1999 Auto V70 Engine Runs Like a Pile of Rocks

[mikealder]

Post back with what is written on the gearshift selector positions such as P,R,N,D,4,3,L or P,R,N,D,3,2,L - Mike

[Pozzouk]

PRND43L Hope that helps. I presumed that was the 4speed but i'm sure she goes into nuetral on the footbrake - hence that gagging when footbrake on, that as i was saying seems to have stopped since this irregular running stated to dominate the issue.

As it happens after all the grief i had yesterday morning once she was cold it ran ten miles home no problem - again this morning with the TSU detached did my runaround dropping everyone to school and work, a total of about 15 miles ran prety good but obviously a non stop fan.

Pozzouk.

[mikealder]

That is the Asin Warner 5 speed auto box, I thought it probably was when you mentioned the Neutral when stopped, next question as you say you changed the oil in it recently, what grade/ make of oil was put in the gearbox, was ATF or JWS3309 spec fluid.

The five speed box needs JWS3309 spec oil, anything else will ruin the box in no time at all.

Are you 100% the level is correct (needs to be checked when hot, post 20 mile trip with the engine running, move selector through all positions pausing for a few seconds in each then return to Park. Leave the engine rinning and use the "HOT" side of the dipstick - There is only 200mL of fluid needed to go from min to max, the new fluid is added through the dipstick hole - Mike

[Pozzouk]

Cheers Mike, i had a feeling it was a five but was never sure - i just presumed they all sat in nuetral while footbrake on hence had got round to using the handbreak! Like a propper driver ;-)

As for the fluid - i asked alsorts about the stuff and ended up using dextron 2. I hear what you say that that is a no no. But stragely the gagging stopped when the fluid was changed - and these other issues of impossible running predate oil change

[Chris_Rogers]

I'd suggest:

Change the spark plugs and look for signs of arcing on the coil packs.

Change to autobox fluid to JWS3309 before the box is damaged.
Vauxhall / Saab part number for 1ltr correct ATF - 93160393.

Get a software change done on the autobox to get rid of the stop neutral feature and get the Volvo fault codes read from the box.

(If your code reader will allow you to set the OBDII protocol try using ISO 9141 and not KWP2000, it may read the auto box fault code).

[mikealder]

I think you are looking at mutiple faults with this car but the temp sensor seems to be something of a red herring, below is how it should work, look at the temp the engine needs to be at for the fan to run at slow speed and full speed (second graph)

If you look at the graphs below it shows that the coolant fan only kicks in at 106 Deg C then goes to high speed at 114 Deg C, water boils at 100 DegC (but you knew that anyway), if the coolant bottle top isn't sealing the pressure in fully it will boil over as the coolant needs the pressure to prevent the coolant boiling above 100 Deg C - If might be as simple as the bottle top cap is knackered as this has been seen before.

If you want to test your coolant sensor or car electrics down stream of the sensor the following graphs show you what it should do, the first graph shows the resistance vs coolant temperature:



The second graph is taken from the same data but zoomed in to the area of more interest, i.e the portion the car is often in when running including the points at which the radiator fan switches on at slow speed and high speed:



A decade resistance box is handy to connect to the car to vary the resistance to check the operation of the temp gauge and radiator fan speeds, to check the temp sensor a pan of water being heated with the sensor submerged but connected to a digital voltmeter using the resistance range is all thats needed.

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Eratic idle is probably due to failing resistance strips within the ETM, when mine went wrong it was fine with a cold engine but as it warmed up the idle was all over the place, budget on around £125 to fix this by getting a digital non contact angle sensor fitted to your ETM, this isn't a DIY proposition but one of the members on this forum can do it for you if you send him your ETM, member is called "Lucasz"

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Gearbox, wrong fluid is a big no no, if you get the oil flushed out with JWS3309 spec oil you might recover the box but if the internals have been damaged there isn't much other than a replacement box.

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As Chris has said the auto neutral when stopped can be disabled via a software update, but a cheaper alternate is to get in to the habit of leaving it in Drive but use the handbrake rather than the footbrake, with the handbrake applied the box won't switch out of drive.

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In terms of priority I would start with flushing the correct oil through the box to get rid of the Dexron II, although if you have driven a few hundred miles with the wrong oil in it the internals may well be past recovery - Mike

[Pozzouk]

Cheers for all that Mike & Chris,

First off - yes the incorrect fluid is a big worry and hopefully it's not totally cooked - goodness knows what they put in that JWS3309 any ideas on how to get the Dextron out and the 3309 in are welcome as when i changed it, it was not exactly an efficient procedure as i just pushed in the dextron and pumped out the mucky original until it ran clear - must have used two or three extra liters just to make sure!......not exactly what one wants to be doing at the best part of £10 quid a liter!!!!

Will certainly be having a go at boiling up a TSU and the digi meter test - i saw somewhere that replacing the TSU for a 150 Ohm resistor fools the ECU into thinking that the water is boiling so forces the fan to run.

However, forgive me if i am missing something but when this lumpy irregular running first cropped up last year i too was initially convinced that the problem lay with the ETM, this was until i accidentally discovered that disconnecting the TSU allowed the car to run without any of the previously described symptoms for ten, twenty thirty miles or more but with the fan running constantly - obviously not ideal and slightly effecting the cars performance...........then reconnect the TSU and within ten minutes the engine goes to pieces at the first sign of idling. Perhaps i'm thick or something but it's driven me mad!

Again Disconnect the TSU No problem - just the persistent fan.

[Pozzouk]

Thanks again Mike for your in depth suggestions.

First: I can't get to the car until the weekend, so hope the gear box will wait till then - What might the first signs of failure be? And not very pleased with a local garage and supposed gearbox specialist telling me they only ever use Dex II.

Second: The ETM upgrade/fix sounds reasonable having read in the past what a pain the unit can be - although i still don't see why the ETM should work fine with the temperature sender unit disconnected?!?!

PS. As regards the pressurization of the rad system i don't have a problem there as it has never boiled over.........not yet!

Many Thanks Pozzouk.

[Pozzouk]

Originally Posted by Chris_Rogers

I'd suggest:

Get a software change done on the autobox to get rid of the stop neutral feature and get the Volvo fault codes read from the box.

(If your code reader will allow you to set the OBDII protocol try using ISO 9141 and not KWP2000, it may read the auto box fault code).

Thanks Chris,

Do i presume that the neutral while foot is on break on was an ill fated feature? If, as you suggest it was removed by a software update i guess that should have been done years ago when in for servicing!

As for the code reader (i'm using an Autel 704) it seems to be attempting to use both of the protocols you mention.

ATB Pozzouk.

[Chris_Rogers]

I doubt the gearbox software would have been changed unless someone complained, so I'd get it checked out.
Have a look on the 2000> forum this is a common issue with early later shape cars until around 2002 when the feature was removed from the factory.

From my memory when I had a '99 car, KWP2000 only talks to the engine and ISO 9141 talks to both the engine and gearbox.

My OBDII software allowed selecting either protocol , I guess you could try pulling the fuse on the engine ECU, which would force the code reader to only talk to the autobox if you can't select the protocol to use from the tool.