240 General: New (to me) 1980 Volvo 244

[Othen]

Originally Posted by Laird Scooby

I always thought the 240 series was closer to 15' long Alan? The 7xx is 15'9" and to me, looks longer than the 240, perhaps because of the lower bonnet line. My Rover is 16' all bar about 1/2-3/4" and is definitely longer than my 760, easily seen when they are parked side by side.

As for turning circle, i frequently shock many people locally with both my beasts as there is a particular place where i park when visiting my local Co-op where it's easier to simply swing round in the road to turn round to come home (avoiding a half-mile extra dog-leg return trip) and many modern cars , even the so-called small ones, just can't do it.
Both of mine can, even the FWD Rover, with ease. You should have a nice tight turning circle on the RB and the steering shouldn't be vague at all, maybe it's just a chacteristic of a 1980 244?

Hi Dave, Loki and John,

The BofH gives the length as 192", that is where I got the 16' from. The bumper overhangs are pretty big, I suppose they contribute a lot..

The turning circle seems pretty good - almost dodgem-carish with the long front overhang.

Don't get me wrong: the RB steers very well for a 1980 car, it has PAS which works fine and is much, much better than my mate's Capri V6 (no PAS - real men only need apply). As I said to Loki above, this is just a just a relative thing - it is nowhere near as nimble as a modern car either side to side or backwards and forwards (actually backwards is fine - the brakes are very good indeed (no ABS - good thing)).

There is no getting away from the fact that the RB is a bit heavy and rather tall compared with most modern cars - so the slow to react steering is no fault of the mechanism, just physics (the mass is big and high up, simple as that).

The steering improved a great deal after I got the correct size tyres fitted (remember it came with some low profile rubber that was very poor).

The Royal Barge is very much a term of endearment rather than a complaint. It is a really nice car to drive but there wouldn't be much point trying to drive it fast.

Stay safe,

Alan

[Othen]

Originally Posted by john.wigley

That is a lovely story, Alan; thank you for sharing it. I had an idea that there might be an actual 'Royal' connection.

I don't recall the 240's steering as being that bad! But, like 'L.S.', it is a long time since I have driven one; I suppose it probably does feel a little 'vague' after your modern cars.

It was, however, light years ahead of the worst example in this regard that I once owned. That dubious honour goes to a 1959 Austin (Nash) Metropolitan - a sort of scaled down American car based on BMC 'B' series running gear. It had a body by Nash-Kelvinator, who, quite frankly, would have been better advised sticking to making 'fridges!

Anyway, the slab sides and narrow track so restricted the steering lock that one measured the turning circle between towns rather than kerbs. Any change of direction needed a multi-point turn where a RWD Volvo required only a 'U' turn.

Regards, John.

I'm glad you liked the story - it was a personal thing I suppose, I'm pleased to connect a good tour with a car I enjoy a great deal.

I seem to have given the impression the RB steers badly, when I first got the car that probably was the case because of the 4 mismatched low profile tyres, it is much better with the right rubber, but the name has stuck because I think it suits the car. It is a bit tall and upright, accelerates in a pretty leisurely way and is a bit too tubby to corner fast. It is much better than nearly all the 1980s cars I remember fron back in the day though (well, not the Japanese ones).

Stay safe,

Alan

[Othen]

The Royal Barge has always seemed a little stodgy when it comes to acceleration, like there was something holding it back at the top end. Having got everything inside the engine bay working exactly as it is supposed to, this morn I checked out the throttle linkage throughout.

I found the fault: the PO has fitted some metal bolt on go-faster covers to the brake and throttle pedals that would not have looked out of place on a XR2i. He'd fitted them really badly by drilling holes through to take bolts and nuts - the problem was one of the bolts on the throttle was far too long and so restricted the lever's movement by about 10mm.

The bling is now removed, the original pedals look much smarter, pedal travel is restored, the drilled holes neatly filled and the RB's straight line performance is considerably enhanced (well, by a little bit anyway).

What a wonderful world we live in.

Alan

[Stephen Edwin]

Originally Posted by Laird Scooby

I hope you weren't born at 6am for that is the number of The Beast! Belated birthday greetings anyway.

Good catch. But no.



6 pm



Comrade Stephen Edwin




.

[loki_the_glt]

Originally Posted by Stephen Edwin

Interesting. I do not remember PAS in my old T reg 244. I miss that car. Is this my admitted increasing senility* or were there early PAS examples or has someone improved your jam jar in that respect?

*Yesterday was a milestone birthday. But please do not tell anyone.

Stay Safe.

Comrade Stephen Edwin




.

Early DL models lacked PAS (and it wasn't an option on them), which made its across-the-range debut in 1982 or thereabouts. The GL and GLE did have PAS from the off. What they DID have was "negativer lenkroll radius" or negative-offset steering which improved the turning circle and was usually associated with Audis of that era.

Early PAS cars used the same bottom ball-joints as the manual ones but on later examples they were handed.

[Othen]

Originally Posted by Stephen Edwin

Interesting. I do not remember PAS in my old T reg 244. I miss that car. Is this my admitted increasing senility* or were there early PAS examples or has someone improved your jam jar in that respect?

*Yesterday was a milestone birthday. But please do not tell anyone.

Stay Safe.

Comrade Stephen Edwin
.

The PAS certainly looks like it has been on the car ab initio.

Happy birthday to you,
Happy birthday to you,
Happy birthday dear Stephen Edwin,
Happy birthday to you.

[Othen]

Originally Posted by loki_the_glt

Early DL models lacked PAS (and it wasn't an option on them), which made its across-the-range debut in 1982 or thereabouts. The GL and GLE did have PAS from the off. What they DID have was "negativer lenkroll radius" or negative-offset steering which improved the turning circle and was usually associated with Audis of that era.

Early PAS cars used the same bottom ball-joints as the manual ones but on later examples they were handed.

The Royal Barge is a 244 GL, so the PAS being original seems entirely plausible. I’m pleased it has - the RB is quite a heavy beast but the PAS, auto box and servo assisted brakes make it a nice and easy car to drive.

Stay safe,

Alan

[Othen]

Originally Posted by Laird Scooby

.

The 760 took a lot of trial and error to get the rack centred exactly before executing the alignment and has remained how it should be for a long time since. However, catching a new pothole recently has knocked the alignment out so i need to tweak both cars.

It's entirely possible that Alans Royal barge has a similar problem or it could be down to the McPherson strut top mount bearings being a bit worn causing camber and caster changes under dynamic conditions. Maybe everything is exactly as it should be and it's just one of those cars.

Just to reiterate, no injustices, just an open conversation about the fact some 240s have woolly steering.

That is interesting Dave, do you adjust the toe-in yourself or have it done at a garage? I was just looking through my Autodata manual and toe-in adjustment it covered very well, I’d just need to find a metal pole about 6’ long and two pointers I could attach at right angles, maybe 6” long. I think I have enough bits of scrap to make something that might work. I quite like the idea of adjusting the toe-in myself the same way as my grandfather would have.

The camber would be more difficult to check, so I’m thinking it might be worth getting F1 to check it and the toe-in (free, the local branch then charges £25 if it needs adjusting) the first time, then use my apparatus (once I’ve constructed it) to keep it in check from there.

Stay safe,

Alan

[Laird Scooby]

Originally Posted by Othen

That is interesting Dave, do you adjust the toe-in yourself or have it done at a garage? I was just looking through my Autodata manual and toe-in adjustment it covered very well, I’d just need to find a metal pole about 6’ long and two pointers I could attach at right angles, maybe 6” long. I think I have enough bits of scrap to make something that might work. I quite like the idea of adjusting the toe-in myself the same way as my grandfather would have.

The camber would be more difficult to check, so I’m thinking it might be worth getting F1 to check it and the toe-in (free, the local branch then charges £25 if it needs adjusting) the first time, then use my apparatus (once I’ve constructed it) to keep it in check from there.

Stay safe,

Alan

Last time i had it done at a garage (ATS) the front wheels looked like Charlie Chaplins feet!

I have in the past made my own tracking gauges but they got damaged in the move and try as i might, i couldn't get them right so i invested in a Trackace Laser Alignment to do the job.

There's a used one on fleabay at the moment, current bid about £20 :

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/TrackAce-...e/274389249215

You can also buy camber gauges quite cheaply as well but if memory serves, it's not adjustable unless you alter the suspension strut tops.

As for getting the rack accurately centred to start with, all you need is some insulating (or masking) tape and possible a socket.

Start the car, turn the steering to full lock in one direction and place a piece of tape at the 6 o'clock position on the edge of the steering wheel. Repeat for the other lock. The two pieces of tape, when the steering wheel has been moved back so it's at the straight ahead position should be symmetrical.

If not, remove the wheel and adjust so you can repeat the test and arrive at the symmetrical tapes position.

Now when the steering wheel is in the straight ahead position, the rack should be central. If the car doesn't drive straight at this point, you definitely know something is wrong!
If that is the case, i find the easiest way is to count the number of exposed threads on each track rod (say 18 on the left and 9 on the right) and split the difference then adjust each track rod until they have similar amounts of thread showing, for example 13.5 threads in this case.
Then check the actual alignment with the gauges and work out what you need to do. What you do to one side, you must also do the other. If the left goes out 1 turn, the right comes in 1 turn to keep things straight.

If your track rod ends are in front of the axle line and it's toeing out too much, you need to shorten the distance between the track rod ends, half a turn in on both will give a whole turn in terms of reducing the toe out.
Conversely if it's toeing in, half a turn out on each track rod end will result in 1 turn more toe out.

Clicked the wrong button just now and submitted it! Oops! Obviously if the track rod ends are behind the axle line, the opposite applies. Also on mine, i found a half turn total (1/4 turn each TRE -Track Rod End) equated to about 1mm difference to the amount of toe, i'm guessing as you also have 15" wheels and a similar suspension set up to my 760, yours will be similar.

One drawback on the Trackace is you have to recalibrate it after each adjustment, that can also be seen as a positive though as you're always using freshly calibrated kit.

[Othen]

Originally Posted by Laird Scooby

Last time i had it done at a garage (ATS) the front wheels looked like Charlie Chaplins feet!

I have in the past made my own tracking gauges but they got damaged in the move and try as i might, i couldn't get them right so i invested in a Trackace Laser Alignment to do the job.

There's a used one on fleabay at the moment, current bid about £20 :

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/TrackAce-...e/274389249215

You can also buy camber gauges quite cheaply as well but if memory serves, it's not adjustable unless you alter the suspension strut tops.

As for getting the rack accurately centred to start with, all you need is some insulating (or masking) tape and possible a socket.

Start the car, turn the steering to full lock in one direction and place a piece of tape at the 6 o'clock position on the edge of the steering wheel. Repeat for the other lock. The two pieces of tape, when the steering wheel has been moved back so it's at the straight ahead position should be symmetrical.

If not, remove the wheel and adjust so you can repeat the test and arrive at the symmetrical tapes position.

Now when the steering wheel is in the straight ahead position, the rack should be central. If the car doesn't drive straight at this point, you definitely know something is wrong!
If that is the case, i find the easiest way is to count the number of exposed threads on each track rod (say 18 on the left and 9 on the right) and split the difference then adjust each track rod until they have similar amounts of thread showing, for example 13.5 threads in this case.
Then check the actual alignment with the gauges and work out what you need to do. What you do to one side, you must also do the other. If the left goes out 1 turn, the right comes in 1 turn to keep things straight.

If your track rod ends are in front of the axle line and it's toeing out too much, you need to shorten the distance between the track rod ends, half a turn in on both will give a whole turn in terms of reducing the toe out.
Conversely if it's toeing in, half a turn out on each track rod end will result in 1 turn more toe out.

I'll keep an eye on the eBay auction - but it has a while to run and so might go for quite a bit more than £20.

I have a 6' aluminium pole (a spare section from my flagpole) that I was thinking of re-purposing with a couple of lengths of threaded rod to make a gauge. One end would have to be adjustable within a small range. I'll think about it tomorrow.

The PO had set the camber to its maximum angle with the strut top mounts, I think in order to accentuate the look he wanted with the low profile tyres. I've set both sides at the mid-position dot, but either need to get F1 to check it for me or buy a tool to do it myself. I think like you, I always prefer to do things myself if I can (and so avoid getting Charlie Chaplin's shoes back from the YTS boy operating the alignment machine) - but I might give F1 a go this time, the manager is very enthusiastic about the Royal Barge.

The steering is very neutral now, and the wheel points dead ahead when I try it hands free on a surface with no camber (i.e. Morrison's car park at 06:00), also there is no scrubbing on the new tyres, so I must have it about right.

I'll have a chat with F1 tomorrow, and maybe ask the manager if he would check the CO level at the same time to see if my carburettor adjustment by eye (and ear) is correct - I'd like to be there at the time of the test though (I'm not sure I'd trust the YTS boy to adjust it) but I don't know whether the company's H&S or Coronavirus policies would allow that.

Many thanks for the tips on centering the steering.

Stay safe,

Alan

PS. I've just ordered one of these - if it works it will be pretty cool and it only cost €11:

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/KFZ-Auto-...53.m2749.l2649