240 vs 740

[Stephen Edwin]

Originally Posted by 57RKL

Ahh Mr Prufrock, Good to see you back from your latest forum ban. I trust you will be on your best behaviour on the 200 series forum ?
We have our reputation to uphold on the 200 forum as THE iconic classic Volvo.

Originally Posted by tt82

Is this really necessary? I trust this is an end to the trolling or it will be holiday season for a few more people!

I hope all concerned may just be peaceable.

Originally Posted by Prufrock

It is all largely subjective and the choice is always based on preferences and needs (perhaps budget as well).

I have just written a chapter on Volvo estates for a forthcoming book on estate cars, which got me thinking quite a lot about both. And as a result I have interviewed a number of owners of both 245s and 745s - many may no longer own the cars but bought them new and were owned them long term. Both my 245DL and 745GLa were bought new by relatives (ok, the 745 was a few months old):

245. Bought new in 1988; by a senior civil servant with a liking for the values that Volvo represented, and couldn't justify the extra cost of the 745.

745, Bought a few months old in 1986, by a lecturer. A fan of many things Swedish (not because it was though), who thought the 245 a little old fashioned and on the small side - he was quite tall with long legs.

Testimony to both is the build quality and durability of these Volvos, interesting that the more expensive 745 is now less expensive that it's once cheaper sibling - that's fashion for you! Both my cars are currently being fettled for 2017, and a road trip to Catalonia is planned for the 745.

Jon.

Subjective and objective overlap.

I hope the many shall we say practical comments in this thread have assisted you.

The difference in second hand price could reflect e.g. practicality, build quality and degrees of iconic status. Fashion? Who knows?

[Prufrock]

Originally Posted by Stephen Edwin

The difference in second hand price could reflect e.g. practicality, build quality and degrees of iconic status. Fashion? Who knows?

The book is shaping up nicely, and the research for the Volvo chapter was completed without input from neither the VOC or this forum - some friends (in the VOC) have given me some assistance with the 245 as have new buyers of both.

The difference in used prices always reflects many objective and subjective factors - whether classics or moderns. Iconic is a very overused word, and I wouldn't use it too freely in this context - fashion is a always a factor in all markets (with the exception perhaps of what I refer to as the utility car market).

Jon.

[Stephen Edwin]

Jeeves might say, a gentleman instinctively knows what is iconic, and that fashion is perhaps most relevant the some forms of utility cars. Even serious four wheel drive cars can be practical and iconic or fashionable or any permutation thereof.

Dictionaries are there to record how persons like us use words. So we might have our conversation preserved for posterity.


.

[stephend]

I'm not sure "iconic" is the word I'd pick for my 740; "square" is probably the word I'd pick...

[Prufrock]

Originally Posted by Stephen Edwin

Jeeves might say, a gentleman instinctively knows what is iconic, and that fashion is perhaps most relevant the some forms of utility cars. Even serious four wheel drive cars can be practical and iconic or fashionable or any permutation thereof.

Dictionaries are there to record how persons like us use words. So we might have our conversation preserved for posterity.


.

But Jeeves didn't Stephen. And I should have explained the context in which I use the term utility car - I've used it before in VOC mag articles; it is a car that falls into the space between modern and classic - others might refer to it as a banger or hack.

I'm not using the term to describe an SUV, and as said, the word iconic is so overused it has lost it's original meaning - if everything is iconic then ergo, nothing is.

Jon.

P.S only here as there's no interest in 700s I regret.

[Stephen Edwin]

Oh Jeeves did, it just hasn't been mentioned before.

Banger hacks are wonderful machines. I remember a Maxi 1500. It almost drove itself.

Everything an icon? Gosh. What next? More than one of a unique item?

Each of us is an icon. A vehicle qualifies imho when people clearly notice it.

P.S. I have a small number of actual, icons, in my home.

P.P.S. I'm sure interest will arrive in 700 section.


.

[stephend]

Originally Posted by Prufrock

But Jeeves didn't Stephen. And I should have explained the context in which I use the term utility car - I've used it before in VOC mag articles; it is a car that falls into the space between modern and classic - others might refer to it as a banger or hack.

Interesting... I think I'd use "utility" to mean a car that is primarily practical, rather than primarily stylish, or sporty or whatever. In that sense, I'd probably lump estate cars, 4x4s, and car-based vans together under the heading of "utility" - and even there, some estate cars are a sight more practical than others (think Volvo v. Audi Avant...). But I guess that bangers do also fit, on the basis of running 'em for pennies and throwing them away when something goes wrong: it's a practical form of motoring in the sense of being cheap and hard-headed.

For me, the 7/900 estate is the ultimate utility car: huge practical load area, self-levelling rear suspension, and comfortable to drive over long distances. And there's no extraneous "styling", just a shape that does exactly what's needed with no fuss. No doubt the 200 ticks the same boxes; for my money the 7/900 styling (especially the original 700: I'm with Jon on that) is cleaner than the 200, but that's just personal taste.

[Prufrock]

Originally Posted by Stephen Edwin

Banger hacks are wonderful machines. I remember a Maxi 1500. It almost drove itself.

Maxi, never driven one, had a Wolseley Six for a while (not mine).

P.P.S. I'm sure interest will arrive in 700 section. [/I].

Thanks for the last comment Stephen, but I'm really not concerned any more -whatever I post on the forum these days is usually trolled by a few odious types*, or falls on deaf ears due to a lack of interest.

Cheers, Jon.

*they're probably looking at reporting this post.

[Stephen Edwin]

Originally Posted by stephend

Interesting... I think I'd use "utility" to mean a car that is primarily practical, rather than primarily stylish, or sporty or whatever. In that sense, I'd probably lump estate cars, 4x4s, and car-based vans together under the heading of "utility" - and even there, some estate cars are a sight more practical than others (think Volvo v. Audi Avant...). But I guess that bangers do also fit, on the basis of running 'em for pennies and throwing them away when something goes wrong: it's a practical form of motoring in the sense of being cheap and hard-headed.

For me, the 7/900 estate is the ultimate utility car: huge practical load area, self-levelling rear suspension, and comfortable to drive over long distances. And there's no extraneous "styling", just a shape that does exactly what's needed with no fuss. No doubt the 200 ticks the same boxes; for my money the 7/900 styling (especially the original 700: I'm with Jon on that) is cleaner than the 200, but that's just personal taste.

I think I've indicated before in fairness. My 740 did also swallow huge amounts and travelled me driving long distances even when I was tired and ill.






Whisper .. my 740 just wasn't a 240 ... build quality, road clearance, seat posture, ICONICITY

[john.wigley]

Originally Posted by Prufrock

Thanks for the last comment Stephen, but I'm really not concerned any more -whatever I post on the forum these days is usually trolled by a few odious types*, or falls on deaf ears due to a lack of interest.

Cheers, Jon.

*they're probably looking at reporting this post.

I'm genuinely sorry to read that, Jon; I've always regarded you as an ambassador* for the 700 and 900 series cars.

When we were running our 2s, the 7s were so new as to be out of our price range. We bought our last 7 series at 11 years old with 96 K for £1750. It served us faithfully for 18 years and over 70K before it died earlier this year. Those that we looked at to replace it were little better than ours, so we finally settled for a 2000 V70. It's a good car, but I would much prefer a nice late 945, or 965/V90.

Now, as you rightly say, the 2 series cars - and, even earlier, the 1 series - that then we regarded as expendable are now collectable, with commensurately higher price tags, and the 7s are in the utility / banger category, as is our early V70 also. That's fine by us, as others have said they represent cheap motoring with little or no depreciation more than offsetting the increased cost at the pumps.

I also agree with Stephen, I'm sure that as tempus continues to fugit and the 7s reach a critical mass like the 2s before them, interest will revive. It's just a matter of keeping the faith alive until then!

Regards, John.

* Not the BL variant! Talking of Maxis - we part exchanged our '82 champagne beige rust bucket for our first 244 (a '75) in the mid eighties! J.