Serious problem with V50!! Suspected snapped timing belt!! - Page 2

SonyVaio · Jun 10th, 2014, 17:50

Quote:

Originally Posted by bremner27

Thanks for the guide sony, I looked on my copy of vida but I just can't get to grips with it, cheers.

In VIDA, choose your vehicle from define vehicle, click on information tab and then click on 'repair'. Each section has a number so starting with the top click on section '2' then expand and click on section '5' and then expand and click on section '4' and you will than have the same instructions as I've posted up.

If you don't click on the 'repair' tab and just go through the sections it will just be the part numbers catalogue you end up searching. so sections '2' '5' '4' would take you to the part numbers for the EGR/Cooler etc...

HTH,

bremner27 · Jun 12th, 2014, 23:05

Right . . . just got in after another 3 hour shift stripping my engine down. I'm not 100% sure if the cam is bent, my brother is taking it in to work tomorrow to spin it and check it but the pulley is stuck fast and is far from sitting square.

We are now down to the pistons and you can feel where the exhaust valves have struck them but other than two small indents per piston they seem fine, as for the valves we are yet to strip down the head so thats a job for tomorrow.

So in conclusion all that we can see thats wrong so far is the pulley is not sitting square on the cam and the cam may be bent.

I've put some pictures of the valves and pistons below.

photo 1-1.JPG
photo 2-1.JPG
photo 3-1.JPG

rapidvxr · Jun 13th, 2014, 19:22

cambelts dont always snap just the toothy bits sheer off allowing the timing to slip , valves hit pistons and bend and/or cam followers snap , has the cam pulley come loose allowing belt to slip ? if cam were bent i`m 99.9% sure it would be inside not out

bremner27 · Jun 15th, 2014, 20:57

The engine and head is now fully stripped down and finally got through cleaning up the head and intake manifold today it was caked in gunk and has took an age to get rid of. (see pic 1)

The sum total of the damage is ten of the rocker arms are cracked (see pic 2) it looks like they took the brunt of the timing slip and not the valves as they all seem straight. The pulley was stuck on the cam and took some getting off and I'm not 100% they are still ok so I'm going to replace these also, it looks like the pulley was shimmed when it was attached to the cam and looks a bit botched (see pic 3&4).

So my total shopping list is . . .

10x Rocker arms (Part number 8653752)
4x Injector washers (Part number 30725238)
2x Injector studs (Part number 30725239)
1x Timing belt (Part number 8653650)
1x Head gasket (Part number 8653714) (I am not 100% this is the right one for my car as vida lists 4 different ones)
1x Intake gasket kit (30757077)
1x Cam (Part number 8653754)
1x Cam pulley (Part number 8653648)
1x Pulley bolt and washer (Part numbers 30725217 & 30725215)
1x Cam sealing ring (Part number 8653758)

I just sent a few emails off to part suppliers to get some prices but might look for a second hand cam and pulley depending on the cost.

Has anybody had any experience in setting the timing one one of these and how do you fix the pulley on the cam in the correct place, what I mean is the pulley has a hole in which is used for setting the timing but where does it go in relation to the cam? Has any body done this without the timing kit or is it a definite purchase? (Bottom one http://www.jhmbuttco.com/acatalog/Shop_Volvo_1133.html )

The general thinking now from people I've talked too is that the pulley has loosened and thats whats caused the slip, one mechanic I was speaking too said it could be because the place that did the belt change might not have used locktite when putting the pulley back on the cam?

Cheers, Andy

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Clan · Jun 15th, 2014, 21:48

does it look as if the head has been off recently?
It seems the pulley has come loose , a bodge with loctite , and due to the wobble the belt slipped a few teeth ? You will need a shaft and pulley as the mating surfaces will be damaged . The pulley should be keyed to the shaft , so that the pulley fits in only one place . perhaps the bodgers had the keyway broken and guessed the correct position and bonded it there !
There are a number of different thicknesses of headgaskets to suit the heights of the pistons above the block , you choose the gasket by the height of the highest piston . best measure those in case the previous bodger fitted a random incorrect gasket .
Good Luck you are doing well , it should go very well when you have it together again .

bremner27 · Jun 15th, 2014, 21:52

Quote:

Originally Posted by Clan

does it look as if the head has been off recently?
It seems the pulley has come loose , a bodge with loctite , and due to the wobble the belt slipped a few teeth ? You will need a shaft and pulley as the mating surfaces will be damaged . The pulley should be keyed to the shaft , so that the pulley fits in only one place . perhaps the bodgers had the keyway broken and guessed the correct position and bonded it there !
There are a number of different thicknesses of headgaskets to suit the heights of the pistons above the block , you choose the gasket by the height of the highest piston . best measure those in case the previous bodger fitted a random incorrect gasket .
Good Luck you are doing well , it should go very well when you have it together again .

Thanks for the reply and the vote of confidence mate much appreciated.

MacV50 · Jun 16th, 2014, 19:39

That parts list looks expensive. I'd have thought that a 2nd hand engine would have been a quicker and more cost effective solution.

bremner27 · Jun 16th, 2014, 19:46

Quote:

Originally Posted by MacV50

That parts list looks expensive. I'd have thought that a 2nd hand engine would have been a quicker and more cost effective solution.

Looked into it but still think its cheaper this way, going to get the cam and pulley second hand and all the rest I'm getting prices for now.

Rocker arms from Volvo dealers £54+vat each!!!!!!!! so looked on eBay and I can get all 16 for £90 delivered, I think its just a case of shopping around, luckily I'm not under that much pressure time wise as I have a van I can use in the mean time.

bremner27 · Jun 20th, 2014, 21:28

Got all the parts sorted, just waiting for the timing setting kit. Going to make a start on Sunday hopefully.

bremner27 · Jun 28th, 2014, 17:17

Well after a week of messing around, the car is fully back together BUT before starting it I turned the crank just to check but it will not make a full rotation! it does around a quarter of a turn then something stops it!

When we set the timing we put both the locking pins in and the flywheel lock, replaced the belt, took out the pins and flywheel lock, turned the crank two full rotations and the pins went back in so the timing is set. After this we gradually built everything back up, inlet manifold, exhaust stuff, turbo, fuel pump, fuel filter housing, starter motor etc etc etc.

This is the point where we tried turning the crank again but to no avail, so to troubleshoot we took anything off that effected the rotation of the engine which was the starter motor and the two pumps from the ends of the cams, tried to turn the crank again and still only a quarter rotation!

I am well and truly pee'd off at this point! Does anybody have any ideas at all what this could be?

Jun 15th, 2014, 21:48	#15
Clan Experienced Member Last Online: Yesterday 22:51 Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: L/H side	does it look as if the head has been off recently? It seems the pulley has come loose , a bodge with loctite , and due to the wobble the belt slipped a few teeth ? You will need a shaft and pulley as the mating surfaces will be damaged . The pulley should be keyed to the shaft , so that the pulley fits in only one place . perhaps the bodgers had the keyway broken and guessed the correct position and bonded it there ! There are a number of different thicknesses of headgaskets to suit the heights of the pistons above the block , you choose the gasket by the height of the highest piston . best measure those in case the previous bodger fitted a random incorrect gasket . Good Luck you are doing well , it should go very well when you have it together again . __________________ My comments are only based on my opinions and vast experience .

Jun 12th, 2014, 23:05	#12
bremner27 Member Last Online: Apr 23rd, 2024 19:22 Join Date: Apr 2013 Location: Bolton	Right . . . just got in after another 3 hour shift stripping my engine down. I'm not 100% sure if the cam is bent, my brother is taking it in to work tomorrow to spin it and check it but the pulley is stuck fast and is far from sitting square. We are now down to the pistons and you can feel where the exhaust valves have struck them but other than two small indents per piston they seem fine, as for the valves we are yet to strip down the head so thats a job for tomorrow. So in conclusion all that we can see thats wrong so far is the pulley is not sitting square on the cam and the cam may be bent. I've put some pictures of the valves and pistons below. photo 1-1.JPG photo 2-1.JPG photo 3-1.JPG

Jun 13th, 2014, 19:22	#13
rapidvxr Member Last Online: Nov 3rd, 2020 21:43 Join Date: Dec 2010 Location: selby	cambelts dont always snap just the toothy bits sheer off allowing the timing to slip , valves hit pistons and bend and/or cam followers snap , has the cam pulley come loose allowing belt to slip ? if cam were bent i`m 99.9% sure it would be inside not out

Jun 15th, 2014, 20:57	#14
bremner27 Member Last Online: Apr 23rd, 2024 19:22 Join Date: Apr 2013 Location: Bolton	The engine and head is now fully stripped down and finally got through cleaning up the head and intake manifold today it was caked in gunk and has took an age to get rid of. (see pic 1) The sum total of the damage is ten of the rocker arms are cracked (see pic 2) it looks like they took the brunt of the timing slip and not the valves as they all seem straight. The pulley was stuck on the cam and took some getting off and I'm not 100% they are still ok so I'm going to replace these also, it looks like the pulley was shimmed when it was attached to the cam and looks a bit botched (see pic 3&4). So my total shopping list is . . . 10x Rocker arms (Part number 8653752) 4x Injector washers (Part number 30725238) 2x Injector studs (Part number 30725239) 1x Timing belt (Part number 8653650) 1x Head gasket (Part number 8653714) (I am not 100% this is the right one for my car as vida lists 4 different ones) 1x Intake gasket kit (30757077) 1x Cam (Part number 8653754) 1x Cam pulley (Part number 8653648) 1x Pulley bolt and washer (Part numbers 30725217 & 30725215) 1x Cam sealing ring (Part number 8653758) I just sent a few emails off to part suppliers to get some prices but might look for a second hand cam and pulley depending on the cost. Has anybody had any experience in setting the timing one one of these and how do you fix the pulley on the cam in the correct place, what I mean is the pulley has a hole in which is used for setting the timing but where does it go in relation to the cam? Has any body done this without the timing kit or is it a definite purchase? (Bottom one http://www.jhmbuttco.com/acatalog/Shop_Volvo_1133.html ) The general thinking now from people I've talked too is that the pulley has loosened and thats whats caused the slip, one mechanic I was speaking too said it could be because the place that did the belt change might not have used locktite when putting the pulley back on the cam? Cheers, Andy 1.JPG 2.JPG 3.JPG 4.JPG

Jun 16th, 2014, 19:39	#17
MacV50 Master Member Last Online: Yesterday 20:45 Join Date: Feb 2012 Location: Aberdeen	That parts list looks expensive. I'd have thought that a 2nd hand engine would have been a quicker and more cost effective solution.

Jun 28th, 2014, 17:17	#20
bremner27 Member Last Online: Apr 23rd, 2024 19:22 Join Date: Apr 2013 Location: Bolton	Well after a week of messing around, the car is fully back together BUT before starting it I turned the crank just to check but it will not make a full rotation! it does around a quarter of a turn then something stops it! When we set the timing we put both the locking pins in and the flywheel lock, replaced the belt, took out the pins and flywheel lock, turned the crank two full rotations and the pins went back in so the timing is set. After this we gradually built everything back up, inlet manifold, exhaust stuff, turbo, fuel pump, fuel filter housing, starter motor etc etc etc. This is the point where we tried turning the crank again but to no avail, so to troubleshoot we took anything off that effected the rotation of the engine which was the starter motor and the two pumps from the ends of the cams, tried to turn the crank again and still only a quarter rotation! I am well and truly pee'd off at this point! Does anybody have any ideas at all what this could be?

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