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V70 D5 - oil level low

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Old Jul 20th, 2018, 23:31   #21
AndyV7o
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It is pretty easy ...0w/30 has always been the Very best quality recommended by Volvo ( not me ) for the D5 …
up to 2006 a cheaper alternative 5w/30 was recommended by volvo if cost was a problem , but after 2006 0w/30 was always mandatory . Nothing else was suitable according to volvo in UK , other markets may be different of course .
I'd love to see the handbook regarding this, its very unusual not to have a range of suitable viscosities, but if they did alter the internals of the engine for euro4 (which is likely) they may have made tolerances so tight that the hths values are critical, that said, not only 0w30 is available in B5, hths values are what the engine encounters not the (old school) static viscosities. Im just curious here, Id like to see what volvo states in the book, for reference, im not out to call you out or pick a fight!
(Of course 5w is a little thicker when cold than 0w (though some can be almost identical) and the static visc is relevant here)
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Old Jul 21st, 2018, 09:42   #22
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I'd love to see the handbook regarding this, its very unusual not to have a range of suitable viscosities, but if they did alter the internals of the engine for euro4 (which is likely) they may have made tolerances so tight that the hths values are critical, that said, not only 0w30 is available in B5, hths values are what the engine encounters not the (old school) static viscosities. Im just curious here, Id like to see what volvo states in the book, for reference, im not out to call you out or pick a fight!
(Of course 5w is a little thicker when cold than 0w (though some can be almost identical) and the static visc is relevant here)
The handbooks are well out of date and the same worldwide of course , we must go by what volvo UK recommend and that is what I stated above ...
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Old Jul 21st, 2018, 09:54   #23
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The handbooks are what volvo stated for the engine at time of manufacture, that is what is correct, what may be happening now doesnt apply to back then. The latest oils can kill an old engine.
Sometimes ignorant dealers dont understand this and recommend the wrong thing (often tbh)
Sometimes manufacturers claim to have 'backward compatibility' but this in reality only spans back a handful of years. Take vauxhall dexos 2, its supposed to be fully backwards compatible with all preceding requirements, but in reality this only works back to the early '00's, you cant run a dexos 2 oil in say a 1988 cavalier, or even a lot of 1998 stuff as it wont sufficiently protect the engine, and you certainly cant put it in a 1968 victor!
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Old Jul 21st, 2018, 10:01   #24
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The handbooks are what volvo stated for the engine at time of manufacture, that is what is correct, what may be happening now doesnt apply to back then. The latest oils can kill an old engine.
Sometimes ignorant dealers dont understand this and recommend the wrong thing (often tbh)
Sometimes manufacturers claim to have 'backward compatibility' but this in reality only spans back a handful of years. Take vauxhall dexos 2, its supposed to be fully backwards compatible with all preceding requirements, but in reality this only works back to the early '00's, you cant run a dexos 2 oil in say a 1988 cavalier, or even a lot of 1998 stuff as it wont sufficiently protect the engine, and you certainly cant put it in a 1968 victor!
I'm sure volvo know a lot more than you and I when they specify their oil recommendations ! and yes , they still specify the same oil for a 2002 D5 to a 2014 D5 I should know it is my profession .
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Old Jul 21st, 2018, 10:19   #25
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Thats the thing, Im trying to suss what volvo are up to.
Thing is, take a 2002 D5, it was specified B4 when the rest of the range were A5/B5, there is a reason for this, it changed to B5 when switching to euro4, there is a reason for this.
The people on the parts counter, or sat in an office at headquarters dont understand, and will often make the same mistake the general public make in assuming new always supercedes what went before, when in the case of oil specs this doesnt always follow suit. They arent oil or engine people, they dont get it, thus will blindly make assumptions.
You yourself are clearly very experienced and a well respected forum member/tech source, but were under the impression that A5/B5 replaces A3/B4 when its crucially different in an important parameter and should not be used where not specified, Acea say this, not just me. Yet you have been innocently telling people to put the wrong oil in their cars, and have yourself been putting the wrong oil in peoples cars. It wasnt ignorance as such, youd just misunderstood or been led to believe something incorrect. This happens all the way up the ladder.
Sometimes companies just dont care about the older vehicles and are happy to recommend any old ****e.

Thus, what was stated at point of manufacture should always be followed, where possible.
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Old Jul 21st, 2018, 10:25   #26
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AndyV7o View Post
Thats the thing, Im trying to suss what volvo are up to.
Thing is, take a 2002 D5, it was specified B4 when the rest of the range were A5/B5, there is a reason for this, it changed to B5 when switching to euro4, there is a reason for this.
The people on the parts counter, or sat in an office at headquarters dont understand, and will often make the same mistake the general public make in assuming new always supercedes what went before, when in the case of oil specs this doesnt always follow suit. They arent oil or engine people, they dont get it, thus will blindly make assumptions.
You yourself are clearly very experienced and a well respected forum member/tech source, but were under the impression that A5/B5 replaces A3/B4 when its crucially different in an important parameter and should not be used where not specified, Acea say this, not just me. Yet you have been innocently telling people to put the wrong oil in their cars, and have yourself been putting the wrong oil in peoples cars. It wasnt ignorance as such, youd just misunderstood or been led to believe something incorrect. This happens all the way up the ladder.
Sometimes companies just dont care about the older vehicles and are happy to recommend any old ****e.

Thus, what was stated at point of manufacture should always be followed, where possible.
I'm just following volvos recommendation it is ludicrous to say the wrong oil has been going into volvo engines and perhaps you should be directing your science to volvo themselves as the layman won't understand anything you say unfortunately ..
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Old Jul 21st, 2018, 10:56   #27
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Im certainly tempted to email volvo, the problem is getting to the actual engine dept who understand what Im on about rather than a suit sat behind a desk!
Thing is, when the D5 was designed, the engine designers and associated oil chemists fealt that the oil used for everything else wasnt suitable, thus, stipulated a different spec. There will have been someone in finance saying 'why do we have to now buy in a different oil? We have oil, why cant you use that?' The engine techs will have given them sufficient reason why this extra expense is necessary, thus, the different oil was specced and used.
They then either carried on developing the engine ready for euro4 in order to use B5, or, did extensive testing to see if they can get away with B5 over a long period, perhaps a bit of both, we will probably never know, thus, we should use what the handbook states.
A5/B5 will/can never supercede A3/B4, if anything will itll be C3 most likely. As it stands A3/B4 is still a current active spec. As such, A5/B5 where A3/B4 is specified, is the -wrong- oil. Both are full saps so thats a big concern that isnt a concern, it pretty much down to the hths which is the 'working viscosity' that the engine encounters/needs. Using A5/B5 in place of A3/B4 is going along the lines of using 0w30 in an engine requiring 20w50, if that helps portray it... Someone using B5 in place of B4 who drives gently and covers primarily motorway miles will likely be just fine. 👍

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Old Jul 21st, 2018, 16:39   #28
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Anmdy: are you saying that my 2012 printed handbook for my 2012 D5 XC70 which states that the oil to be used is ACEA A5/B5 SAE 0W-30 might be incorrect? I can buy the fact that changes to oil usage in later engines might influence dealers to standardise on the later oil without worrying about whether it should replace the earlier oil but are you saying that the techs who wrote the 2012 owners handbook did the same thing and quoted the wrong oil in the Specifications section? I realise that you have been talking about earlier cars than mine but if they are D5 engines, did later D5s have altered specs that needed altered oil? I am not highly worried but would like to fully understand the statements being made and whether they can possibly apply to my car.
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Old Jul 21st, 2018, 16:48   #29
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No, what it states n the handbook is what was/is required for your engine.
The D5 either had further development and altered internals fir the euro4 variant, or they were not convinced that B5 was suitable at the time of releasing the D5 and continued testing to see how it panned out long term, or a bit of both. 👍
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Old Jul 23rd, 2018, 18:37   #30
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I have run my discovery R380 gearbox on atf from new, as this was the original specifications oil, later models specced mtf oil which is allegedly better.
I had the gearbox rebuilt 3 years ago as I had a vibration, turned out it was 1 bearing in the center of the box. Bearings and gaskets renewed but all other internals were reused. Gearbox currently has 200k+ miles on it and is as smooth as silk.

Provided the oil meets the spec at time of engine build and is changed regularly it should be fine. Although I use castrol 0/30 A5B5 I nevery get to anything near 185k miles between oil changes, annual oil change is normally 8 to 10 k

All oils are changed more frequently on the discovery, it is used off road and regularly waded emulsified oil is useless anywhere except painted on the garden shed.

A bit of common sence keeps your motor in top condition no matter it's age.

Paul.
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