Should I get my car Rica'd?

[Andy]

Do it!!

Adam Rica'd my 855R and I loved that so much I Rica'd the wifes 1.8T Passat and turned that into a monster 'Q' car ;) Dyno'd at 192 brake at Power Engineering. (150 standard).

The Passat had done 80k miles in 3 years and we've done another 25k on it with nothing other than routine maintenance.

Cheers

Doorman, the RICA isn't harsh on the auto. In fact it makes the auto box even nicer.

Adam.

[sholtby]

Thanks for all the comments.
The one that stands out the most is the one from Sarge. Now admittably you haven't had a Rica upgrade but I'd be gutted if I felt the same way you do. Compared to a stock motor I'd expect to be blown away by the improvement and not even consider wanting to return it to stock.
I'm already extremely pleased with my Dawes mbc valve. For those who dont know this is a spring loaded valve that connects the turbo pressure pipe that normally goes to the red inlet on the boost control solenoid directly to the wastegate. So the wastegate stays firmly shut and then snaps open at a given pressure. If you floor the throttle the boost gauge goes straight to the end of the stock boost gauge (14 psi) and stays rock solid, no spikes or fluctuations in pressure like stock.
Andy didnt you try one of these as I think you offered it to Nigel to try? How does it compare to a Rica?
Now some of you wont like the idea of the ecu not being able to control the boost pressure but remember that if a knock is detected the ecu first retards the ignition and then adds more fuel before cutting the boost so it still has quite a lot of control even though it has lost that boost control ability. If anything looking from the colour of the the exhaust pipe and plugs after a hard run I'd say it runs rich rather than weak which we all know is a good thing.
In answer to Dons question my car is a '95 850 T5 and I live in Richmond, Yorkshire a stones throw away from Darlington but a long way from everyone else here.
The reason I would prefer a Rica upgrade is greed. It quotes the best gains in performance. If they are incorrect let me know. I suppose there could be an argument that reliability suffers in an attempt to get the highest figures and sales.
Adams offer of a full refund if not satisfied is very tempting and I suppose there is nothing to lose. You would definately give me an unconditional full refund if I'm not happy? I'm not the sort to mess people about but I'd like to think I was getting my monies worth.
Another thing I might do is put my car on a local dyno. There are 2 within 10 miles! To see just what power my car has. Its the only real way to make a real comparison. The 'butt dyno' isn't as accurate but its what puts a smile on your face when you know your tunning efforts have been successful.
Thanks again

Simon

Simon,

With the exception of postage, we would indeed give you a 100% refund. That is a promise, which we offer to all our customers.

Another possibility would be for us to send you a pre-programmed ECU, correct for your model. Your car would then not even be off the road, so it's even more convenient for you. Then if you don't like it, just send it back and we will give you the full refund, as promised. The worst case scenario will be that the ECU upgrade doesn't provide substantial enough gains over the MBC for your liking, and you will have lost nothing except a small amount on postage. Since you are not coming to our workshop and therefore we will not be in a position to make any mechanical corrections to your car if it doesn't perform to spec, I think this is the best option for you.

Adam.

ps. I wasn't talking about detonation resulting in boost lowering or ignition retard - I was talking about the built in safe-mode, where the ECU sets the boost to a low psi value if there is some sort of problem which the ECU thinks is serious enough to put the car into safe-mode to prevent engine damage.

[foggyjames]

Simon,

My advice would be...if you've got an MBC set at 14psi...I think you're gonna be disappointed with £600 of chip.

Yes, it'll alter the *delivery* in a way an MBC just can't, but if its more power you're looking for...you want the ability to squirt and spark at the right time at more like 20psi. Whether a T5 can standard that much boost in terms of internal strength, I don't know.

One of the biggest jokes out there was the 'superchip' for the 740 turbo. £500-600 bought you a £100 chip and a bunch of guys to use an MBC to up the boost (the chip providing the extended fuel and ignition maps).

I would assume that the more modern chips are more advanced than that, and they can probably do 'wilder' versions than most people have (I certainly know Adam has mentioned different 'extremeties' of the same basic chip), but if you're already at 14psi, I think you're already at the 'basic package' most people go for.

I've noticed that MBC's seem to have a bad reputation amoungst the T5 community (not especially on this site) - indeed one of the 'power increase' ebay info-auctions says something like "I won't have you upping the boost and overboosting". As long as you're careful and sensible, an MBC is perfectly safe and provides remarkably stable boost for such a simple device. There are plenty of cars out there with nothing more than a *home made* bleed valve mighty faster than a 'chipped' T5!

cheers

James

[sarge]

Please don't get me wrong, the re-map does produce much more acceleration; more on that below. First, however, let me say that I think that the facility for being able to do the upgrade oneself and being able to change between upgrade and stock is excellent - very easy and quick to do. That was really my main reason for going with the BSR PPC.

On the power issue, it certainly gives much better acceleration. 2nd gear manouvers from c15-20mph and 3rd gear manouvers from about 50 mph are incredbly swift and decisive. But even accelerating from c30 in third (e.g. when leaving a village) or planting your right foot at higher speeds in fourth or even fifth also produces stronger pull than as stock. From that point of view it's great. However, because the torque curve of the re-map is quite different from the stock torque curve, it's a different car to drive and I haven't yet fully got to grips with the differences. For example, it doesn't seem to pull quite as readily from really low revs. and the power tails off more quickly than before. It's quite weird but as stock you could very easily red line it, whereas now that actually seems less of a problem; you get the very rapid initial burst of acceleration which thrusts you forward but then c5000+ rpm it seems to hold back a bit and a gear change feels necessary. It's maybe not a bad thing.

I've also experienced the odd miss-fire with it, which I've never had as stock. That was a bit disconcerting. Simon at PFS tells me the re-map shouldn't cause that and it could be to do with the upgrade showing up other problems with the engine rather than being the fault of the upgrade per se. That said, when it's pulling without a hiccup, which in fairness is most of the time, it's strong and smooth.

I'm also still trying to get used to the idea that the engine isn't operating as Volvo made it and I find that hard to come to terms with - always worried about possible problems. In some ways I'm still a bit nervous about having the re-map, but I'm sure in time I'll settle into it more. It's still early days really. I suspect that my aprehension with the upgrade stems as much from the 'physcology' of having it as from the re-map itself.

Just on the fuel consumption side of things, I would say that under 'normal' driving (i.e. driving as per my IAM training) it is no less economical than stock, and I would even dare to suggest it may be a little more economical. However, it uses a bit more fuel when you unleash the power. So, if you hammer it all the time, fuel consumption will probably drop. Whereas for me, I'm not finding any increase in fuel consumption.

To summarise: in terms of extra power, the upgrade is very satisfying. I'm also not experiencing any loss in economy and I can switch between stock and upgrade quickly and easily - I like that! The car's driving characteristics are different from stock and I'm still getting used to the differences, and I'm also still coming to terms with the up-grade concept.

Sorry it's a long post but I hope that helps. Feel free to send me a PM if you wish to discuss further.

Sarge
'99 V70 AWD

[don kalmar union]

Simon,

If your car has the earlier Motronic 4.4 ECU, you will certainly not be disappointed with the purchase of a TME engineered software upgrade priced at £299 plus VAT.

TME and I have particularly priced these earlier upgrades in the UK at a very fair market price as the high cost of some similar competative offerings can represent a substantial percentage of the current market value of these cars. With their very high turnover of this product over many years, TME have amortised much of their original developement cost.

If you are considering other physical items such as exhaust components then I can offer some very sharp prices.... but you will need to contact me directly.

Don.Norchi.

www.kalmar-union.com

TME engineered software UK distributor.

Perhaps James is right, you may be disappointed with the £590 RICA over MBC. Then again, perhaps not. The only way to know for sure is to try it. That's why you get 14 days to evaluate it, because this gives you the chance to really test it in terms of performance, economy, smoothness, power delivery etc etc.

Adam.

[sholtby]

Adam,

I'd like to take you up on your offer to try a Rica upgrade. I'm guessing there is about a 50% chance that I'll think it is a substantial improvement over my current set up so if you are happy to work with those odds and refund my money excluding any postage costs if I'm not happy then you have got a deal.
You mentioned that you could send me a pre-programmed ecu. How would that work? Would you need a deposit refundable when I send you my ecu? I dont mind sending you my ecu if thats easier.
Am I correct in thinking the cost is £570 including postage and VOC discount?

Thanks

Simon

Hi Simon,

Yeah I'm happy to work with those odds! I realise it's a tall order, given that I cannot see the car, but it's still worth a try :) The cost will be £570 as you state, £560 for the ECU and £10 for postage. To send you a ready programmed ECU, I need your ECU number and vehicle details including mileage, registration, and VIN code, and your VOC membership proof.

The ECU number is the Bosch number beginning with 0261 on the top of the ECU. If you need help finding this number, let me know.

If you need any help, please call me on 01527 577710 or email me at info@chiptuninguk.com

Cheers,
Adam.