American vs. European T5's

[imac]

I seem to spend a lot of time on eBay UK hunting down good examples of T5's, recently, with the possibility of moving to the US for a years placement, I've been looking at the eBay US site. Some very very nice examples of T5's (or 850 Turbos, as they seem to be known as over there). Some exceptionally clean examples!

I've noticed a few differences between the Euro spec 850 T5 and the American 850 Turbo, was hoping someone (any American Turbo owners here?) could help me out.

1) Where we have side indicator repeaters, the US spec have "Volvo" badges on the front wing in their place. Why?

2) The US spec T5's have a button on the dash, next to the front foglight button which locks all the doors of the car. Why don't we have this in the UK spec?

3) The speedometer for UK spec cars goes up to 150mph for 94/95 models, and 96/97 models goes up to 160mph. US spec goes up to only 140mph. Insignificant maybe, but why? I know the US spec has 222hp rather than 225, but surely a loss of 3hp doesn't require a different speedo ;)

4) On the autobox, I have sports/winter/economy setting. The US spec seems to have a further button near the stick, above the 'P' position. Can't quite make out what this is?!


I'm sure there are more differences, but thats all I can spot for now :)

[sholtby]

>1) Where we have side indicator repeaters, the US spec have
>"Volvo" badges on the front wing in their place. Why?

Yanks have a different parking/indicator light housing. They have to have amber side lights as you have probably seen in films. I dont think they are allowed to show amber light on the side of a car just red at the side/rear.
>
>2) The US spec T5's have a button on the dash, next to the
>front foglight button which locks all the doors of the car.
>Why don't we have this in the UK spec?

There is a different attitude with regards locking doors in the states. If you read a US manual it says to keep the doors locked when driving to prevent carjacking. In the UK you are advised to keep them unlocked so you can get out easier in an accident.
Also our style of central locking with the key is not used because thieves will hide next to a passenger door, wait for you to unlock the car and get in,, then get in themselves and put a gun to your head. They only use the button to unlock the doors when they have a passenger. ie unlock as few doors as possible.
>
>3) The speedometer for UK spec cars goes up to 150mph for
>94/95 models, and 96/97 models goes up to 160mph. US spec goes
>up to only 140mph. Insignificant maybe, but why? I know the US
>spec has 222hp rather than 225, but surely a loss of 3hp
>doesn't require a different speedo ;)

Not that long ago a speedo in a US car could only legally go up to 85 mph. Maybe its gone up to 140 now. The idea was to make drivers more nervous about how much they were breaking the speed limit by and slow down. I think 55mph needs to be in red numbers on the dial.
>
>4) On the autobox, I have sports/winter/economy setting. The
>US spec seems to have a further button near the stick, above
>the 'P' position. Can't quite make out what this is?!

Can you remove the keys from the ignition in your car in any other position than park? With a lot of eurocars you can but with american cars you cant. I think it was Audi whose sales never took off in the eighties in the states due to cars rolling away when unattended. With an auto you never use the handbrake as in park it locks the transmission. Yanks would assume that if they had left the car and had the keys in their hand the tranny must be in park. Some times it wasnt though!
>
>
>I'm sure there are more differences, but thats all I can spot
>for now :)

All US cars need to have a smog pump to afterburn the exhaust gasses when the engine is cold so the cat heats up quicker. On my Camaro when the engine was hot it then blew air into the middle of the cat to help emissions.

Simon
>
>
>

[imac]

>Yanks have a different parking/indicator light housing. They
>have to have amber side lights as you have probably seen in
>films. I dont think they are allowed to show amber light on
>the side of a car just red at the side/rear.

I see, yes... I have noted the differnt light housing before!


>There is a different attitude with regards locking doors in
>the states. If you read a US manual it says to keep the doors
>locked when driving to prevent carjacking. In the UK you are
>advised to keep them unlocked so you can get out easier in an
>accident.

My other car, a Renault Clio, has the button to lock the doors. In fact, it automatically locks all doors when the roadspeed is 4mph! I think Mercedes do this too, maybe more manufacturers. I can understand the advantage of keeping them unlocked, though.

>Also our style of central locking with the key is not used
>because thieves will hide next to a passenger door, wait for
>you to unlock the car and get in,, then get in themselves and
>put a gun to your head. They only use the button to unlock the
>doors when they have a passenger. ie unlock as few doors as
>possible.

Frightening, although I fear parts of the UK are just as bad :)


>Not that long ago a speedo in a US car could only legally go
>up to 85 mph. Maybe its gone up to 140 now. The idea was to
>make drivers more nervous about how much they were breaking
>the speed limit by and slow down. I think 55mph needs to be in
>red numbers on the dial.


>Can you remove the keys from the ignition in your car in any
>other position than park? With a lot of eurocars you can but
>with american cars you cant. I think it was Audi whose sales
>never took off in the eighties in the states due to cars
>rolling away when unattended. With an auto you never use the
>handbrake as in park it locks the transmission. Yanks would
>assume that if they had left the car and had the keys in their
>hand the tranny must be in park. Some times it wasnt though!


I often leave my transmission in 'N'. I always use the handbrake, but I started life in a manual. Maybe if I had always driven auto's I'd not use the handbrake so often!?


Thanks for the info!

[liuleichan]

>>
>>2) The US spec T5's have a button on the dash, next to the
>>front foglight button which locks all the doors of the car.
>>Why don't we have this in the UK spec?

The 70 series have a button on the driver and passenger door panel for this.

>>4) On the autobox, I have sports/winter/economy setting. The
>>US spec seems to have a further button near the stick, above
>>the 'P' position. Can't quite make out what this is?!

I think it's the shiftlock button - in case you need to move the gear lever with the ignition key removed. Not all 850 / x70 series have this feature.

>Can you remove the keys from the ignition in your car in any
>other position than park? With a lot of eurocars you can but
>with american cars you cant. I think it was Audi whose sales
>never took off in the eighties in the states due to cars
>rolling away when unattended. With an auto you never use the
>handbrake

I drive an auto, and I do. I use it when stopped waiting for traffic lights - means I don't have to dazzle the car behind me, or risk warping the rotors on faster roads.

And it's kinder on the transmission to wait in drive rather than neutral, unless the wait is for a prolonged period.

>as in park it locks the transmission.

True, it does, but I still rarely use park. I use it, as I would in a manual, when I want the drivetrain to prevent movement - ie on hills or gradients. Otherwise, the handbrake should be good enough.

Park pawls could get damaged with minor shunts when your car is parked - that's why I only use it when I definitely feel I need it.

[liuleichan]

>>There is a different attitude with regards locking doors in
>>the states. If you read a US manual it says to keep the
>doors
>>locked when driving to prevent carjacking. In the UK you are
>>advised to keep them unlocked so you can get out easier in
>an
>>accident.
>
>My other car, a Renault Clio, has the button to lock the
>doors. In fact, it automatically locks all doors when the
>roadspeed is 4mph! I think Mercedes do this too, maybe more
>manufacturers. I can understand the advantage of keeping them
>unlocked, though.

I've had a couple of Passats that auto-locked the doors above around 10 mph.

It was a configurable option, but in general, it required a dealer to set / change it. If you drive in a city, you may want to do something like this.

In the event of an accident, the car should auto-unlock anyways if it's got central locking, and is reasonably modern.

>>Also our style of central locking with the key is not used
>>because thieves will hide next to a passenger door, wait for
>>you to unlock the car and get in,, then get in themselves
>and
>>put a gun to your head. They only use the button to unlock
>the
>>doors when they have a passenger. ie unlock as few doors as
>>possible.
>
>Frightening, although I fear parts of the UK are just as bad
>:)

Well some cities can have some of these problems.

>I often leave my transmission in 'N'. I always use the
>handbrake, but I started life in a manual. Maybe if I had
>always driven auto's I'd not use the handbrake so often!?

I'm an auto driver and I use the handbrake - both when I'm driving, and when parked.

I only use park when I would leave a manual in gear.

[sholtby]

If I'm in a manual I always park with the handbrake on and in 1st gear. In an auto I just put it in park. I've never fully trusted a handbrake on its own. Infact I was reading recently about several Audi drivers having their cars roll away when parked with just the handbrake on. The reason was found to be that the handbrake was applied when the brakes were hot and as the brakes cooled and contracted the braking force was reduced.

Simon

[liuleichan]

>If I'm in a manual I always park with the handbrake on and in
>1st gear.

I only leave a manual in gear if I feel the handbrake needs some extra support - eg on a gradient, with no curb to "chock" the wheels by turning the steering. For two reasons:-

1. If somebody else is the next to drive it, they may not automatically assume that it could be in gear.
2. Were another car to collide with it, there could be some transmission / gearbox damage as well as cosmetic damage.

>In an auto I just put it in park. I've never fully
>trusted a handbrake on its own.

Well if it passes an MOT, it should be easily capable of keeping a parked car stationary.

Many auto drivers just use park (and by that I mean park alone, and no handbrake) and they'll admit (I've had the discussions) that they do it out of laziness (just having to move one lever, that they would have to move anyway, without having to worry with the handbrake. For similar reasons they seem to use park actually when on the road, but stopped at junctions / traffic lights.

But there's no reason why a handbrake should be magically more ineffective in an auto, compared with a manual, so if you'd use it in a manual, I can't imagine why not in an auto. As to the leaving it in gear, well personally I do it on merit if I think it's required - because in the event of a shunt whilst it's parked, I'd rather have to just deal with cosmetic damage, than the potential for drivetrain damage too.

>Infact I was reading recently
>about several Audi drivers having their cars roll away when
>parked with just the handbrake on. The reason was found to be
>that the handbrake was applied when the brakes were hot and as
>the brakes cooled and contracted the braking force was
>reduced.

Presumably this just relates to handbrakes that operate directly to disks - known to be difficult to keep effective. Many modern cars with disks all round, actually use small drums inside the rear disks (850s and 70 series do) that the handbrake operates on. Now even if you managed to get the rear disks hot (and hence internal drums, too) - which would likely take some considerable effort to get the _rear_ brakes hot, all that would happen would be that the drum would effectively contract slightly as it cooled, and the handbrake should be even more effective.

[imac]

>1. If somebody else is the next to drive it, they may not
>automatically assume that it could be in gear.

When driving a manual, I always check that it's in neutral before starting the car, even if I was the last to drive it!! Just habit.

>2. Were another car to collide with it, there could be some
>transmission / gearbox damage as well as cosmetic damage.

Never thought of that one!

> For similar reasons they
>seem to use park actually when on the road, but stopped at
>junctions / traffic lights.

That'd scare the s***e out of someone behind you, as the stick has to pass 'R' not only on it's way to 'P', but also on it's return journey to 'D'. :)

[liuleichan]

>>1. If somebody else is the next to drive it, they may not
>>automatically assume that it could be in gear.
>
>When driving a manual, I always check that it's in neutral
>before starting the car, even if I was the last to drive it!!
>Just habit.

Me too - it was sort of a habit forming thing when learning - clutch down, waggle gearstick, start the car - assuming not in gear, lift the clutch.

>>2. Were another car to collide with it, there could be some
>>transmission / gearbox damage as well as cosmetic damage.
>
>Never thought of that one!

I think it's more of a consideration for an auto, than a manual, actually. With a manual left in gear, it would probably have to take quite a shock of energy at impact to cause damage, otherwise you'd think it would merely turn the engine a bit.

But for an auto, it's not inconceivable that even a minor bump could cause damage to the park pawls. That's the reason why I only use park when I think I may actually need it - same rationale for leaving a manual in gear.

>> For similar reasons they
>>seem to use park actually when on the road, but stopped at
>>junctions / traffic lights.
>
>That'd scare the s***e out of someone behind you, as the stick
>has to pass 'R' not only on it's way to 'P', but also on it's
>return journey to 'D'. :)

Indeed, which is why it's so obvious when they do it.

Plus, people who seem to do this, seem oblivious to it tending to make them the slowest away, plus is probably more detrimental in terms of wear and tear than leaving it in drive (assuming you aren't waiting / stationary for a good while - ie traffic jam, holdup, or waiting for somebody), and using either the footbrake (if you don't care about dazzling cars behind you with your brake lights) or the handbrake to hold it.

[imac]

>Plus, people who seem to do this, seem oblivious to it tending
>to make them the slowest away, plus is probably more
>detrimental in terms of wear and tear than leaving it in drive
>(assuming you aren't waiting / stationary for a good while -
>ie traffic jam, holdup, or waiting for somebody), and using
>either the footbrake (if you don't care about dazzling cars
>behind you with your brake lights) or the handbrake to hold
>it.

Just /how long/ is too long to hold the car in Drive on the footbrake?

I often wonder to myself whilst sitting in a queue waiting for a green light if I should pop it into N. But like you said, more changing is more wear!

What constitutes long, 15 seconds? 1 minute?