Best saloon car ever made?

[Dippydog]

biggbn,there is evidence to suggest that Ledwinka "cribbed" the design of the Tatra T77 from the Burney Streamline of 1929-1931.Designed by Sir Charles Dennistoun Burney[he also designed the R100 airship]only 12 of these cars were made with an 8cylinder engine slung out the back-none exist now-Ledwinka met Burney when both had stands at the 1931 Olympia motor show and the T77 appeared the following year.
Harvey 1512 I'd much sooner have a proper booted saloon the a hatchback,but hey long live the differences

[biggbn]

Originally Posted by Dippydog

biggbn,there is evidence to suggest that Ledwinka "cribbed" the design of the Tatra T77 from the Burney Streamline of 1929-1931.Designed by Sir Charles Dennistoun Burney[he also designed the R100 airship]only 12 of these cars were made with an 8cylinder engine slung out the back-none exist now-Ledwinka met Burney when both had stands at the 1931 Olympia motor show and the T77 appeared the following year.
Harvey 1512 I'd much sooner have a proper booted saloon the a hatchback,but hey long live the differences

Thanks man, lifelong tatra fan yet did not know this

Edit...surely Paul jaray had designed many streamliners way before the 30s?

[360beast]

Originally Posted by phil1968

I had a face-lifted '83 'Sud 1350 5-door in the late 80s, with the hatchback it should've had on the original. Remember it being a sweet handling, charismatic thing with an engine that punched well above it's weight.
I'd like to add the W211 Mercedes E-Class as a contender. Had an '03 E320CDI about 10 years ago, it had a 3.2 litre straight-six turbodiesel that made more torque than their 5.0 V8 at the time & an interior that was a very pleasant place to be. Still the best car I've ever owned. And thousands of continental taxi drivers can't be wrong

My brothers both had suds. Absolutely brilliant cars, my eldest brother had a lot of them! His first one was a 1.5 ti which he swapped in a 1.7 from a 33 with twin 40 dellortos so fuel consumption went out the window! It also had a factory sports exhaust, momo wheels and steering wheel with bucket seats. I remember driving around when we only fitted the front half of the exhaust, that was a laugh

[biggbn]

Have owned a w123 Merc saloon and estate, and a w124 saloon..cars of huge integrity and quality. Many love big Peugeot 504 for similar reasons, always wondered why I have never had one!!

[GSB]

The saloon car is a dying breed these days, which is a shame because it makes for such a good looking car.

My nominees;

W126 Merc for its sheer presence. I’d love to have one now.

3rd gen E55 AMG. Soooo comfortable, and with ‘that’ 5.5l supercharged V8. Last of the ‘subtle’ AMG’s.

Mazda 6 MPS/Mazdaspeed 6. A proper Q-car among the WRX/Evo’s of the day. Super comfy, and incredibly talented. Subtle changes outside to accommodate wider track and outsize intercooler stack (the bonnet was 2 inches higher than the standard car). Huge changes to the chassis though to accomodate various braces and the rear axle from an RX8. To look at it you’d never know that it was an all wheel drive barnstormer with getting on for 300hp.

Mk2 facelift Ford Granada 2.9 Ghia X. No arguments accepted here. The Mk2 Granny is a damn good looking car.

Vauxhall VXR8. Vauxhall is a company I’ve long despised for its half hearted engineering and mediocre ‘that’ll do’ offerings. The very sight of a Vauxhall Mokka makes me want to self harm, but just occasionally, as with the aforementioned Lotus Carlton, they do so something so mad you have to take notice and even applaude them for it. After the lunatic VX220turbo took an Elise and turned it up to eleven, they started importing hairy chested V8 Holdens and rebadging them as Vauxhall’s. The VXR8 in 2007 was a leather lined 6.0 V8 missile, and it was only £35k new when a decent AMG merc would cost you double that. To add to the already unhinged offering, you could have dealer endorsed, supplied and warranty friendly upgrades that boosted power to over 570hp.

[biggbn]

Originally Posted by GSB

The saloon car is a dying breed these days, which is a shame because it makes for such a good looking car.

My nominees;

W126 Merc for its sheer presence. I’d love to have one now.

3rd gen E55 AMG. Soooo comfortable, and with ‘that’ 5.5l supercharged V8. Last of the ‘subtle’ AMG’s.

Mazda 6 MPS/Mazdaspeed 6. A proper Q-car among the WRX/Evo’s of the day. Super comfy, and incredibly talented. Subtle changes outside to accommodate wider track and outsize intercooler stack (the bonnet was 2 inches higher than the standard car). Huge changes to the chassis though to accomodate various braces and the rear axle from an RX8. To look at it you’d never know that it was an all wheel drive barnstormer with getting on for 300hp.

Mk2 facelift Ford Granada 2.9 Ghia X. No arguments accepted here. The Mk2 Granny is a damn good looking car.

Vauxhall VXR8. Vauxhall is a company I’ve long despised for its half hearted engineering and mediocre ‘that’ll do’ offerings. The very sight of a Vauxhall Mokka makes me want to self harm, but just occasionally, as with the aforementioned Lotus Carlton, they do so something so mad you have to take notice and even applaude them for it. After the lunatic VX220turbo took an Elise and turned it up to eleven, they started importing hairy chested V8 Holdens and rebadging them as Vauxhall’s. The VXR8 in 2007 was a leather lined 6.0 V8 missile, and it was only £35k new when a decent AMG merc would cost you double that. To add to the already unhinged offering, you could have dealer endorsed, supplied and warranty friendly upgrades that boosted power to over 570hp.

Did you get a 2.9 in the mk2? I thought you only got carbed and injected 2.8s. I had a 2.8ghia estate, wonderful car

[GSB]

Originally Posted by biggbn

Did you get a 2.9 in the mk2? I thought you only got carbed and injected 2.8s. I had a 2.8ghia estate, wonderful car

Saw one in Marylebone a couple of weeks ago. Fantastic looking thing in metallic green. Pretty sure it was badged as a 2.9, but could just as easily have been a 2.8 I guess.

[biggbn]

Originally Posted by GSB

Saw one in Marylebone a couple of weeks ago. Fantastic looking thing in metallic green. Pretty sure it was badged as a 2.9, but could just as easily have been a 2.8 I guess.

I think the 2.9 and 2.9 24v cosworth were only available in mk3 'big sierra' shape and subsequent fish face Scorpio, all of which are excellent cars in own right. None could hold a candle to 24v Carlton gsi or 24v senator in my opinion, old school lairy rwd fun. I had a 12v auto senny and it changed into top at 127mph on the dot in sport mode...ask me how I know..😈🤔

[GSB]

Originally Posted by biggbn

I had a 12v auto senny and it changed into top at 127mph on the dot in sport mode...ask me how I know..😈🤔

When I started driving, a Vauxhall senator was synonymous with one thing...

“Police”.

Usually unmarked, though often seen in full jam sandwich livery too, but always ready to tug a young tear-away and check his tyres for him... The police were it seems the only people buying senators in my neck of the woods. So, perhaps you were a member of Her Majesties finest?

I saw a Senator in Majorca last year, and even though it must be 2 decades (or more) since the police last used a Senator in the uk, I still instinctively checked my speed and tried to look innocent...

[tofufi]

Originally Posted by biggbn

With regards above two posts, I think the beetle engineering was wonderful. It was a car of the thirties and forties remember. Spacious cabin, low power, decent torque almost maintenance free engine, fitted it's design brief perfectly

This

Don't forget, it's got a magnesium crankcase, independent rear suspension and robust construction. Not to mention having better build quality than any equivalent British offering even as late as the 60s and 70s. It was engineered to be simple and effective, which it is. Only ruined by too many being serially neglected and bodged time and time again due to their ability to withstand punishment.

I might be biased as I've owned mine for 14 years now... but I also own a Morris Minor and know which is the better engineered car.

Others:

Rover P6. Funky suspension gives great ride and handling. Quiet, quick and capable.

Original Mini. I'd love to drive one, never have.

W126 Mercedes. I love every mile driving a decent V8 one. Even tired ones have real presence and feel special.

Struggling to come up with a 5th at the moment...