T4 Block from SW Autos

[bobcat]

Hi Ashok,

Thankyou for ringing up stuart yesterday, I knew he had been wanting to talk to you for a while. I cant help but feel it would have been a better to have phoned him in the first place, rather than getting others to. Then when the "bits" had been found and made ready for collection you could have posted up that you needed someone to collect them. Rather than just asking people to pop done to swautos and wait while they try and fine the parts (like what happened last weekend). As stuart told you yesterday, Hi paying customers will come first and when he has time he will find the parts for no charge. To me, having people ringing him up, and visiting is not letting them find the parts in their own time and is actually costing his business time and money and thus unfair on them considering that they are allready going to incur expenses to find the parts.

My comments about costs were to illustrate how extremely reasonable they are being by not charging you for storing\finding\packing etc the parts ready for collection. So considering the above you should have im my view as mentioned above waited untill the parts were ready (in their own time frame, not yours) before starting this thread and allowing others to cast negative assumptions on a "friend" of yours which you have allowed to go unchallenged.

Again sw's were extremely fair and reasonable, by finding your pistons and sending them to andy for a nominal fee (agreed by both parties) only to help cover the associated costs and not for profit of any party. My comments do not imply that you profited from this, however you appear to assume they do.

So as stuart has said and what has been the case all along, they will find the parts in their own time when they are not busy, and will get them ready for collection for no charge what so ever which you cant get fairer than.

So based on that i would say its rude to ask people to phone and visit sw's when the parts are not ready and unecessarily waste their time.

p.s if i remeber correctly your car was running way before the avon park meet and actually running at one of the first sw\volvo-tech meets.

regarding the turbos you mentioned, i think most them were returned to ATP due to "certain issues" that im sure your aware off, and were subsequently replaced with different turbos from another supplier.

Originally Posted by pyaap

Hi Matt,

I hope you would get the facts straight before posting as your comments are very misleading, certainly don’t represent the truth on many counts, and probably inadvertently reflects very poorly on SW Autos.



Can you please clarify whom you got this information from, or is it purely your speculation? Firstly, it actually was a complete bottom end, which I believe amounts to a tad bit more than "just a block and crank web". Please correct me if I am wrong, but I understand a complete bottom end is comprised of a block, crankshaft, crank-web, sump, pistons, rods and other associated ancillaries. Secondly the engine was built and mapped just before the Avon Park meet in March 2006, so hardly “over 2 ½ years ago”. Thirdly, the bottom end was found to be pristine and the joint decision with Stuart was to possibly gradually build it up as a spare when time / materials permitted, so I very much doubt you could classify it as “scrap” as you’ve insinuated.




Again, whom / where did you get this information from? When left with Stuart, the bottom end was intact, as it probably was up till May of this year when it was stripped for the pistons to be sent to Andy P; if it was taken to pieces in the meanwhile, that was certainly done without my knowledge. So, when and how was the crank given / sent to me? I would appreciate it if you could clarify that, exact dates are unnecessary, just an approximate time will do.

Next, as Andy has already clarified, he only needed, and was sent, the pistons and not rods as you've alleged. Any charges which Stuart levied are between him and Andy as they have obviously agreed on it; its nothing to do with you or me or anyone else for that matter. I have made no profit from “selling” the pistons to Andy. Far from it actually, as Andy will I’m sure confirm, he was desperate for a set of T4 pistons and as it is my nature to try and do my best to help fellow X40 owners who are enthusiastic about their cars, I agreed he could have mine; I NEVER ONCE mentioned any costs or charges to Andy. So once again, please don’t try and implicate me in your theoretical version of events purely to justify your motives, and take my goodness for weakness.




I myself love how some people can make a mountain out of a mole-hill, when it suits their own ends. Were you there when Stuart and I discussed the plans for the bottom end? If not, how did you reach the conclusion that I merely wanted to leave my engine there for him to just “store”? Again, I’ve been away for some time in the summer and Tim first contacted Stuart in July / August to get the block I believe so I think any sensible person will agree that he has been patient as understandably Stuart may have been busy – 3 to 4 months down the road, you can hardly say that neither Tim nor I have expected anyone to “drop everything”; on the contrary I certainly have done everything I can to accommodate the requests made to Tim. Thankfully, my earlier conversation with Stuart confirmed this; he has agreed that payment for his time was / is not the issue.



Next, why have you brought the issue of “storage costs” into it? Are you insinuating that I am liable for "storage costs" because Stuart has / had never once mentioned that to me and if space was getting that tight, I’d imagine he would have brought it to my attention. Furthermore, you have deliberately chosen to ignore the fact that I have been a staunch supporter of Stuart's company from day one. You may be unaware of the fact that Stuart has sold a number of items, including a complete forged engine, to friends / contacts of mine in the Far East. So far from expecting anything “for free”, I established those contacts in the hope that he can further his business; something which I did “for free”. Stuart certainly seemed pleased to do some business with people / companies overseas and consequently, some of the same people helped Stuart source items at a substantial discount (e.g. the GT30 turbos in Alastair's car, Joe's car and even the GT35/40R for Stuart's 850R - I have invoices to prove this). On a matter of principle, its not in my nature to expect a reward for helping a friend.

Finally, just for your information, I’ve spoken to Stuart earlier this afternoon and thankfully, it would appear that none of what you’ve said in your post represents his thoughts on the matter; hence I think you have, unfortunately, done him a great disservice in the eyes of many. I can understand why you would feel the way you do, but at the very least, in future, please try to be factual, and think before you post; that way your comments may have some credibility. What you’ve said isn’t fair by any means and definitely needed to be set straight, which I hope I have. All being well, Stuart will hopefully locate the items in the next few days (he asked for the engine number to cross reference with, and I have obtained that from my dealer and emailed it across) and Tim will be back on the road enjoying his car, which is all that matters.

[pigapumbu]

Originally Posted by Andy P

What Ashok has stated is true. Ashok contacted me after hearing that I had bent a rod (or 3) to see if he could help in any way. After much discussion, it was decided that I would replace my 2.0T pistons for phase 2 T4 pistons to lower CR. Ashok explained to me that he had the correct ones but they were still sat inside his spare engine at SW autos, and that I would have to contact Stuart to discuss any labour charges to have them removed. Having rung Stuart (who was very helpful) I was quoted £50+vat - I also bought many other parts from Stuart at the same time; turbo, clutch, bottom end bearings, main bearings etc.

I would have been very happy to pay Ashok for his pistons but he refused. He was genuinely more concerned at getting my car back on the road as soon as possible and if he could help in any way, he would.

I'd like to thank Ashok once again for the pistons, and more importantly, for his knowledge and taking the time to explain everything to me. The most generous person I know. Thanks.

Andy P

I second that. Thats the same I know of this guy. He is never one to back down from helping others.

cheers

[spangoolies]

i find this sickening that someone as descent and truly helpfull as ashok is being told off for bending over backwards to help another. congratulations bobcat, you have put me (and possibly a fair few others) off swautos just by your un-proffesional bickering. pity really as stuart seems like a nice guy. all that had to be said is 'please be patient'. maybe get up off your arse and do some work instead of complaining. 4 months is a very long time. all the time you spent posting what appears to be ill-supported arguements, the engine could have been found. you say your busy, im a builder and i work long hard hours outside in all weathers through-out the year, 6 (sometimes 7) days a week for not enough money. until now i havnt complained, but the difference between me and you is i dont take it out on the wrong people. remember, people use word-of-mouth a lot when it comes to mechanics, your not doing yourself any favours

[Ross9]

So, in short, the engine was left there after SW did an engine build for Pyaaps car, not as scrap, but with a view to it being used as a spare at somepoint down the line, and thus, still Pyaaps property.

Bit's were removed from it and sent to Andy to help him out, at a price SW were happy with as they named the price.

Now the rest of it is needed to help another member out, with the first request for the property made 3-4 months ago, AND the member wishing to gain the aid of these parts asked for a price for any labour/packaging costs that would be incurred in arranging this.

In other words, Pyaap has requested his own property be given to this member, payment for any costs incurred have been offered but with no response from SW.

3-4 months in ANYONES timescale is quite ridiculous IMO to look for an engine block.

Certainly those seem to be the main points from sifting through the responses, quite how SW autos hourly rate or the fact they are working on RB's which are no different from any other engine, they still go together the same way, have anything to do with it I'm not sure as Tim has said he requested a price to have the stuff made available. ( I have assumed you mean Nissan engines with the RB prefix Bobcat, apologies if that is an incorrect assumption and ignore the part about that)

So all else aside, this is pretty much correct yes? I don't see how any of the people involved can be accused of anything other than very restrained patience with SWA tbh, based on the above "facts" I've picked out of the posts.

Ross

[JD.7]

bobcat is the spokesperson for SW Autos ,so they have replied on here.

it could have been war if it was a 5 cylinder block lol

[pyaap]

Originally Posted by bobcat

Thankyou for ringing up stuart yesterday, I knew he had been wanting to talk to you for a while. I cant help but feel it would have been a better to have phoned him in the first place, rather than getting others to. Then when the "bits" had been found and made ready for collection you could have posted up that you needed someone to collect them. Rather than just asking people to pop done to swautos and wait while they try and fine the parts (like what happened last weekend). As stuart told you yesterday, Hi paying customers will come first and when he has time he will find the parts for no charge. To me, having people ringing him up, and visiting is not letting them find the parts in their own time and is actually costing his business time and money and thus unfair on them considering that they are allready going to incur expenses to find the parts.

Hi Matt,

A few more things to clear up as yet again, you’re not equipped with the full facts! When Tim first contacted me to ask if he could use my block, I was in Singapore, and by saying that, I was not sitting on a beach somewhere, enjoying a beer. Contrary to popular belief, Stuart is not the only person who is busy; we all are, as I particularly was, at the time. Being a “paying customer” myself and staunch supporter of SW Autos (unless you’re implying I’ve not paid for work done by SW Autos) I felt it reasonable and practical for Tim to contact Stuart and make the necessary arrangements, in my absence, to have the block delivered; afterall, why have a third party getting involved and unnecessarily complicating matters!! I guess I was terribly wrong to make that assumption. Now as for the reason behind my original post, my understanding was that Stuart had told Tim that he did not have any pallets to put the items on, and preferred them to be collected. To that end, I don’t think it unreasonable to post and ask if anyone could help, afterall I was merely doing my level best to accommodate what I understood to be Stuart’s requests.

Originally Posted by bobcat

My comments about costs were to illustrate how extremely reasonable they are being by not charging you for storing\finding\packing etc the parts ready for collection. So considering the above you should have im my view as mentioned above waited untill the parts were ready (in their own time frame, not yours) before starting this thread and allowing others to cast negative assumptions on a "friend" of yours which you have allowed to go unchallenged.

For the second time, your comments about “storage costs” are irrelevant! The engine was left there because it was in excellent condition and the joint decision between Stuart and myself was for it to be gradually built up as a spare; and Stuart even suggested building it as a complete forged engine anyway, so that he could offer both 4-pot and 5-pot Volvo engines for sale to any interested parties. There was NO mention of possible storage costs or issues at the time or subsequently, so again, I cannot understand why you would want to use that as an example of "them being reasonable”. As for some of the comments which were posted up, why don’t you prove them all wrong? Furthermore, you've still not confirmed when and how the crankshaft was sent to me, as you so confidently stated; since you're reluctant, I'll make it simple for you, it never was.

Originally Posted by bobcat

Again sw's were extremely fair and reasonable, by finding your pistons and sending them to andy for a nominal fee (agreed by both parties) only to help cover the associated costs and not for profit of any party. My comments do not imply that you profited from this, however you appear to assume they do.

Once again, the matter between Stuart and Andy P is nothing to do with any of us!! Stuart was kind enough to do the work for Andy at cost, and I am sure Andy is grateful, but why did you have to bring the £50 charge and “loss” into the equation at all? No doubt because you wanted to make a point and similarly, I wanted to make the point that I did not profit from it; isn’t that fair or do I have to operate via a different set of rules?

Originally Posted by bobcat

So as stuart has said and what has been the case all along, they will find the parts in their own time when they are not busy, and will get them ready for collection for no charge what so ever which you cant get fairer than.

Please Matt, don’t be condescending and treat me like a fool; I may be relatively quiet by nature but I, like anyone else, would not respond to being treated in a patronizing way, with glee. It has been nearly 4 months and the parts have still not been found. Fair enough, but how much longer do you expect Tim to be without a car for? And you’re trying to say that I’m being unreasonable???? Put yourself in his position and just think whether you would consider 4 months to be a reasonable time-frame? Shall we have a poll to see how many people think it reasonable to take 3-4 months to "find" an engine which is on your own premises? And just so there is no confusion, the block serial number is 2188467 so that can be used to help identify it, given Stuart has said there are circa eight T4 engines there.

Originally Posted by bobcat

So based on that i would say its rude to ask people to phone and visit sw's when the parts are not ready and unecessarily waste their time.

I haven’t deliberately set out to be rude, I’ve just been asking for help and making decisions based on the information I’ve had at hand, some of it which I understood to be Stuart's requests! There is A LOT I can talk about if you wish to go into situations where my time has been wasted but have you seen me make any bones about it? NO, because it serves no purpose other than to purely be an avenue to "vent" one's frustrations.

Originally Posted by bobcat

p.s if i remeber correctly your car was running way before the avon park meet and actually running at one of the first sw\volvo-tech meets.

Nope, the engine was a late winter 05 / early spring 06 project, there is no way the block has been sitting there for over 2 ½ years, and again TBH, does it really matter??? I really can’t believe that by itself has become such a big issue; it really does smack of "clutching at straws"!!! If you can prove me wrong on this matter, I will gladly admit that I am.

Originally Posted by bobcat

regarding the turbos you mentioned, i think most them were returned to ATP due to "certain issues" that im sure your aware off, and were subsequently replaced with different turbos from another supplier.

As for the turbos from ATP, I was aware of 2 issues; firstly Stuart mistakenly fitted an inline oil restrictor in the turbo oil feed, which caused one or two turbos to fail on account of oil starvation. Next, Alastair’s turbo had one of the wheels touching the housing; I believe ATP sorted that for him but it was, nevertheless, unecessary hassle. Again, if I wish to be pedantic, I was only helping him source, at his and Stuart's request, the turbo significantly cheaper than he was able to at the time, so is it my fault that there unfortunately was a manufacturing issue with one turbo?

My biggest disappointment is, at every given opportunity, I’ve done my best to help Stuart, as I have other businesses which I felt are honest, and I continue in that spirit right till today. Likewise he has himself been very helpful on numerous occasions. However, from your posts, it seems that to justify your stance, a lot of what I have done has been conveniently forgotten, ignored and hence not appreciated (not that I ask for it to, mind you; its just within the remit of the current situation), which is fair enough I guess; I guess I have only myself to blame if my goodness is taken for weakness and my trust was misplaced, so thank you for helping me learn from that mistake.

[Nuisance]

Matt you are really doing a lot of damage to SW here.

You have REALLY picked the wrong person to try and discredit.

In all honesty I've thought for a long time that your attitude to unhappy customers quite frankly stinks. We all know that your replies are "Stuart-by-proxy"

Reading between the lines here...

The remains of the engine have been Sold, Used, or Scrapped.

Prove me wrong!

[s60ben]

Originally Posted by Bobcat

I love how people seem to think that swautos is a charity and that they can all get something for free, ie alot of the posters seem to think it acceptable to ask swautos to store parts for free for years, and then as soon as someone wants them back sw's should drop everything, spend their time looking for them and them package them ready for collection - and all this for free.

Well well...

A charity indeed eh?

You should be careful about who you sling that accusation at Matt it could be a boomerang and hit you on the a$$

I for one travelled on a number of occasions to use stuart, the ONLY time he's ever done anything "for free" for me, was to examine a part that failed, which he was very happy to do. Now I noted that the part was still laying about down there, as far as I'd recalled I'd told him I didn't want it back and I don't, if you are saying that the time it was left there was chargeable then please let me know and get him to invoice me for it, In return I'm sure we can chat about commission from the recommendation I threw towards him, I really don't care about such things and like to help people who've helped me, but if we are starting to talk quid pro quo, then I suppose I'll have to ratchet my game up a level too .

Now, I've used him on a number of occasions for work, and spent a fair bit of money, which bearing in mind he's a 265 mile, 4 hour trip (530mile return) away said a lot of my opinion of the man. I've also recommended him to a number of people, and he knows it for sure, after all he'd managed to "open a door" to a potential new market with my recommendation, whether he acted on it any further than the initial sales I've no idea, but that's his choice.

So I for one think your accusation stinks, nobody has asked him to do something for "free"... and certainly not me. However, in my opinion, I do think 4 months is a long time to wait to "find" this item, and I'm entitled to an opinion on the matter too

<Bitchy mode on>
Now if we are talking charity work and being bitchy as in my opinion you are.... how much I wonder, do you and Al pay him for his services and time? I mean taking a ramp up for months and months must be real pricey, I know Al was "working off" his engine build by being the receptionist/admin whilst I was there, but I mean,.... Your own bill for "talking" and taking the lads time must be horrendous, that's all I've ever seen you doing when I've been there.
<Bitchy mode off>

I'm personally happy with the work Stu's done for me, I like the bloke, I know he's very busy, maybe too busy. However, with accusations of "free work" when work was paid for, I for one was present when Joules had his exhaust repaired AND when he paid for it, no mention ever was made on the day of a "patch up" or a "free bodge", infact we were talking about how they'd made/make and fit the collar while we were at lunch...... Then you could have knocked me over with a feather when Mark said it was £25 quid.... That hasn't stopped Al calling Joules a liar (on vpcuk) and saying he'd had it done for free... I'll admit it was cheaper than I thought it might have been but I've no idea on cost for that sort of thing, but I know Joules was expecting a £100 plus bill..... Now for Al to say that Stu said he didn't pay for it smells funny... either someones been pocketing cash without telling the boss (Stu)... or they've been misleading the boss (Stu) about whats gone on....

I'm quite surprised Stu hasn't stepped up and sorted this out myself, fine throw an hours labour or so around,it surely wouldn't take any longer than that! I'm sure Tim would just be ecstatic to get an engine in his car.

So Matt, are you or are you not the official spokesperson for Stuart? It sure sounds like it... in which case I'd watch out when you get down there......I'd be sorely disappointed if I were Stuart, you've done him a great disservice here with your posts in my opinion.

[pyaap]

I think its becoming pretty clear where opinions lie on this matter. However, lets also be aware that the only person to potentially lose the most, if the door was now shut, would be Tim. So lets give the block and associated parts a chance to be delivered to him, and hopefully put this matter to rest once and for all.

[pigapumbu]

Used to hold SW Auto in high regard if ever I needed any internal engine work done based on Pyaap's recommendation.

However now after reading Bobcat's posts here, I personally rather stay clear. I would not want to part cash and time with any organisation that turns out to be rather petty.

Granted no business runs or freebies but if one is being professional then there can be no assumptions as to storage charge or charity. Everything will be clear beforehand.

cheers