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240 GLT saloon restoration project

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Old Feb 22nd, 2021, 16:54   #31
Bob Meadows
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Good work & dedication:~
Do you use/tried seam sealer on those exposed joins? (worth doing)
Regards Bob.
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Old Feb 22nd, 2021, 18:56   #32
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bob Meadows View Post
Good work & dedication:~
Do you use/tried seam sealer on those exposed joins? (worth doing)
Regards Bob.
Hi Bob. Thanks. Yes I'll be sealing all flanges and overlaps with either seam sealer or body sealant. Then blowing some cavity wax through. All hidden faces are painted too. I have a lot of tidy up to do regarding the welds and panels but I'll do that all in the next phase once the metal replacement is complete.
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Old Feb 22nd, 2021, 22:02   #33
Bob Meadows
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Good man:~ The cavity wax also works well if diluted with clean engine oil particularly in box sections & inner sills - I also use a shultz gun with the flexible hose.
Kinking the hose is great fun!!
Good Luck.
Bob.
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Old Mar 10th, 2021, 12:10   #34
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Progress waylayid by weather..





Time to start repairing this..







Sill patches for the clip locations which had rotted through.





I could then fit the pillar base that I fabricated ages ago.



And the final patch here.









Saving all the grinding for later!
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Old Mar 10th, 2021, 12:24   #35
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Suspension strip down.



















Unfortunately the crossmember has lost metal surrounding the flange.



These are basically impossible to come by so I have no other choice but to repair.. see the only alternative I found in the background, which is actually overall worse.

















Aside from the crossmember all I technically need to replace is one spring, but I have decided to refresh a lot of other bits anyway.
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Old Mar 10th, 2021, 13:52   #36
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I don't want to worry you and to be honest, i'm not 100% certain on this rule (clarification from a bona fide MoT tester would be good please!) but i'm fairly sure welded repairs to sub-frames are a fail point for the MoT - thing is they need to see it's been welded to fail it and judging from the rest of your work that could be nigh on impossible!

I've never understood this rule (if in fact it is a rule) but suspect it dates back to the era of the Mini (the real one, not the BMW thing that is now the antithesis of its name) where rear subframes would regularly rot faster than a Fiat in a saline solution. Repairs were often made using pigeon poo and putty and usually only lasted long enough to get an MoT and sell the death-trap to some poor unsuspecting mug. Said mug then drives said Mini as if they're an extra in The Italian Job only to find the subframe departs from the body leaving them in a very unenviable state!

That said, if the weld repairs are done properly i see no reason why the repair shouldn't be at least as strong as the original metal.
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Old Mar 10th, 2021, 13:53   #37
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You could do with a local friendly media blaster:~ any nearby?
I found a couple near my home prepared to do car items- one is a barge restorer- blasts & zinc metal sprays- the things will last forever!

I only ever met the man once face to face the rest of the time he was in the black hole blasting away- Just used to shout up "more car parts" leave then in the cabin and call Friday- call Friday parts ready-bit shout from the black hole just leave the money on the desk! brilliant.
Finding a sympathetic company towards classic cars is worthwhile.

Good work as usual-keep the picture coming please.
Regards Bob
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Old Mar 10th, 2021, 14:08   #38
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I really enjoyed reading this, it looks as though you are doing a great job!

Well done!
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Old Mar 10th, 2021, 14:20   #39
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Laird Scooby View Post
I don't want to worry you and to be honest, i'm not 100% certain on this rule (clarification from a bona fide MoT tester would be good please!) but i'm fairly sure welded repairs to sub-frames are a fail point for the MoT - thing is they need to see it's been welded to fail it and judging from the rest of your work that could be nigh on impossible!

I've never understood this rule (if in fact it is a rule) but suspect it dates back to the era of the Mini (the real one, not the BMW thing that is now the antithesis of its name) where rear subframes would regularly rot faster than a Fiat in a saline solution. Repairs were often made using pigeon poo and putty and usually only lasted long enough to get an MoT and sell the death-trap to some poor unsuspecting mug. Said mug then drives said Mini as if they're an extra in The Italian Job only to find the subframe departs from the body leaving them in a very unenviable state!

That said, if the weld repairs are done properly i see no reason why the repair shouldn't be at least as strong as the original metal.
You are totally correct in this, and right to bring it up. It has been at the front of my mind the whole time.

There's two aspects, the safety part and the legal part.

Regarding safety, the repair was done using the same gauge steel with full penetration and spotless clean metal. I've had it inspected by my dad who has 40 years experience as a professional welder who glued back together frigates and nuclear subs, and he's given it the thumbs up. I'm pretty comfortable in the thought that this is safer than the majority of cars of this age, which may well be going about with similar rot that actually goes unnoticed until you have to pull the crossmember off.

As for the legal / MOT aspect, it is a bit of a strange rule as you say, but I suppose they have to cover all bases when it comes to people half-heartedly tacking together critical components over rust and mud and slathering on the paint. But then there is no such rule covering those components if they were an integral part of the chassis which is a bit hypocritical, but that's the government bureaucracy for you!

I've got a pretty decent mot guy plus the welded section should be almost invisible without removing the wishbones, steering rack and undertray so I think it should be ok. Not that I advocate hiding anything. It would be better if I were allowed to highlight the repair and let him decide how good it is.. but hey ho.

I'd ideally love to have bolted on a brand new crossmember or at least a top quality spare, but I've tried everywhere and they are all either NLA or rotten. I had to make a decision on whether to forge ahead with this as the only other option really is to weigh the car in and waste months of work.
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Old Mar 10th, 2021, 15:18   #40
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Quote:
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But then there is no such rule covering those components if they were an integral part of the chassis which is a bit hypocritical, but that's the government bureaucracy for you!
Hmmmmmmmmmm, i beg to differ on a technicality. The chassis can be failed for corrosion if it's within 12"/30cm of a suspension, steering, braking or seat belt mounting.

However the hypocrisy comes in here because welded repairs are accptable in those areas. The hypocrasy of bureaucracy!

On a previous car, the outer sills weren't structural as there were 2 inner sills for rigidty. However the seat belt mounts on that car were shared by the seat mounting points, one on the inner-inner sill and another inside the B-pillar. Because that car had corrosion within 12" of at least one of those points, it failed on the outer sill. It had previously failed on a really rotten outer sill the other side and i had a new sill plus repairs to the outer-inner sill.
However this brings in more hypocracy and what i think are double-standards at times. That said the different construction of various cars means they have to draw a broad average line and include as many as are practical points to fail/pass a given vehicle on.

Out of curiosity, have you heard of/used electrolytic derusting before? One of the side effects is that it actually plates good metal back on, useful where the metal is pitted but obviously it's only a small amount.

https://www.mig-welding.co.uk/forum/...leaning.12686/

Many of the pics have gone AWOL sadly but here are a few of my own :

Before :





After :





As you can see, the rusty metal has been returned to good solid steel so i was able to paint it :





With "safety-critical" components it's advisable to put them in the oven on a low heat (~100C) for an hour or so to purge the hydrogen from the metal to eliminate hydrogen embrittlement. It's also good practice if painting it so the hydrogen doesn't cause micro-blisters as it escapes over time. Welding the item will also help purge the hydrogen from it as well. You can also copper-then-nickel plate any items for a durable, bright finish but it will need polishing to make it bright and shiny usually. Other electroplating methods are also possible.
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