Restoration Order

[230ina245]

There are lots of tutorials on line, You tube in particular, that will help you start welding. Best to practice a lot on some scrap before starting for real.
One you tube series is "Fitzee's fabrication". He does a lot of work with basic tools in a small workshop and explains what he is doing. As a bonus the way he talks reminds me of Popeye!
Getting the car done bit by bit is certainly feasable especially if it not used as a daily driver.
Tim

[Othen]

Originally Posted by Kirtward

Thank you all, amazing support and advice, without telling me I’m an idiot
I am aware this will cost more than it’s worth to make it road worthy. But I’ve always liked 240 particularly the estate for years. This one is already not in a great place and I can’t make it much worse.
I’m sure others could do something with it or strip it for parts.
There are a lot of things I want to learn like welding but I need goal, I could just get a welder and some metal that wouldn’t motivate me.
As I have a boring desk job this was to get me out of the house and I was assume it will take me quite some time. I don’t want perfect, ideal is learning and having some fun if it was running at some point that would be awesome.
Hope that explains everything.

I think body work is the first point then.

Please be assured Kirtward, no one here thinks you are an idiot. We are all delighted that you are willing to take on a project on one of our favourite motor cars. We just want to make sure you understand this may be a bit of a challenge.

If your aim is just to make the 240 roadworthy then that is the most important question answered straight away.

You are right: until you get the body sorted out there isn't any point worrying about the rest - just make a note of any missing bits and start looking for them (free or cheap) for when you need them. You will certainly need some cutting and welding tools, so start looking for those, and when you find then get some practice.

Originally Posted by john.wigley

I think 'Kirtward' may already have a pretty good idea of what he has and would be taking on.

In his post in reply to mine (Nr 3 above), he said "Assume the worst in this instance, the car was cheap possible basket case. I want to learn a few bits and need an end goal. I’m sure I could buy a 240 for the amount it will cost. But for me it’s about the journey, hope that makes sense.". And in his reply to Bob, (Nr 5 above), he said "1988 245 GLT, B230E manual, but currently in the boot.
There are a few naturally occurring ventilation holes that will need to be repaired too.
I have a Haynes already and I’m assuming all rubber components will need to be replaced.".

I do take Alan's point regarding comparison with the R.B., but all projects will differ to a lesser or greater extent and everyone has to start somewhere. I do not think that 'Kirkward' would go far wrong if he were to follow Alan's meticulous approach to the project, especially if he were to also chronicle his progress in a similar manner. That is what I meant by a model in which to tackle it and one in which I would encourage him.

Finally, 'Moomoo's point about corrosion is well made. Yes, that which you can see is important, but it was underbody rot that spelt the end for my 745 GLE. It was something that would have cost me c£500 to repair, where someone with the necessary skills, facilities and equipment could have done it for the cost of the materials alone - probably a lot less than £100.

Any Volvo that has reached it's 35th birthday is surely worth at least trying to save, especially a 245 GLT, arguably the most desirable of the two series cars. 'Kirkward' strikes me as a brave, enterprising sort of chap whose feet are firmly planted on the ground. We should encourage him!

I wish him well in his endeavours.

Regards, John.

Edit: Written before I read 'Kirtward's most recent post, above. J.

I agree John, I applaud Kirtward's bravery. During the RB, GAM and Barge projects I found it really useful to catalogue everything in these pages; I hope Kirtward will do the same and look forward to instalments.

Originally Posted by Kirtward

There are some concerning rust point the front scuttle is one. But I managed to get another one to try and help.
The boot but I have replacement panels and also the edges of the floor pan but I have seen they are available also.

Eeeeeek! That will take a fair bit of fixing . The other places 240s rust (a lot) is the rear wheel arches, the sills, the floor and the tailgate on estates. I'd suggest getting the motor car lifted up as high as you can (on ramps, axles stands or trestles) to have a really good reconnaissance. Look at Juular's thread and you will see where to expect rust.

Is the gearbox really in the boot, or did I misunderstand that (it doesn't really matter at this stage, the body needs fixing first)?

Good fortune,

Alan

[Kirtward]

Yeah you read that correct, gearbox is a known good working replacement and currently in the boot along with most of the interior which I stripped. In between me buy it and now my partner decided lol (we decided) to build and extension. So I lost my garage.

[Kirtward]

On the bright side my in-law respect a shed and garage and help me build this.

[Othen]

Originally Posted by Kirtward

Yeah you read that correct, gearbox is a known good working replacement and currently in the boot along with most of the interior which I stripped. In between me buy it and now my partner decided lol (we decided) to build and extension. So I lost my garage.

You probably needed the house extension more than a garage, so no matter. I doubt that a single garage would have been big enough for a 240 restoration anyway. It is good that you have a big shed though, it will be ideal to store all the stuff you take out and your tools.

Juular had nothing more for his 240 build, just eat your Weetabix. It would be a good idea to acquire some sort of canopy and windbreak, particularly when you are welding. Again Juular's threads (his Amazon thread as well) have lots of good tips.

Put the gearbox in a safe place for the moment, you won't be needing it for some time. If the engine is out as well that might make access a bit easier for welding at the front. It will be easier to work on the engine with it out as well.

It might be worth asking here on the forum for recommendations for MIG welding equipment and other tools you will need (in particular Burdekin and Juular are very knowlegable). This is a really exciting project - good fortune.

Alan

Good fortune Kirtward,

[Moomoo]

Originally Posted by Kirtward

There are some concerning rust point the front scuttle is one. But I managed to get another one to try and help.
The boot but I have replacement panels and also the edges of the floor pan but I have seen they are available also.

You are clearly ready for your challenge, a major undertaking!

When completed, you will have a car you know inside out.

Brilliant!

Power to you!👍🧐

[Kirtward]

Thanks Moomoo for the vote of confidence
And Tim I really like Fitzee's, it makes it look effortless, which means it will be really hard

So welding questions -
What gauge of metal and wire would be best for practicing?
Could this be done with a flux core or have to shell out for gas shielded mig?
Is there a base setting on a welder to start with for this kind of work?

Thanks again

[Bugjam1999]

First off, good luck with the project and do post updates as you progress

If you have no welding experience at all and don’t have an experienced mate with a lot of free time who is happy to teach you, I highly recommend a evening/weekend welding course - look at your local 6th form college, most of them offer course like this, or just google ‘adult learning welding course’ and see what you find.

I know a lot of people will say just get on with it and that they learnt by doing, but welding can be incredibly frustrating when you’re starting out, blowing holes in sheet metal, or warping it from heat or failing to stick things together at all. Learning in a workshop environment with someone available to show you what you’re doing right and wrong is time and money well spent in my experience.

I did a week long course a while back before starting on my car and it gave me the necessary knowledge and confidence to get on with it. Of course you keep learning as you go, but starting with a decent understanding of the basics will save you a lot of time, effort and heartache.

Also, as others have said there are a lot of YouTube videos out there, I watched a lot when I was starting out.

Cheers

[Juular]

Go for it. The skills and confidence earned will be more than worth it.

It will cost more in time and money than you plan for, and what the car is worth. But that doesn't mean you shouldn't. I restored mine with a similar mission - to learn how to weld and repair almost anything on a car. I hadn't even driven a 240 before when I bought it, I just liked the shape.

I also have a desk job, in IT, and suffer serious mental health issues because of it, but the 240 project really helped me get things back in order and have something to look forward to. I owe the project more than it owes me.

You will end up learning about more than just welding and fabrication, as I'll bet there's a fair amount of electrical parts needing stripped and rebuilt. I found all of it interesting and educational.

I bought mine for £500 with similar rust issues and I needed to replace almost everything in terms of suspension and engine consumables. I could have done it cheaper but I reckon I spent around a year of work and £2000 or so restoring my 240 to an MOT standard. Nothing in itself was particularly expensive as parts are cheap and easy to get, on the whole. Some unexpected faulty parts stung though. The key is that many expensive components can be stripped and rebuilt for next to nothing if you're prepared to get stuck in.

I love my 240, it's an absolutely cracking car. The best part is driving in a car you can honestly say you've "sorted" inside and out and you know every nut and bolt.

Don't let the windscreen rust bother you, especially if you have a replacement scuttle. I had to fabricate one out of thin air and honestly found it an enjoyable challenge. Do prepare for a replacement windscreen though as it WILL crack when removed.

If you go ahead, keep in touch and ask lots of questions. I'm sure we've developed a pretty good resource on this forum for answers to common questions and what kind of things to look out for.

[Juular]

Originally Posted by Kirtward

Thanks Moomoo for the vote of confidence
And Tim I really like Fitzee's, it makes it look effortless, which means it will be really hard

So welding questions -
What gauge of metal and wire would be best for practicing?
Could this be done with a flux core or have to shell out for gas shielded mig?
Is there a base setting on a welder to start with for this kind of work?

Thanks again

The majority of bodywork repairs are best done with 1mm mild steel. You'll want to practice the thin metal technique which is not so much welding as laying down a series of joined up tack welds.

Chassis rail repairs will be 2mm mild steel.

0.6mm wire is neater and easier to control the heat, but it's a toss up really between that and 0.8mm. You will quickly get used to whatever you have.

I did my 240 using gas shielded MIG, as everyone recommended this for a beginner.

Honestly, if I was starting again I'd just go for flux core and extra time spent practicing with it. It has made my life so much easier not having to wait for a calm windless day to do the welding, and also not having to lug the gas bottle around. I'd also say it's cheaper overall, despite the flux cored wire being around twice the price.

I'd say it's important to get an inverter welder that gives you infinite adjustment of voltage and wire speed, as that fine control can give you the difference between a nice weld and a frustrating mess.

I learned by getting some scrap 1mm steel and cutting lots of lines in it with tin snips, and welding them shut.

Here is the thin metal technique you need.

https://www.mig-welding.co.uk/thin-metal.htm