confused.argh

[rallyman]

Guys. the more i look at it the more confused i become.
In simple terms, im trying to figure out if i am within legal bounds by towing my rally car with my 940. without going into too many technicals, rather ball park comments. combination as follows 940 manual estate 1950kg on the towing plate, steel williams type twin axle (one braked) trailer, and Vauxhall Nova rally car, estimated weight 750kg. legal or not?
Thanks for looking
Nick

[60041]

In simple terms, regardless of the quoted towing limit of the car, you must not exceed the kerbweight of the towing vehicle with the loaded weight of the trailer. You must also pay heed to the noseweight limit on the towbar.

There is often some confusion when manufacturers quote a towing limit that exceeds the kerbweight of the vehicle, such as some 4x4's that have towing limits of 3 tons or more. Many people assume that this is the maximum legal weight allowed, but, in fact, it is a theoretical figure calculated by the manufacturer based on the ability of the vehicle to restart on steep gradients, and does not represent the legal limit on British roads. Of course, when a lower towing limit is quoted, it must not be exceeded.

Therefore, you need to find out the unladen weight of your trailer and add the weight of your rally car and any extras carried, and compare this with the kerbweight of your Volvo.

Another point that is often overlooked, is the requirement to have D1+E on your license if you are towing a car/trailer combination with a total train weight exceeding 3500Kg

Some very useful information can be found on the Caravan Club website.

[rallyman]

so what or who determines a "kerbweight" and indeed what is a kerbweight and where do i find this info????????

[60041]

The kerbweight of a car is the weight of the car with fuel and oil, but without and luggage passengers etc.
It will be in the owners manual and also on the vehicle identification plate under the bonnet, sometimes referred to as MiRO (mass in running order).
The exact kerbweight of Volvos is variable, as there are so many variations in the equpment fitted, optional extras etc., but the figure on the plate will be the minimum weight which is the one to go by.
If for any reason you cannot get the weight from the plate, then the best thing to do would be to go to your nearest public weighbridge (find it in the yellow pages) and weigh the car, but remember to take all the rubbish out first!

[outnumbered]

Originally Posted by rallyman

Guys. the more i look at it the more confused i become.
In simple terms, im trying to figure out if i am within legal bounds by towing my rally car with my 940. without going into too many technicals, rather ball park comments. combination as follows 940 manual estate 1950kg on the towing plate, steel williams type twin axle (one braked) trailer, and Vauxhall Nova rally car, estimated weight 750kg. legal or not?
Thanks for looking
Nick

whats the weight of the trailer add the total car plus trailer, if its under your kerbweight then you are fine.
mike

[Richard_TD]

I'm afraid I'm going to add to the confusion.

As far as I'm aware the current weight of your trailer is irrelevant for legal purposes, what you have to go by is the plated maximum weight.

I was under the impression that the manufacturer's quoted towing limit (as seen in the handbook, or on a plate on the car. The plate on the towbar refer's to the towbar's capacity, I think the car's is about 1800kg) was the legal one. I couldn't find the answer on DVLA, they just talked about the 85% recommendation.

One thing you could do is speak to an experienced traffic cop. This will give you a definitive answer- until you speak to another experienced traffic cop and he tells you something completely different.

[rallyman]

you can see why im confused. Now. Heres the thing. Ive done much towing in the past using a variety of vehicles and i know what FEELS right and wrong on the road and whether the trailer is loaded right or wrong, tharefore it will look right on the road from a plod point of view, so if im sticking to the rules of the road re towing, what would be a reason to stop and check weights by the traffic boys, or would they wait for me to have an incident first?? and even then, who would give the definitive decision as to whether im legal or not. By the way, my vin plate says max trailer/caravan weight 1800kg and according to the plate by o/s headlight, "permitted gross vehicle weight" 1950kg WTF is that? Then i read an item from the dept of transport re towing and they bang on about gross train weight????????
Confused.org

[60041]

Here is a link to the volvo club page with the kerbweights and towing limits.
http://www.volvoclub.org.uk/pdf/towing-specs.pdf

From the data here, it would appear that your kerbweight is about 1538 Kg.

The 85% weight is the recommended maximum weight towed, although many experienced drivers tow up to 100%. As far as I know, in Britain it is not permissable to exceed 100% even if the maximum towing limit is higher.

The maximum towing limit is a theroretical figure based on the ability of the vehicle to restart on a steep gradient, and it must never be exceeded even when it is less than the 85% weight (the case with many smaller engined cars and many Renaults).

The train weight is the combined weight of the car and trailer, and the gross train weight is therefore the maximum allowable car plus trailer weight.

The gross vehicle weight is the maximum allowable weight of the car when it is fully loaded and must never be exceeded.

[ferguson_tom]

if you got your license before 1997 just make sure your trailers maximum weight is under your cars towing capacity.

if you got it after 1997 you have to make sure the trailer maximum weight is under the unladen weight of your car. Also make sure the whole lot is not over 3500kg which i doubt it will be.

all weights and things should be worked out on the plates of the car and the trailer not what is actually on the trailer at the time.

looking at it most twin axles ifor williams trailers are rated at 2000 or 3500 kg as the towing weight on your vehicle is 1950kg you are goingto be illegal.

[Clifford Pope]

Advice in the Series II LandRover club is that there is an anomally between the terms used in pre- and post- 1997 licences.

Post 1997 it is the total GROSS weight that constitutes the upper combined limit, so the example quoted would be illegal.
But pre-1997 it is the ACTUAL weight that counts - in essence that means you can pull a high-capacity trailer with a small car as long as the trailer is not actually carrying an excessive weight. Post 1997 there is no such get-out - it is the maximum carrying capacity, not the actual, that counts, even if the trailer is empty.

The question often comes up in boating circles, where someone wants to move an empty trailer with a high theoretical carrying capacity. The moral is, make sure you pass your driving test before 1997.