240 General: New (to me) 1980 Volvo 244

[Laird Scooby]

Originally Posted by Othen

Good point Dave - plus one might factor in saving another £25/month road tax from next April. The RB might make quite a good commuter if the distance wasn't too much :-)

Forget Webasco - that was just a mental block on my part (Webasco were the folding sunroofs popular back in the day I think) - I meant a black vinyl roof, that is all.

I didn't mention the VED Alan because a lot of enw Euroblobs either have zero VED for the first year or very low and often it's incorporated into the PCP payments for the simple reason that you never own a PCP car, the finance company does. As such if they come to repossess it because of missed payments, they can't repo it if the driver/customer has let the VED slide - you see where that is going!

As for Webasto roofs, they were indeed the sliding/folding sunroofs popular in the 70s and early 80s, essentially a vinyl panel let into the roof metalwork :



I know they were very popular on the P6 Rover and because the entire roof panel could be unbolted, the sunroofs were often swapped between cars. It seems they are still popular :

https://www.webasto-comfort.com/en-u...arketsunroofs/

The vinyl roof covering still sounds like a very nice idea, when i eventually get round to sorting the cosmetics on my Rover, i'm planning on adding a vinyl roof. As my car is gold with Stone Beige leather upholstery, i'm planning something like this :



The paintwork on the roof has blistered and peeling lacquer (a few other panels are similar) but as roof panels are difficult to paint on the car and it's not possible to remove it, the plan is smooth the roof and fit a vinyl covering. Similar reasons to why you're thinking of a vinyl roof.

[Othen]

Originally Posted by Laird Scooby

I didn't mention the VED Alan because a lot of enw Euroblobs either have zero VED for the first year or very low and often it's incorporated into the PCP payments for the simple reason that you never own a PCP car, the finance company does. As such if they come to repossess it because of missed payments, they can't repo it if the driver/customer has let the VED slide - you see where that is going!

As for Webasto roofs, they were indeed the sliding/folding sunroofs popular in the 70s and early 80s, essentially a vinyl panel let into the roof metalwork :



I know they were very popular on the P6 Rover and because the entire roof panel could be unbolted, the sunroofs were often swapped between cars. It seems they are still popular :

https://www.webasto-comfort.com/en-u...arketsunroofs/

The vinyl roof covering still sounds like a very nice idea, when i eventually get round to sorting the cosmetics on my Rover, i'm planning on adding a vinyl roof. As my car is gold with Stone Beige leather upholstery, i'm planning something like this :



The paintwork on the roof has blistered and peeling lacquer (a few other panels are similar) but as roof panels are difficult to paint on the car and it's not possible to remove it, the plan is smooth the roof and fit a vinyl covering. Similar reasons to why you're thinking of a vinyl roof.

Dave, if you get your Rover looking as good as that Roller I'll certainly buy you a pint!

I remembered about Webasco roofs as soon as you reminded me. I meant an ordinary vinyl roof; I think the RB would really suit it in black and I'm thinking I'll get it done to celebrate the Royal Barge achieving historic car status next spring.

Interesting discussion about PCP, I have not come across it myself, buut I read (I think in the Honest John column of the Telegraph) that PCP accounts for 75% of new registrations. I can't help thinking there is a time bomb ticking when a few hundred thousand folk lose their jobs after the furlough ends (I do so hope I'm wrong about that one).

Alan

PS. By chance I got the tax reminder for my Skoda Superb euroblob the other day: £30 for the year, it is almost a pleasure to pay it at that rate (which I did this morn).

[Laird Scooby]

Catch it in the right light and miss the peeled lacquer and other minor blemishes from 26 years on the planet and it does Alan! Don't forget that Roller is brand new so isn't a fair comparison, i was just showing my inspiration. Also as the colours are pretty close to mine, it is "proof of concept" for the vinyl roof for mine.

The other thing to consider is that when new, the Rover was £30k, the Roller was £250k base price plus "mandatory" extras.

I think April next year when the RB comes of age would be a great time to have the black vinyl roof fitted, a very "fitting" time in more ways than one!

I seem to recall John cautioning about the many people who have PCP cars losing their income due to furlough ending and/or their jobs, there will be a lot of cheap, ex-PCP cars available for sale! I remember hearing about Hertz in the USA having to sell hundreds of thousands of cars just after the Kung Flu started as nobody was hiring them.

[Othen]

Originally Posted by Laird Scooby

Catch it in the right light and miss the peeled lacquer and other minor blemishes from 26 years on the planet and it does Alan! Don't forget that Roller is brand new so isn't a fair comparison, i was just showing my inspiration. Also as the colours are pretty close to mine, it is "proof of concept" for the vinyl roof for mine.

The other thing to consider is that when new, the Rover was £30k, the Roller was £250k base price plus "mandatory" extras.

I think April next year when the RB comes of age would be a great time to have the black vinyl roof fitted, a very "fitting" time in more ways than one!

I seem to recall John cautioning about the many people who have PCP cars losing their income due to furlough ending and/or their jobs, there will be a lot of cheap, ex-PCP cars available for sale! I remember hearing about Hertz in the USA having to sell hundreds of thousands of cars just after the Kung Flu started as nobody was hiring them.

No offence meant about your Rover Dave, I was only joking and the comparison with a new Roller could never be a fair one.

I'm pleased you like the idea of having a nice vinyl roof fitted to mark the RB's 'coming of age', I can't think of a better way to celebrate it, and the RB will look even more the timeless classic with a tasteful roof that could have been fitted 40 years ago, but is brand new.

Re: the PCP issue, I do remember John talking about that, and I agreed strongly at the time. We all, including (relatively) poor people live very comfortable lives when compared with my childhood memories (from the 60s and 70s). We live in a world where almost everything is cheap: food costs almost nothing, clothing is inexpensive, manufactured goods are almost free, wages (even low ones) are very high, everyone has a cell phone/computer, most people have car and go on holiday thousands of miles away (which is an absurd waste of fuel).

The only thing that is expensive is housing, and that is because the population of our little group of islands goes up by 300,000 every year (the reasons why don't matter, only the outcome is important). It still concerns me that ordinary people are taking on absurd levels of debt (in my humble, and probably irrelevant opinion) in order to finance unsustainably lavish lifestyles.

Sorry Dave, that became a bit of a sermon. I'm sure many would see me as a dinosaur that just doesn't understand.

Ho hum.

[john.wigley]

I always thought 'L.S.'s vinyl roof suggestion was a good one, Alan. Given that you intend it to mark the R.B.'s 40th anniversary, maybe you might consider picking out the seams with a 'ruby' pinstripe, as a tasteful reminder of the event?

Speaking as a self-confessed, unapologetic dinosaur, Alan, hindsight trumps 20-20 every time! Age has to have some privileges.

Regards, John.

[Othen]

Originally Posted by john.wigley

I always thought 'L.S.'s vinyl roof suggestion was a good one, Alan. Given that you intend it to mark the R.B.'s 40th anniversary, maybe you might consider picking out the seams with a 'ruby' pinstripe, as a tasteful reminder of the event?

Speaking as a self-confessed, unapologetic dinosaur, Alan, hindsight trumps 20-20 every time! Age has to have some privileges.

Regards, John.

Thank you for that vote of confidence John, I think the RB will look fabulous with a nice vinyl roof next year, maybe with a pinstripe.

I do so hope I’m wrong about the personal debt piece. In my humble (and unimportant opinion) the state is subsiding far too much of society at the moment. But there again: what do I know?

Alan

[Laird Scooby]

Originally Posted by Othen

No offence meant about your Rover Dave, I was only joking and the comparison with a new Roller could never be a fair one.

I'm pleased you like the idea of having a nice vinyl roof fitted to mark the RB's 'coming of age', I can't think of a better way to celebrate it, and the RB will look even more the timeless classic with a tasteful roof that could have been fitted 40 years ago, but is brand new.


Sorry Dave, that became a bit of a sermon. I'm sure many would see me as a dinosaur that just doesn't understand.

Ho hum.

Funny you should say that Alan but before the 827 Coupe was launched (based on the model i have although that is a saloon) it was given to several people to test drive for the weekend.
One of the comments that came back was along the lines of "Excellent car, would be great for the weekend". Another part of the questionnaire that had to be filled in was their present car - in this case a Bentley Continental or in more basic terms, a 2 door Rolls-Royce Coupe with a different badge. That was a pre-production car and some of those still had a few problems to be fixed but that was part of giving them to the general public in limited numbers, to assess what needed sorting.

As for the sermon, for the most part i agree and we have an unsustainable ingress of migrants. That is causing a demand on the housing market that is pushing the cost up beyond most peoples means. Hence them taking on debts they can't support.

Go back to the 70s/80s, a video recorder was a few hundred quid at a time when most people were lucky to earn £1-200 a week before the taxman got his greedy paws on it. Video recorders are more or less obsolete new now but last one i looked at in the Argos catalogue was £19.99 at a time when my earnings were averaging £500/wk after Dick Turpin aka HMRC had their bite of it.

In short, we've become a consumer driven society and goods are now disposable. Once upon a time we would have a tv, video, computer or whatever repaired because it was cheaper to fix than bin it and buy a new one. It would be easy to cite Bill Gates, Steve Jobs et al as the main culprits but they, among others have simply responded to the general greed/lust for a new, better, more up to date, upgraded item than before on a regular basis.
Being fed what they want, the customers have simply demanded more and more so now tere is no engineering integrity in the items we buy and a new one will be out next week so if it breaks, aren't you lucky? You get to upgrade it sooner than expected!

[Othen]

Originally Posted by Laird Scooby

As for the sermon, for the most part i agree and we have an unsustainable ingress of migrants. That is causing a demand on the housing market that is pushing the cost up beyond most peoples means. Hence them taking on debts they can't support.

Go back to the 70s/80s, a video recorder was a few hundred quid at a time when most people were lucky to earn £1-200 a week before the taxman got his greedy paws on it. Video recorders are more or less obsolete new now but last one i looked at in the Argos catalogue was £19.99 at a time when my earnings were averaging £500/wk after Dick Turpin aka HMRC had their bite of it.

In short, we've become a consumer driven society and goods are now disposable. Once upon a time we would have a tv, video, computer or whatever repaired because it was cheaper to fix than bin it and buy a new one. It would be easy to cite Bill Gates, Steve Jobs et al as the main culprits but they, among others have simply responded to the general greed/lust for a new, better, more up to date, upgraded item than before on a regular basis.
Being fed what they want, the customers have simply demanded more and more so now tere is no engineering integrity in the items we buy and a new one will be out next week so if it breaks, aren't you lucky? You get to upgrade it sooner than expected!

I always avoid talking about immigration being the issue - it is an emotive subject. The reason why the population of this already very densely populated group of islands keeps increasing by 300,000/year does not matter, the problem remains it keeps increasing. Maybe it is because we are all living much longer, perhaps more babies are being born or it could be immigration - I don't know, but I do know that it keeps increasing demand for housing in an unsustainable way if we all want to enjoy a good quality of life.

I agree with the consumerism piece, but we are all guilty. I have spent the past few days replacing the carpet in our study with an engineered wood oak floor (and it looks fantastic, even if I say so myself). Dan and I had acquired a huge amount of stuff in the study - so I took the opportunity to reconcile what we have put back in. There are things that I don't even remember buying and we have probably never used that we must have got because they looked good on some web catalogue and everything is so cheap. I've put a load of ads on Freecycle to see if they are of any use to others before they go in the grey bin on Friday (which would be a pity). That was a rambling way of saying we all have too much (I don't think Dan and I are unusual).

No one is poor through necessity here in the UK, we all live well, only those who wish to purchase housing have to struggle to do so because demand exceeds supply by so much (... and I do not believe the answer is to increase supply by paving over the country, that just delays the problem a bit).

Anyway, enough of my ramblings. I think I'll take the RB (third car) or CCM (third bike) out for a run today - see, I'm just as guilty of consumerism as most folk... it is an easy thing to get into but I never borrow any money to do so, perhaps there lies an important difference?

Time for Bob's first walk... good fortune.

Alan

[Laird Scooby]

Originally Posted by Othen

Anyway, enough of my ramblings. I think I'll take the RB (third car) or CCM (third bike) out for a run today - see, I'm just as guilty of consumerism as most folk... it is an easy thing to get into but I never borrow any money to do so, perhaps there lies an important difference?

Time for Bob's first walk... good fortune.

Alan

From one rambling to another - that with Bob!

As for consumerism, i have a mobile phone that i've had for 2-3 years, very happy with it and wouldn't change despite the fact i'm being offered a new phone as my contrick is up for renewal soon.

However, for no apparent reason, the screen cracked one morning. Thought it was an eyelash on the screen at first but it quickly grew to a size reminiscent of Sasha-fur and a few minutes later, went straight across which would make her fur something approaching Old English Sheepdog (Dulux dog) length.

Being a touchscreen jobby, it's now causing problems with typos and sometimes with things i haven't even been near to typing! Investigating the cost of a replacement screen, i can buy one from fleabay for £20 and fit it myself. Alternatively i can drive for an hour, park somewhere near a shop in Norwich and pay them £80 to supply and fit a screen.

I still have ~3 months to go on my contract so to end it early and get a free new phone, it would currently cost me ~£80, reducing at the rate of £0.73/day.

A new phone is guaranteed so if the same thing happens in the first year, it gets repaired FOC but the bigger benefit is from changing the contract to the newer version of what i currently have - that will save me £9 a month as well!

Surely that's proactively encouraging consumerism?

[john.wigley]

Talking about mobiles, 'L.S.' and Alan's point about cheap, 'disposable' products caused me to reflect on just how far we have advanced (?) in 30 years.

I bought my first mobile when I went self-employed in 1991, justifying it as giving me an 'edge' when looking for work. The phone (and it was only a phone) was one of the first Motorola flip-phones which cost me £400 and came with two batteries, since one could not make it through the day. A fitted car-phone in my 244 would have cost c£2k.

There were just two networks; the airtime contract on both was the same - £25 per month - and calls cost 25p per minute (charged in half-minute increments after the first minute).

In contrast, my current Motorola smart phone, which I'm sure has features that I don't even know about, cost me just over £100. Today, my contract costs me under £9 per month and includes 500 minutes, 500 texts and 500 Meg of data, of which I normally use less than 10% of each. I've just bought a new battery for it off ebay for £8 as the original, now 3 years old, was starting to get a little tired.

Progress? You be the judge!

Regards, John.