Brakes: Parking Brake: How hard should peddle be?

[Father Ted]

I only really use the XC at weekends and holidays.
Lately I've noticed that on Sundays my left ankle is absolutely killing me.
I've finally come up with a cause: it's pressing the parking brake.
Now, admittedly, my shoes don't help (noticed a big difference when wearing my work boots), and I have achilles problems in both feet, but still, should the parking brake be stiff enough to press that it's causing pain?

I have it adjusted so that it holds the car in drive on 4 clicks, is that too tight? How many clicks do others go through before it holds the car?

I really need to come up with a solution. I've decided to stop using it for the time being and simply put the car in P when I'm stopped.

[S60D5-185]

Originally Posted by Father Ted

I only really use the XC at weekends and holidays.
Lately I've noticed that on Sundays my left ankle is absolutely killing me.
I've finally come up with a cause: it's pressing the parking brake.
Now, admittedly, my shoes don't help (noticed a big difference when wearing my work boots), and I have achilles problems in both feet, but still, should the parking brake be stiff enough to press that it's causing pain?

I have it adjusted so that it holds the car in drive on 4 clicks, is that too tight? How many clicks do others go through before it holds the car?

I really need to come up with a solution. I've decided to stop using it for the time being and simply put the car in P when I'm stopped.

Apart from being illegal that is a real bad idea as it is putting a lot of strain on a small pin in the gearbox for which it was never designed.

[davidsmith1307]

A small shunt to the rear of a vehicle in P with no parking brake will probably snap the parking pawl.

[Father Ted]

Yeah, yeah, yeah.
But. (a) clearly if I was on a hill I'd use the brake, however, I was talking generically. On the flat I use only P
(b) A shunt enough to snap the pawl would probably write off a 14 year old vehicle, and their insurance would pay.
(c) At the moment, the pain is the overriding concern.

So, is this a mechanical issue, for me to resolve, well, mechanically.
Or, do I need address the issue with my foot ( or both?)

Even if the issue is with my foot, is there something I can do with the brake to ease it?

[SwissXC90]

Originally Posted by Father Ted

I have it adjusted so that it holds the car in drive on 4 clicks, is that too tight? How many clicks do others go through before it holds the car?

i measure the following performance on brand new XC90 parking brakes:
0 clicks: car rolls freely
1 click: noticable drag on a flat surface, at idle the D5 is only slowly moving the car forwards or backwards.
2 clicks: easily holds the D5 motor at idle on a flat surface, in D or in R. Holds the car on a slight gradient.
3 clicks: solidly holding the vehicle on a easy to medium gradient
5 clicks: solidy holding the vehicle on a 17% (steep) gradient, pointing uphill, with motor in D (motor is providing some brake assistance)
6 clicks: holding the vehicle solidly on a 17% (steep) gradient, pointing uphill or downhill, with motor running and gearbox in D, R or N.

Here in Switzerland the brake must hold the vehicle on an 18% (1 in 5) hill. That is a very steep hill. It can, if it grips well.

I had my parking brake completely renewed 2 weeks ago.
You likely have rust or worn pads affecting the ability to grip.
At best a disassemble and clean.
At worst renew brake pads, brake disc and springs (this is what I had done)

Read my post describing the parking brake performance, when new, here in page 3 post #29:
https://www.volvoforums.org.uk/showt...=279043&page=3

And then make a cup of tea and read my entire inspection saga starting at page 1 post #1 here:
https://www.volvoforums.org.uk/showthread.php?t=279043

[Father Ted]

5 clicks!!
I can't get mine down that far without breaking my ankle!
3 clicks it starts to drag, 4 holds, even with caravan on .

I regularly drive a short distance at about 10mph with brake loosely on to clean off any rust. Used to do this on my V70 as well.

[Tannaton]

Originally Posted by S60D5-185

Apart from being illegal that is a real bad idea as it is putting a lot of strain on a small pin in the gearbox for which it was never designed.

To say that it is illegal I think is (faintly) technically correct but tenuous....

Rule 239 of the Highway Code says that you must apply the parking brake before leaving the vehicle. Whilst the Highway Code is not an Act of Parliament itself it is not unheard of for people to be prosecuted for driving without due care and attention as a "catch all" for not following the Highway Code.

To be prosecuted you would have to have been observed committing an offence and that would probably mean leaving an XC90 than subsequently moves. Not going to happen if it's in P.

Although the parking pawl in the AW55 is sort of a pin, it's hardened steel and the forces on it are divided by the final drive ratio - so whilst it isn't robust I would trust if more than the hand brake on most XC90.

Of course the best practice here is to put the parking brake on - then put it in P - this saves stressing the engine mounts as well.

[S60D5-185]

Originally Posted by Tannaton

To say that it is illegal I think is (faintly) technically correct but tenuous....

Nothing Tenuous about it at all.



The Road Vehicles (Construction and Use) Regulations 1986


Leaving motor vehicles unattended
107.—(1) Save as provided in paragraph (2), no person shall leave, or cause or permit to be left, on a road a motor vehicle which is not attended by a person licensed to drive it unless the engine is stopped and any parking brake with which the vehicle is required to be equipped is effectively set.
(2) The requirement specified in paragraph (1) as to the stopping of the engine shall not apply in respect of a vehicle—
(a)
being used for ambulance, fire brigade or police purposes; or
(b)
in such a position and condition as not to be likely to endanger any person or property and engaged in an operation which requires its engine to be used to—
(i)
drive machinery forming part of, or mounted on, the vehicle and used for purposes other than driving the vehicle; or
(ii)
maintain the electrical power of the batteries of the vehicle at a level required for driving that machinery or apparatus.
(3) In this regulation “parking brake” means a brake fitted to a vehicle in accordance with requirement 16 or 18 in Schedule 3.


This last part refers to the parking brake that would be part of the MOT and required to reach a percentage efficiency.




************************************************** **************************************************

Getting back to Father Ted's Handbrake issue, this week I have just fitted new Volvo parking brake shoes, springs and adjusters in place of the solid H bars in an attempt to get my non existent XC90 parking brake working . It was absolutely useless.

The car had just been fitted with brand new discs and pads prior to me buying it but the parking brake was so poor I suspected that the internals would have been untouched. Sure enough, original shoes and springs with seized H bars where the shoes sit

The pedal travel has been drastically reduced as a result of the new parts ( particularly the adjusters )but as yet I have not adjusted the cable inside the car.

In relation to effort required to depress the pedal that is subjective I suppose depending on the user.

All I can say is that on mine it moves freely and without undue effort on my part so it may well be that Father Ted's system needs looking at .

Possibly new cables ?

[Tannaton]

Originally Posted by S60D5-185

The Road Vehicles (Construction and Use) Regulations 1986


Leaving motor vehicles unattended
107.—(1) Save as provided in paragraph (2), no person shall leave, or cause or permit to be left, on a road a motor vehicle which is not attended by a person licensed to drive it unless the engine is stopped and any parking brake with which the vehicle is required to be equipped is effectively set.
(2) The requirement specified in paragraph (1) as to the stopping of the engine shall not apply in respect of a vehicle—
(a)
being used for ambulance, fire brigade or police purposes; or
(b)
in such a position and condition as not to be likely to endanger any person or property and engaged in an operation which requires its engine to be used to—
(i)
drive machinery forming part of, or mounted on, the vehicle and used for purposes other than driving the vehicle; or
(ii)
maintain the electrical power of the batteries of the vehicle at a level required for driving that machinery or apparatus.
(3) In this regulation “parking brake” means a brake fitted to a vehicle in accordance with requirement 16 or 18 in Schedule 3.


This last part refers to the parking brake that would be part of the MOT and required to reach a percentage efficiency.

Yeah - I get all that - and I referred to the Highway Code's versions.

But in the real world when did anyone ever get prosecuted specifically for leaving their vehicle in "P" Park and not applying the handbrake?

I bet £10 to the Donkey Sanctuary that the answer to that is never.

I agree it is best practice to use both but on many XC90's the "P" position of the gearbox is far more effective than the parking brake.

[S60D5-185]

Originally Posted by Tannaton

I agree it is best practice to use both but on many XC90's the "P" position of the gearbox is far more effective than the parking brake.

True but only because the handbrake on the xc90 is inherently crap!