Rusty cars

[phil1968]

Originally Posted by Prufrock

Youtube footage is a little misleading.

Although Volvo 700s had galvanising treatment on certain structures and panels from launch.

Jon.

What are you saying, stuff on Youtube in general can't be relied upon or this particular fella's statements?

[Prufrock]

You decide, I know what I know.

Jon.

N.B Volvo 700 structure treatment - diagram is 700 estate.

[phil1968]

OK, well that didn't answer my question & I'm still unclear as to what you meant by "Youtube footage is a little misleading", but thanks anyway
I was not aware that the 700 series Volvos were galavanised though, hence why they didn't rust as much compared to their contemporarys.

[Father Ted]

With regards to "Grey Imports" comment.
I had a Toytoa Townace and then Estima, the Estima for over 10 years. Not a sign of rust on either of them.
Noticeable the UK versions (Spacecruiser and Previa) all seem to develop rust, so I don't think UK market vehicles are better protected. I did find the build quality better than the UK versions.

When I got my V70, I'd looked at a few Mercedes C class of the same age. Price was similar. Difference was, the V70s were all structurally sound, even the battered ones. The Mercs all had rust. Can't see me ever buying a Merc.....

[m0bzy]

Jaguars rust where you cannot see,behind plastic sill panels in particular. I met a lad who worked for a Merc main dealer ,any rust spotted during service was repaired and not mentioned even to the owner.
Saab were galvanised to waist level,I have had three,no rust at all . 1997 Volvo V90 only the battery box.

[luggsey]

Worst of the new cars I see for rust are Dihatsu (spelling?) when I was looking for a small 4WD for my Dad I considered a Terios until I saw how they rust!
My old Freelander had no structure rust at 18 years old, just the odd bracket underneath showing surface rust.
My old 2A in the field has almost no chassis left!
How times have changed.

[jm1489]

In my downtime I troll through the interweb looking for motoring bargains and to keep my eye in on prices.
Several newer makes/models pop up as being prone to rust.. Jaguar X type, Mazda, Ford KA to name a few. A lot does come down to their location, I don't buy anything off the coast and it is hard to find Counties which don't salt their roads.
I parked next to a 2015 Kia and that had serious rust at the bottom of the A post. These days I tend to think less about the rust and more about Cambelts, electronics, fuel pumps and injectors. Although rust proofing has improved I think more manufacturers are building their cars to a price with a shorter life expectancy, even in the luxury market.
Buyer seem more interested in gadgets and shiny bits these days rather than quality steel. Cars are certainly more of a consumer item much like a washing machine and this can be seen in heavy depreciation.

[john.wigley]

Originally Posted by jm1489

In my downtime I troll through the interweb looking for motoring bargains and to keep my eye in on prices.
Several newer makes/models pop up as being prone to rust.. Jaguar X type, Mazda, Ford KA to name a few. A lot does come down to their location, I don't buy anything off the coast and it is hard to find Counties which don't salt their roads.
I parked next to a 2015 Kia and that had serious rust at the bottom of the A post. These days I tend to think less about the rust and more about Cambelts, electronics, fuel pumps and injectors. Although rust proofing has improved I think more manufacturers are building their cars to a price with a shorter life expectancy, even in the luxury market.
Buyer seem more interested in gadgets and shiny bits these days rather than quality steel. Cars are certainly more of a consumer item much like a washing machine and this can be seen in heavy depreciation.

I think that is so, 'jm1489'; is that a nod to BMC 'B' series BTW?

My 1951 Ford Anglia rusted due to poor quality post-war steel. My 1959 Standard 10 due to the inherent weakness of early monocoque construction. My 1959 Metropolitan needed a whole new floor at eight years old!

As 'Prufrock' points out, manufacturers such as Volvo got a grip on corrosion issues in the eighties. My 1987 745 GLE, which had lived outside for at least the previous 18 years, only succumbed to rust in 2016.

Mechanical components have also similarly improved. The fifties Ford and Standard both required a top overhaul every 10K and a major rebuild every 30K. My 745 had 170K up when it was retired, and my wife ran a 744 to over 250K: neither ever required any major engine work.

I think you are also right about people preferring 'bling' over substance in their cars. This is blatantly encouraged by the manufacturers in the interests of greater sales, which in turn fuels the 'throw-away' culture that prevails today.

The advent of 'digital' cars brought with it an ever increasing use of electronics, and you are again correct to point to this as the Achilles' heal of modern cars. Heat and vibration are both anathema to electronics. You wouldn't drive around with a lap-top in the engine compartment, yet that is precisely what we are doing with the cars of today. Is it then any surprise that they fail after 10 years or so and often render the vehicle beyond economic repair?

Another personal gripe is that cars are engineered for ease of assembly on the production line, with little consideration given to later repair or maintenance. It should not take two hours and require partially dismantling the front end of the car to change a head-lamp bulb, for example!

Regards, John.

[jm1489]

Hi John, My Wife's Megane CC is a prime example of dismantling the car to change a bulb! I have it down to a fine, that plus a faulty window actuator (design fault) were the reasons I got the car at a knock down price a few years back. The Owner didn't didn't want to pay out £35+ to change a headlight bulb and resented a bill for £140 to be told the window was faulty, when I repaired it I found the garage had just jubilee clipped the window shut! I have spent quite a few years around cars old and new, most of the time fixing them myself. Not sure if I have an issue with modern cars or bad garages who don't know how to work on a modern car? My friend was told his turbo was U/S and that the pump would also need changing, £1000+, I asked to look at it before he scrapped it.. small vacuum line had come off!? Took my Citroen to specialist.. fuel pump knackered.. nah.. yep, knackered.. nah.. £50 later and new fuel solenoid.. sorted! Spoke to local garage about changing the variable valve actuator as I didn't have the time.. the variable what? Garage hadn't heard of it before, which seems strange considering how many new cars have them? In-laws car started overheating.. Luton garage tested the car, head gasket gone! My reply was b@ll@%ks, turned out to be a sticking brake caliper! You have to be so careful these days as most garages will plug in diagnostics and work through a "lets replace" sheet before getting to the fault.

[Grimble]

Originally Posted by jm1489

Hi John, My Wife's Megane CC is a prime example of dismantling the car to change a bulb! I have it down to a fine, that plus a faulty window actuator (design fault) were the reasons I got the car at a knock down price a few years back. The Owner didn't didn't want to pay out £35+ to change a headlight bulb and resented a bill for £140 to be told the window was faulty, when I repaired it I found the garage had just jubilee clipped the window shut! I have spent quite a few years around cars old and new, most of the time fixing them myself. Not sure if I have an issue with modern cars or bad garages who don't know how to work on a modern car? My friend was told his turbo was U/S and that the pump would also need changing, £1000+, I asked to look at it before he scrapped it.. small vacuum line had come off!? Took my Citroen to specialist.. fuel pump knackered.. nah.. yep, knackered.. nah.. £50 later and new fuel solenoid.. sorted! Spoke to local garage about changing the variable valve actuator as I didn't have the time.. the variable what? Garage hadn't heard of it before, which seems strange considering how many new cars have them? In-laws car started overheating.. Luton garage tested the car, head gasket gone! My reply was b@ll@%ks, turned out to be a sticking brake caliper! You have to be so careful these days as most garages will plug in diagnostics and work through a "lets replace" sheet before getting to the fault.

On a similar note, I heard a comment the other day the the medical profession was going down a similar route. Medical training today revolves around testing the patient and acting upon the test results. In the old days training was about assessing the symptoms and diagnosing the problem. Of course both vehicle engineering and medicine have progressed remarkably in recent years but my wife (trained the old school way) can accurately diagnose a great many ailments long before any instrument goes near. If I was a car I'd have been scrapped a long time ago.