so you can avoid the 4 cylinder diesel rattle.

But i would also be looking at Audi. If the size doesnt bother you a nice Q7 should be right up your street - at the budget for the Velar you may even get an SQ7 with a bit of haggling. If you dont mind the fuel costs then the SQ5 is a very nice place to be - but perhaps not what you are looking for as it is a bit less comfort oriented and a bit more performance biased...

I certainly would not risk JLR not finding a fix for another 18 months - the issue will nag away until they do. Smaller wheels are an option but in my view the Velar is massively sensitive to colour and spec - and some look downright hideous (all in my opinion, obviously).

Good luck whatever you do.

And welcome "home"

[Arianne]

Dear All,

Profuse apologies if I am boring the pants off of some Volvo members over my continuing battle with JLR about our faulty Velar. As they say on the BBC "Look away now if you do not wish to know the scores"!

Firstly, thank you to everyone who has taken the time to offer advice and guidance.

The overwhelming majority view is that I should reject the car and walk away from JLR.

A few have suggested trading down on the wheel size to silence the noisy bearings but, as isleaiw said in his/her last post, the Velar is sensitive to the configuration. In my eyes, a Velar with 20" wheels is a decent looking machine but certainly not worth £70k. Some would say, and I might be inclined to agree with you, that a £70k+ price tag on a RR Velar is pushing at the limit of what should be possible anyway!!!

Tonight I glanced back at my very first post on 27 January 2016. How I started this project with such great joy, enthusiasm and happiness. The lad had left Edinburgh University and was happily engaged in his chosen profession, we had entered our 50s, our parents were fit despite being elderly and our mortgage was finished. Mrs A and I looked forward to having some fun in life and the decision to buy a premium car as a discretionary spend seemed like it would add to the experience.

Now, over two years downstream, I am exhausted and completely jammed into indecision (I think the two are connected).

Mrs A loves the Velar. She tells me that she has been able to differentiate between the car and JLR. She can live with the rotational noise from the OSF wheel bearings, the fact that the ground breaking ICT insists on playing the 10538 Overture from the Electric Light Orchestra every time a new journey begins due to a software glitch, the remote start function fails to initiate the heated windscreen making cold weather preconditioning a pointless affair, the electronic tailgate periodically has a nervous breakdown and starts randomly opening and closing midway through the cycle for no good reason (it has nearly knocked me out), the rear number plate lamp has blown due to condensation intrusion and the latest issue is paint blistering on the gloss black lower valance underneath the rear nearside passenger door.

For Mrs A, she wants to keep the car but hammer JLR into some form of submission via an attempt at public humiliation. Her anger is directed at JLR and not our car. I find this weird but Mrs A is a wonderful, selfless person and she thinks in mysterious ways!

Meanwhile, I am busy negotiating a public sector pay award on a £m payroll with a major UK union, trying to advise upon HMRC lifetime and annual pension allowances in relation to tax charges and juggle caring for our elderly parents who, since January 2016, have fallen ill and need daily care. The Velar was meant to be a source of inspiration for me - when times are tough I set my eyes on this beautiful machine and, together with a basket of other positive thoughts, I keep pushing ahead with my face into the wind.

Sadly, the Velar isn't in the basket of positive things! It's proven to be anything but, as has JLR. What has really wrangled me more than anything else is that they have reneged on their promise to release the fix for my car in the New Year. When I followed up on their written promise they have changed their story and told me that they have no idea when it will be available. Reminds me of Darth Vader when he said "Pray I don't change the deal again" before suffocating the commander of the Star Destroyer! JLR seem to make a promise and then break it at will, with impunity.

In my frustration I have been busy performing light bombing raids on JLR's Twitter and Facebook pages this week. I am a novice but I am getting better and, with a bit more practice, I will perfect the art of both 'carpet bombing' and 'precision bombing'. I have already learned that some of JLR's web pages and social media accounts are more vulnerable and responsive than others.

It's possible that my decision at the weekend to begin my social media campaign may have helped, possibly. A JLR employee called Chand was monitoring their Facebook page and reached out to me, apologising publically for what has occurred and asking for my details. Visitors to JLR's F-Pace, Velar and I-Pace Twitter pages will find my sorry posts.

And so it seems that Amelia, the Customer Relations Team Leader from JLR is to call me tomorrow to discuss my case. Amelia and I have never met but it feels as if we know each other well - it's been 12mths of dialogue from the original rejection of the Jaguar F-Pace.

I only know that I might get this call (I say 'might' as Amelia is a busy JLR employee and doesn't always manage to keep her appointments) because my dealership notified me this evening that I should expect a call from her. I cannot be sure but it does seem to me that my dealer is doing a reasonably decent job at trying to campaign as part of a pincer movement with the shoddy corporate centre of JLR. They have the patience of saints over at Lloyd Kelso!

I have decided to visit my dealership on Friday, depending upon how the conversation with Amelia progresses tomorrow. The window for rejection is running out (although I could argue that it extends beyond six months under the Consumer Rights Act because the original fault remains unfixed by JLR).

The trouble is, I am undecided. If you have got this far in my loooong post then you must be bewildered as to why I am simply not dropping my Velar back at the dealership with a message on the side sprayed out of a shaving can (I'll let you imagine the slogan).

Let me explain. Apart from Mrs A loving the car and my own exhaustion, there are times when I love the Velar too. For example, the other night we were heading back from Jedburgh along the A68 late in the evening. Behind us was what turned out to be a Golf GTD (okay, I would have preferred it to have been a GTi or R32 but I am always honest with you guys). This Golf played with us all of the way home (well almost all of the way, he broke off before I turned onto my drive!!!). I struggled slightly on the twisty sections but the Velar is pretty agile and the straight line acceleration is stunning. Having tired of the sparring, I dropped my nearside indicator but he didn't want to overtake and so we continued on for another few miles. I only discovered it was a GTD when he overtook as I obeyed the limit passing a safety camera on the other side of the road, whereas he couldn't be bothered and whizzed past.

Whether the Velar is being husselled, wafting along or doing 130mph on the unrestricted German autobahn - it is a lovely car. But then again, it isn't - for all the reasons stated earlier in this post.

The lad says get rid of the car, quit JLR, get something cheap for a couple of months, recover and then choose something else.

Guys, we all have our strengths and our weaknesses. One of my weaknesses is that, given more than one free space in the multi-story car park, I become terribly indecisive. Mrs A cries out from the seat next to me, "Just choose one of these slots and park the thing". You get my drift?

So I will leave Amelia to make the next move tomorrow. I will undertake a few more night flight bombing missions on their social media sites. I have a set of three draft letters ready to be sent to the homes of Lloyd Motor Group directors and another being drafted to Ralf Speth, CEO of JLR. I don't know Mr Speth but he is German like my Mother and I suspect he might just share my love of integrity and keeping ones' promises.

Thank you again for your support, advice and opinions. It's been cathartic.

Best wishes, Arianne.

PS. I know, first world problems and all that. And yes, yesterday I did pop some loose change into the hat of the fellow sitting on the pavement outside Sainsbury's as that is what real problems in life are about rather than faulty premium SUVs.