General cylinder head

[jac20]

My engine needs a new cylinder head. at a main dealer cost of £3500 i am wondering if Volvo are partly responsible for the bill. my xc90 has done 122k and had a full volve service at 120k (end of July 2013). as i picked up the car i noticed for the first time a warning light saying that the coolant level was low and that i should stop the engine. i did this and the service manager and mechanic came over to see what the problem was. they opened the resevoir cap and topped the coolant level up and sent me on my way.
however the problem persisted in the following weeks and i took it back to the dealer as i was not happy with it.
it transpires that the cylunder head is warped. the engine has never overheated and the temperature guage has always read 'normal'. i am told that this is very rare!, so rare that they have had to order a replacement head cylinder directly from sweeden. apparantly it can not be skimmed - volvo says this.
i agreed to the replacement, it's the family car and i have to get it fixed. when i dropped off the courtesy car this morning (27/08/13) i informed them that i wanted to keep the old cylinder head. i neede it to examine to see how it became warped and whether there was any financial recourse against volvo. i was told that they could not do this as it was going back to volvo as this was the deal £1k off the cost of the new head or something like that. i was also told that volvo would skim the head and sell it on.
i said no as this is my property and i needed it. this was the first mention of this. it was never discussed when i agreed to the new cylinder head.
anyways i am livid to say the lease.
i would be grateful to receive any advice on my options going forward.

[tommy309]

Hi, sorry to hear you need a new cylinder head, there is a very hard to see and hard to reach coolant piep at the back of the cylinder head which i have seen split before and cause a leak, so perhaps that is leaking and caused it to overheat, though if thats the case they will see it and repair it when doing the head, as far as the keeping the cylinder head is concerned, it is common to all manufacturers that they take back the old part and give you the new part at a reduced price, common parts for this are cylinder heads, turbos etc, you could in theory tell them you want to just buy a cylinder head at FULL price, but if theyve already ordered the exchange part, then they wont want to do that. To be honest id imagine the chances of Volvo covering a warped cylinder head are slim to none, as its not somethign which can be checked at a service and is usually due to overheating,even if you did get the old head itd be very hard to prove anything conclusive that would make them liable, all you would really be able to tell is if it is or isnt warped, but that still wouldnt make them liable really.
Sorry to be bearer of bad news but hope that helps somewhat

[david philips]

apparantly it can not be skimmed -. i was also told that volvo would skim the head and sell it on.

seems strange if the head can not be skimmed why volvo can skim it and sell it on.

also how did they know a replacement head is needed with out removing and checking it.

[jac20]

Thanks David, thanks Tommy.
i was clutching at straws regarding getting a contribution from volvo but just wanted to hear it from someone independant.
they and i hoped that it might have been a head gasket failure but after stripping the engine down the gasket was intact and there were digns of 'leekage' from cylinders 2, 3 and 4 with the two outside cylinders being fine.
can i please ask one more favour/quey. do you know what caused the faiure in the 1st place? i see little point in having a new cylinder head if the cause is elsewhere and will come back and ruin the new head. as i said the temperature was always normal with no indication of overheating. they will also be renewing the thermostat i am told.
Tommy - you mention a pipe at the back of the head. is this inside or outside the head itself? there were no signs of coolant leekage that could be found external of the engine. there has been a massive build up of pressure in the system i am told. i assume this means that the failure caused coolant to enter the cylinders?

[Clan]

The crucial question is how much coolant did they put in the first time the message came up? The message will come up with some coolant still in the bottle so it wont cause any damage with a small leak . A diesel generaly doesnt generate as much heat as a petrol so it must have got mighty hot to warp the head with steam coming from the coolant bottle , have they measured the flatness with a straight calibrated bar ? you need them to show you the gap due to warping .. that will prove something .
There must be a leak somewhere to have caused coolant loss in the first place , where is the leak? Head gaskets dont go on D5 engines , they are multiple sheets of stainless steel not paper based .
The coolant pressure cant go above the pressure of the relief valve on the coolant bottle cap , Its probably 1.5 Bar on yours ..
Yes they need your head back as it is an exchange item ... And no , it cant be skimmed by anyone , due to the small clearance between valves and pistons . volvo wont skim it they will scrap it if warped .

[david philips]

clan is there no one can supply a thicker gasket if the head was to be skimmed just a thought? also if the head is removed is it possible on these engines to check diy with a steel rule and set of feeler gauges rather than just replace the head, ttfn.

[Clan]

Originally Posted by david philips

clan is there no one can supply a thicker gasket if the head was to be skimmed just a thought? also if the head is removed is it possible on these engines to check diy with a steel rule and set of feeler gauges rather than just replace the head, ttfn.

There is no combustion chamber in the diesel head , it is flat and the valve heads protrude if you skim , the valve seats are damaged .
Yes as i said above have they used a straight edge to check the head for flatness and if it IS warped , they need to show the owner the gap ...
There are a selection of different thickness gaskets but only to allow for different piston heights , you generaly fit the same thickness which comes off .

[tommy309]

Hi, the pipe i was talking about is external but down the back of the engine, seen a few of them being replaced, they dont leak heavily as its quite a small pipe but they do sometimes leak, and can be hard enough to spot as theres the exhaust etc around there which obstructs your vision and also generates heat and sometimes drys up small leaks, i agree that its unusual for a d5 head to warp, unfortunately, if your car did have a leak, its possible the temperature gauge wouldnt have risen as there would not have been not enough coolant to give the sensor a good reading, but the low coolant level warning should illuminate long before that ever happens. From my point of view though if i was in your situation theres no way on earth id be spending 3500 quid on an engine repair to a car with 122k on it, way too much money to be putting into a car with that kind of mileage as other things may go wrong afterwards and end up making it a money pit (hopefully that wont happen) but it does happen in many cases uinfrotunately

[jac20]

when i looked at the head on the garage floor it appeared that there was discolourisation between the 3 centre cylinders and the edge of the block towards the front, whether this was soot or water marks i can't tell. the gasket was reported as being fine.

i assume that all fixings relating to the cylinder head will be replaced but will double check. i will also ask them to give me a measurement for the degree or amount of warping.

replacing the head is unfortunately the most ecenomic solution to me at this time.

the coolant level in the resevoir would fall and hence the coolant level warning light would come on. once the resevouir cap was opened the coolant level would rise again but not to the same level as previously (there was also some gurgling noise). it wold take 50-100millilitres of water to top-up (i came back from the inlaws (260miles) and put in 150millilitres) . when it happened initially following the last service the mechanic tipped some water in to the resevouir from a watering can. i would say no more than an egg cup or two.

thanks clan, thanks david