The Morbidmobile Blog

[TomSaintJames]

A little info in the wring hands. Dangerous, yes? That's me.

Thanks Classicswede and Dave, some very useful info to think on there! Now I am quite ignorant of these things so please excuse any silly questions.

I found these on ebay, would they need any work other than a clean before use? To my untrained eye they appear ok, apart from perhaps a scratch/gouge on the face of the 3rd pictured head.

If the block I end up with does require a re-bore, will I need oversized pistons? The size depending on the degree of re-boring? In which case, the above pistons would be no good? I see on the classicswede website there are these but I wonder if they would give a too low a compression due to their reduced compression height (these 32.5mm, penta standard 36.7mm).

Is there any reason not to keep the current head? (im thinking of budget reasons here), or would a B230 head give better flow/economy/power etc. I'm thinking if I just source a B230 block this may work out cheaper, but not if it will be restrictive, that would quite defeat the point!

Thanks folks.

[Laird Scooby]

I wouldn't even think about secondhand pistons Tom. The point being, if the B230 block you get needs a rebore, the reason it needs a rebore is because the bores are worn to a point where they're too large for the piston to effectively seal inside.
Don't forget the pistons will also wear to a degree and fitting standard size pistons in an overbored block just won't work.

Purely from a budgetary point of view, i would suggest a secondhand B230E engine, preferably complete. You can then buy the various bits and pieces from Dai on a peacemeal basis, as and when you're ready to do each bit of work financially.

The B230E engine should give you a V cam (something in the back of my mind says the V cam was also fitted to B200E but i might be wrong) which would be more than adequate to get you going.

If you were going to upgrade the cam for something wilder, i'd suggest going for the H profile that Dai suiggested, will work well with your autobox keeping the powerband where you need it for normal commuting and/or touring for the purposes of camping. The T5 cam is more of a race/rally cam, looking at the spec it's likely to give a very lumpy idle and not be very tractable around town - foot to the floor above 3000rpm and it'll make your engine very powerful but realistically, how often do you drive like that?

You could keep the current head without a problem, in fact that is what i suggested with the Penta engine i linked to earlier. You might still have to change the cam though, depending what cam is in there at the moment.

[TomSaintJames]

OK, thanks Dave - that's good to know.

What engine might a saloon J reg 940 GL 2.3i auto have? It may say catalyser on the boot, difficult to tell from the photos and the ad doesn't show an engine shot. I've found such a one with an LPG conversion for sale for quite cheap! (just under £500). Also it looks quite tidy although it has been off the road since this March.

I imagine it's going to be the LH 2.4 injection rather than jetronic at this age? I'm thinking swap my 2.0 block onto it, ensure it's running properly, MOT and sell for some recuperation of funds. As long as putting a jetronic block on an LH2.4 car isn't going to create complications or additional expense!

Might it also be worth swapping the gearboxes for better ratios, for both cars? I think I remember reading saloon 940's had the fancy IRS rear axle rather than the basic one that the Hearse has, so that would rule out a rear axle swap.

[360beast]

760 Turbo saloon and 960's have IRS 940's have the solid axle still.

[Laird Scooby]

Originally Posted by TomSaintJames

OK, thanks Dave - that's good to know.

What engine might a saloon J reg 940 GL 2.3i auto have? It may say catalyser on the boot, difficult to tell from the photos and the ad doesn't show an engine shot. I've found such a one with an LPG conversion for sale for quite cheap! (just under £500). Also it looks quite tidy although it has been off the road since this March.

I imagine it's going to be the LH 2.4 injection rather than jetronic at this age? I'm thinking swap my 2.0 block onto it, ensure it's running properly, MOT and sell for some recuperation of funds. As long as putting a jetronic block on an LH2.4 car isn't going to create complications or additional expense!

Might it also be worth swapping the gearboxes for better ratios, for both cars? I think I remember reading saloon 940's had the fancy IRS rear axle rather than the basic one that the Hearse has, so that would rule out a rear axle swap.

I would hazard a guess at a B230FB so higher compression with the cat. Have you got a link to the car in question?

It will almost certainly be LH-Jetronic 2.4 and you could easily drop your B200E in there and sell it.
Chances are the back axle will be a higher ratio too so take advantage of that and swap it too if it is. Once you've fitted the stroker kit to the B230 to make it a high-torque 2.5, the extra legs of the higher ratio back axle will help.

I sense you're getting a bit confused about the terminology of the different fuel injection systems Tom, this will help to clarify things :

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fuel_injection

With the red block, the method of fueling is determined by the inlet manifold, not the block/head. You can fit a carburettor inlet manifold to a red block and make it a carburettor engine. You can fit different inlet manifolds and change the type of injection. In short, it's only a method of getting fuel into the engine. No matter what the spec of the engine is internally, the inlet manifold should fit all 8 valve heads (not sure on the 16v head) so the choice is yours. Likewise with exhaust manifolds.

As long as the 940 you've suggested isn't a turbo, you won't need to change your exhaust manifold/downpipes but i'd suggest (assuming it's an AW box) changing the engine and box as a complete unit. If it's a ZF, keep your gearbox, swap the bellhousing/backplates as needed (if needed), fit your inlet manifold to it and probably your dizzy as well. If memory serves, the LH2.4 4-pots have a CPS in the top of the bell housing and yours has Hall Effect in the dizzy - again this is another point in favour of the Penta lump i linked to, that should (in theory) just plug in and the dizzy cap and leads are a hell of a lot cheper as they're shared with many other cars on the planet and not just with a Porsche 924!

[TomSaintJames]

Good news on the rear axles - cheers Luke. It'd be good if the one on the 940 has longer legs. Is there a way to tell, from any castings or numbers on the axle/diff?

Here is the link Dave:

https://www.facebook.com/marketplace...1122818662394/

As regards to the terminology, I wondered if there may be extra sensors or other kit that the more complex injection system required, i'm quite happy there isn't though!

The seller is advertising on behalf of his uncle, so doesn't know much about the car, if the LPG works or not. He does say it has been well mainatined and runs well. I've asked him to get some more ingormation for me.

So to get this straight in my mind! In this scenario of swapping the two engines over, if i'm using the 2.0 inlet manifold and distributor on the 2.3/2.5 to go in the hearse - this will still be k-jetronic. Conversely the 2.0 engine to go back into the 940, using the 940's distributor and inlet would still be LH-2.4 as is on that car?

The next clarification - I would need to install the CPS from the LH-2.4 to the bell housing on the 940 when the B200E goes in, the 940's bellhousing will have the capacity for this but i'm assuming the hearse's wouldn't. If the 940 does have an AW box, and I am changing the gearboxes over, would the bellhousings need to be swapped too? I would hope not, for the sake of the CPS. Is the ZF box less desirable then Dave? The one I drove a while back in the 2.3 n/a estate was fine, although the Hearse's AW was smooth in comparison.

I just googled this and didn't find anything obvious about the bellhousings, I did learn that theyare seperate to gearboxes - I had assumed they were one unit, but thinking about it, changing the clutch would be much more difficult if it were all one piece!

Apologies again for many questions. Before this get's the go ahead I do need to know what is involved! I don't want to get part way through to realise it's going to cost the earth or have insurmountable issues. I do like the idea of a 2.5l hearse though, it;d be tempting to try and include the air filter box from the penta for something a little different.

[Laird Scooby]

Originally Posted by TomSaintJames

Good news on the rear axles - cheers Luke. It'd be good if the one on the 940 has longer legs. Is there a way to tell, from any castings or numbers on the axle/diff?

Here is the link Dave:

https://www.facebook.com/marketplace...1122818662394/

As regards to the terminology, I wondered if there may be extra sensors or other kit that the more complex injection system required, i'm quite happy there isn't though!

The seller is advertising on behalf of his uncle, so doesn't know much about the car, if the LPG works or not. He does say it has been well mainatined and runs well. I've asked him to get some more ingormation for me.

So to get this straight in my mind! In this scenario of swapping the two engines over, if i'm using the 2.0 inlet manifold and distributor on the 2.3/2.5 to go in the hearse - this will still be k-jetronic. Conversely the 2.0 engine to go back into the 940, using the 940's distributor and inlet would still be LH-2.4 as is on that car?

The next clarification - I would need to install the CPS from the LH-2.4 to the bell housing on the 940 when the B200E goes in, the 940's bellhousing will have the capacity for this but i'm assuming the hearse's wouldn't. If the 940 does have an AW box, and I am changing the gearboxes over, would the bellhousings need to be swapped too? I would hope not, for the sake of the CPS. Is the ZF box less desirable then Dave? The one I drove a while back in the 2.3 n/a estate was fine, although the Hearse's AW was smooth in comparison.

I just googled this and didn't find anything obvious about the bellhousings, I did learn that theyare seperate to gearboxes - I had assumed they were one unit, but thinking about it, changing the clutch would be much more difficult if it were all one piece!

Apologies again for many questions. Before this get's the go ahead I do need to know what is involved! I don't want to get part way through to realise it's going to cost the earth or have insurmountable issues. I do like the idea of a 2.5l hearse though, it;d be tempting to try and include the air filter box from the penta for something a little different.

Usually the axle ratio is on a plate on the left of the diff.

The gearbox is indeed an AW and the speedo is showing 45mph at a standstill - enlarge the photos and you'll see what i mean!

The LH2.4 will have additional sensors, most will be obvious and can be swapped as can the blanking plugs from yours.

You'll have to keep the bellhousing with the car it came from, likewise the flywheels/driveplates as the two ignition systems have different pick up points. Also bear in mind, the flywheel/driveplate will only work in one position on the 940 because of the CPS. Unless there is a blanking plug in your bellhousing where the CPS would go of course!

You've answered your own question about the ZF/AW comparison, also the AWs tend to be more reliable.

My advice would be if you're going to buy the white one as a potential donor is arrange personal breakdown cover (if you don't already have it) with recovery, book a days temporary insurance cover and an MoT at your local MoT station and take the train to collect it. Drive it straight to the MoT station and find out what's wrong with it, then decide your exact course of action from there.

Then once you know, assuming everything is ok that you need, get the engine out, strip it, fit the crankshaft and any other bits you need to fit, decoke the head, clean the head bolt holes out with a tap and fit a new top seal to the water pump then refit the head with a new cambelt. When you come to do the swap it will save time and trouble.

That's only general advice at the moment as nobody knows the state of the engine, box and so on or if the LPG is working or what system is fitted. However the MoT history suggests everything should be good with it.

[classicswede]

Originally Posted by 360beast

760 Turbo saloon and 960's have IRS 940's have the solid axle still.

760 Turbo saloon and estate have a solid axle
960 mk1 most saloons have the IRS but not estates
960 mk2 are all IRS (mk2 version as per s90/v90)

Some 760 (v6) saloons have the mk1 IRS rear end

[classicswede]

I would forget about dropping your old bottom end into the 940 as you would be best just stripping it. I doubt its worth swapping the heads over so that you can use the B200 bottom end in it

[TomSaintJames]

Originally Posted by classicswede

I would forget about dropping your old bottom end into the 940 as you would be best just stripping it. I doubt its worth swapping the heads over so that you can use the B200 bottom end in it

How do you mean? I would hope to swap the two engines over, so that the then 2.0 940 runs nicely and sell it on to recuperate some funds. Do you think it would be better economically to strip the 940 and sell as spares? With all that is going on in my life the last I need is a car to strip! So as long as the 940's sale price doesn't get close or fall below the cost of putting the 2.0 into it, to me that seems the easiest/best way.