Catalyst value

[TheLeeds]

Cats only remove all the bad pollutants once they're properly warmed up, so if you're walking along a road next to a queue of slow moving traffic of which most of the vehicles have only travelled a matter of yards not miles, then chances are you're breathing in benzine and all manner of other unpleasantness.
A few times when I've taken customers cars to MOTs, they've failed the cat test the first time, and needed to be given a decent thrash down a dual carraiageway to get them up to a nice hot temprerature so they actually work properly and pass.

[Laird Scooby]

Originally Posted by TheLeeds

Cats only remove all the bad pollutants once they're properly warmed up, so if you're walking along a road next to a queue of slow moving traffic of which most of the vehicles have only travelled a matter of yards not miles, then chances are you're breathing in benzine and all manner of other unpleasantness.
A few times when I've taken customers cars to MOTs, they've failed the cat test the first time, and needed to be given a decent thrash down a dual carraiageway to get them up to a nice hot temprerature so they actually work properly and pass.

You're not wrong there!

The other thing is that until cats are hot enough to work, they just collect contaminants and unburnt fuel. Most people don't give their cars a decent enough thrashing (aka Italian Decoke) every once in a while to get rid of the contaminants, burn off the unburnt fuel and "revive" the actual cat part.

Once they do get hot, one of the things they produce as i mentioned above is Hydrogen Sulphide (H2S) which in itself is highly toxic. It also stinks like rotten eggs, drive round the M25 at 3am and you'll know where the traffic jams were - or at least that was the case before all the diseasels came into fashion because of the governments misguided belief they were more environmentally friendly.
That said, i've been round the M25 during the day a few times in recent years and could still smell patches of rotten eggs so i know those areas still exist where traffic builds up and the cats make the place stink.

Perhapsnow we're out of the EU we'll revert to the lean-burn policy they had in place before paralytic perverters!

[tofufi]

I've got a 940 cat (removed from my brother's '95 940 with 282k miles on - and looks knackered enough (and repaired several times) that it *could* be original). Would be interested to know how you get on and recommendations as to who to sell it to...

[tofufi]

Originally Posted by Laird Scooby

Perhapsnow we're out of the EU we'll revert to the lean-burn policy they had in place before paralytic perverters!

Not a chance that Brexit will influence that, lean-burn will never achieve the NOx emissions requirements of the relevant UN legislation...

[nutco]

Originally Posted by tofufi

Not a chance that Brexit will influence that, lean-burn will never achieve the NOx emissions requirements of the relevant UN legislation...

Totally agree with that

[TonyS9]

There is also the effect of the cold gearbox and diff. After my engine is warm, it usually takes another 10mins or so of driving to get sensible mpg figures, so 20mins total in winter.

Difference is about 10mpg.

The UK needs to reduce NOx and particles, desparately. Medical evidence is compelling, the gov't is not arguing. Electric / high efficiency hybrid is the answer, the latter doesn't seem to exist yet.

H2S is fairly common in nature, usually a sign of rot but not inherantly as dangerous as Nox, UBHC or particulates (and yet open fires were never good for us).

[Dastardly Diesel]

Electric cars aren't the answer. If every car (a d that's just the cars) in the UK were replaced with an electric one, that would use up over half of the worlds known lithium reserves. And clearly we aren't the only country in the world wanting cars, so that dog isn't ever going to bark.

The answer is the for driving public to stop being lazy and using cars for single digit journeys, particularly in urban areas. 40% of car journeys in greater Manchester are less than 1 kilometer, which is an easy 15 minute stroll. That's a potential 40% improvement by not changing a single thing other than peoples attitudes.

[360beast]

Originally Posted by Dastardly Diesel

Electric cars aren't the answer. If every car (a d that's just the cars) in the UK were replaced with an electric one, that would use up over half of the worlds known lithium reserves. And clearly we aren't the only country in the world wanting cars, so that dog isn't ever going to bark.

The answer is the for driving public to stop being lazy and using cars for single digit journeys, particularly in urban areas. 40% of car journeys in greater Manchester are less than 1 kilometer, which is an easy 15 minute stroll. That's a potential 40% improvement by not changing a single thing other than peoples attitudes.

Nail on the head!

[TonyS9]

Originally Posted by Dastardly Diesel

Electric cars aren't the answer. If every car (a d that's just the cars) in the UK were replaced with an electric one, that would use up over half of the worlds known lithium reserves. And clearly we aren't the only country in the world wanting cars, so that dog isn't ever going to bark.

The answer is the for driving public to stop being lazy and using cars for single digit journeys, particularly in urban areas. 40% of car journeys in greater Manchester are less than 1 kilometer, which is an easy 15 minute stroll. That's a potential 40% improvement by not changing a single thing other than peoples attitudes.

Half the "reserves".. at the current price. If it becomes short the price goes up and more reserves will be found. Lithium is fairly common, not as common as Iron and Aluminium. Anyway Lithium supplies are unlikely to be a problem. Stop reading propoganda produced by oil companies.

Assuming electric cars will use Lithium is narrow minded, there is a UK guy proposing a Aluminium battery thats not rechargable that will last several months for 8p/mile selling cost. Maybe it won't work but there will be other alternatives to Lithium in the near futures.

What do you think is going to happen to oil? What alternative are you thinking? Hydrogen.. not very efficient as you have use alot of energy to compress and cool it, also it just leaks out through expansion (unless you have a cryo plant in your car) and the fact that its a small molecule, there isn't anything that can contain it effectively. Also the catylists used for fuel cells are even rarer.

40% less short journeys is not going to help anyone, except in ICE cars which produce a disproportionate pollution when cold. You need to lower car ownership/sales if you think resources are going to be an issue.

I'd like to see a decent hybrid running on petrol, doing 100mpg on fuel alone, and capable of doing 50miles on electric alone. Do away with these 'equivalent mpg' figures they are meaningless. You need about 3kw to cruise in an electric car, I'm sure a small efficient generator could be made for that.

[Laird Scooby]

Originally Posted by TonyS9

Stop reading propoganda produced by oil companies.
.

https://www.nhm.ac.uk/discover/news/...use-goals.html

That is from the Natural Histroty Museum - nothing to do with oil companies! Have a read, you'll be shocked!