Looking to purchase t5 c70 - LPT/HPT

[PNB0807]

Originally Posted by ITSv40

I find my convertible a very pleasurable drive and just what I was expecting - I didn't buy it to rag around the twisties though. Yes, there is some scuttle shake and fitting a strut brace has now resolved that to the point that any remaining shake is considered 'character'. I have only ever driven two other convertibles: my son's XR3i and a R-R Corniche Drophead. Considering both cars are at opposite ends of the quality scale, both are floppy and much more so than the C70.

Good to hear, reassuring to know that most descriptions of the handling are exaggerated. Yes suppose they are both opposite ends of the spectrum, I’d say the c70 is the best of both worlds though

[PNB0807]

Originally Posted by tony209

Don't be put off trying out a T5 cabriolet, I had a 2.4 and a T5 at the same time - guess which I eventually got rid of! The T5 has loads more power and still keeps pulling long after the LPT 2.4 has run out of boost. I also found that the T5 was slightly better on fuel economy and it was cheaper on insurance.

A T5 coupe would be the ideal find but if you find a good T5 cabriolet and want to keep it, I'd recommend swapping the shocks for Koni active ones. The only other thing I would suggest is that if you are buying an auto, the T5 brakes aren't up to the performance.

Thanks for the reply!

That’s good to know, there is a lovely example of a t5 cab for sale in the north of the country which I may consider now, was just concerned about the handling being affected more than anything. If I go for it will definitely look into the Koni shock kit, is it readily available from Volvo or any other parts distributor? Also what’s the price like on the set? Sorry for all the questions but what tyres do you run? Was thinking Goodyear’s or uniroyal rainsport5’s however if it makes the cornering better will consider the more expensive brands

Cheers
Phil

[tony209]

Originally Posted by PNB0807

Thanks for the reply!

That’s good to know, there is a lovely example of a t5 cab for sale in the north of the country which I may consider now, was just concerned about the handling being affected more than anything. If I go for it will definitely look into the Koni shock kit, is it readily available from Volvo or any other parts distributor? Also what’s the price like on the set? Sorry for all the questions but what tyres do you run? Was thinking Goodyear’s or uniroyal rainsport5’s however if it makes the cornering better will consider the more expensive brands

Cheers
Phil

The Koni active shocks I bought from Larkspeed but most performance outlets will stock them. The fronts were £320 for the pair and £160/pair for the rears but I think its cheaper if you buy all 4 as a package. I don't think you really need the rears, even Koni say it's not necessary to have them. The car corners really flat and I'm still surprised how fast I can push the car into a corner. I've also got aftermarket wheels with a wider track so that probably helps.

I have AVON ZV7 all round but when I bought the car, it had winter tyres all round, I have to say, the scuttle shake was less with the winters so maybe the softer tread soaks up some of the scuttle shake??

[PNB0807]

Originally Posted by tony209

The Koni active shocks I bought from Larkspeed but most performance outlets will stock them. The fronts were £320 for the pair and £160/pair for the rears but I think its cheaper if you buy all 4 as a package. I don't think you really need the rears, even Koni say it's not necessary to have them. The car corners really flat and I'm still surprised how fast I can push the car into a corner. I've also got aftermarket wheels with a wider track so that probably helps.

I have AVON ZV7 all round but when I bought the car, it had winter tyres all round, I have to say, the scuttle shake was less with the winters so maybe the softer tread soaks up some of the scuttle shake??

Okay thanks for the advice, will definitely be going for the shock kit whatever combination I go for, finally how would you the day the performance compares between auto and manual?
Cheers
Phil

[tony209]

I've only had automatics so I can't give you a comparison and my V70 although a manual, is the P2 chassis.

The auto box is very smooth and great for easy cruising. Rather than having a sport button, It's adaptive and learns how you drive - the downside to this is that it can be a bit slow to go into sport mode if you have been driving 'economically' for a while.

The gearbox works well if you are progressing through a set of bends but if you need to brake into a corner, it's not great, there's no engine braking and it doesn't change down until you apply throttle.

There's a torque limiter to protect the box and the torque converter so it frustratingly changes up when you can feel the engine has more to give. That said, you'll never get tired of putting your foot to the floor to overtake on a straight road, if you are doing 40 - 50, the kickdown drops two gears and puts you right is the engines torque and boost band - it's a wild ride, my girlfriend calls it "Warp drive"!

I think if you buy the coupe, you would be better off with a manual but the convertible is more about the enjoyment of top down driving and I would say you're better off with the auto.

[JohnM 855 T5R]

Originally Posted by tony209

There's a torque limiter to protect the box and the torque converter

I am led to believe by an auto transmission specialist in the know who has serviced these boxes for 20 years or more that 42le and 55 4 and 5 speed gearboxes are both rated at up to 300 bhp and 400Nm of torque. The purpose of the torque limiter was to prevent uncontrollable wheelspin due to the torque multiplication effect of the torque converter.

Regards
John

[tony209]

Thats interesting to know (if correct). I've often wondered how much more torque the gearbox can take if the engine was chipped.

The limiter is to prevent over revving in all gears, whether this is to prevent over stressing the gearbox or to prevent wheel spin I don't know, I was told the former.

It changes up at around 5,200 rpm, looking at a bhp and torque graph for the 2.3, there's still a bit more to give and you can feel it, there's about 10 more bhp available at 5,500 rpm.

[JohnM 855 T5R]

Originally Posted by tony209

Thats interesting to know (if correct). I've often wondered how much more torque the gearbox can take if the engine was chipped.

The limiter is to prevent over revving in all gears, whether this is to prevent over stressing the gearbox or to prevent wheel spin I don't know, I was told the former.

It changes up at around 5,200 rpm, looking at a bhp and torque graph for the 2.3, there's still a bit more to give and you can feel it, there's about 10 more bhp available at 5,500 rpm.

I would think it's true as I have seen similar discussions on American forum threads confirming this. Also, the manufacturer Aisin gives 300 bhp and 400N/m in their technical data sheets.

The torque limiter does not limit engine revs - at 5200rpm (your change point) you are over the torque peak and it falls off quite quickly. I believe the gearbox ECU works in conjunction with the engine ECU to adjust the fuelling and boost to keep the engine torque down (hence why autobox engine ECU's are different to the manuals).

Your change point seems a little low - my auto 4 speed T-5R shifts at 5,600 rpm and my auto 5 speed C30 and C70 T5 polestars both shift around 5,700 rpm as well

Note that bhp doesn't give you acceleration, it's torque that does that. Because at higher revs the torque multiplication from the converter slackens off, an earlier shift point is likely to result in better acceleration if there is no "lock-up" mode on the torque converter (in lock-up there is no torque multiplication, the drive is directly transmitted to the gearbox which is good for fuel consumption). When the box shifts up, assuming no lock-up, although you are dropping back down the engine torque curve, you get higher torque multiplication at the lower revs in the next gear. All of these parameters are held within the ECU's to give the optimum performance
The 42LE equipped T-5R/T5 and R have no lock up in the first 3 gears and lock-up in 4th only occurs at well over 100 m.p.h. Fuel consumption is thus adversely affected but acceleration is very good. Non turbo 850 models do have lock up in the lower gears but again, only when revs are lower and smaller throttle openings are applied.
In the quest for improved fuel consumption and emissions, on SN55 5 speeds, lock up is available on 2nd, 3rd, 4th and 5th from about 1700 r.p.m at small throttle openings. At wide throttle openings, lock-up is disengaged and comes back on much higher up the rev range.

All very complicated but I hope it makes sense.

Regards
John

[PNB0807]

Originally Posted by tony209

The Koni active shocks I bought from Larkspeed but most performance outlets will stock them. The fronts were £320 for the pair and £160/pair for the rears but I think its cheaper if you buy all 4 as a package. I don't think you really need the rears, even Koni say it's not necessary to have them. The car corners really flat and I'm still surprised how fast I can push the car into a corner. I've also got aftermarket wheels with a wider track so that probably helps.

I have AVON ZV7 all round but when I bought the car, it had winter tyres all round, I have to say, the scuttle shake was less with the winters so maybe the softer tread soaks up some of the scuttle shake??

That’s quite reasonable to be fair! Will definitely get the kit whether its coupe or cabrio, do you think combined with lowering springs it would make it a bit more agile? Avon’s are good tyres have run them on previous cars will definitely consider them if The new purchase needs them

Cheers again for the advice, much appreciated!

Phil

[PNB0807]

Originally Posted by tony209

I've only had automatics so I can't give you a comparison and my V70 although a manual, is the P2 chassis.

The auto box is very smooth and great for easy cruising. Rather than having a sport button, It's adaptive and learns how you drive - the downside to this is that it can be a bit slow to go into sport mode if you have been driving 'economically' for a while.

The gearbox works well if you are progressing through a set of bends but if you need to brake into a corner, it's not great, there's no engine braking and it doesn't change down until you apply throttle.

There's a torque limiter to protect the box and the torque converter so it frustratingly changes up when you can feel the engine has more to give. That said, you'll never get tired of putting your foot to the floor to overtake on a straight road, if you are doing 40 - 50, the kickdown drops two gears and puts you right is the engines torque and boost band - it's a wild ride, my girlfriend calls it "Warp drive"!

I think if you buy the coupe, you would be better off with a manual but the convertible is more about the enjoyment of top down driving and I would say you're better off with the auto.

Will bare this in mind when I’m looking around, manual seems to be the way to go for now due to the lovely country roads around where I live, engine braking seems almost essential sometimes, not to mention the lovely sound of the t5.

Cheers again
Phil