Volvo 850 starting problems-follow-up

[Adam850]

1996 Volvo 850 GLT wagon (non turbo).
This is my follow-up to previous post. Now I think its my starter motor, solenoid or the circuit, because the car is not turning when attempting to start. After few attempts it finally turns and starts. This only happens when the car is warm. However I am puzzled, because it starts fine on first attempt when cold. How can I check this. Could it be the ignition switch? The check engine light is off and the car runs beautifully when started. Would connecting the code reader give me any clues? Please help.

Adam

[warthog]

Adam,

it's very unlikely that any fault codes would be registered, unless there was another problem in addition to the starter that affected the ECU.

From past experience (although not with the 850 and this fault) I would look at a sticking starter solenoid, although it could equally be a worn/dirty brushes in the starter. Before going to the trouble to remove the starter, it may be worth double checking all the connections from the battery to the starter and the wires on the solenoid itself.

There is a possibility that its a failing ignition switch, but to check this will need 2 people When the fault happens, if you hold the switch to the start position and tap the starter solenoid. If it's the solenoid sticking, this may encourage it to engage. If it's the ignition switch at fault then tapping the solenoid will have no effect (although this doesn't rule out the solenoid being at fault)

Hope this gives some ideas.

[Chris_Rogers]

Reading codes:

You should not need to buy a code reader for your car but just make up a simple circuit:

see here: http://www.volvoclub.org.uk/dc/dcboa...ng_type=search

Is this car an auto?

If so does it make any difference if you try and start it in neutral rather than park?

[deanrosc]

Hi Adam,

I had this problem with my car and was at the point it would not start when warm.And as some of the gents on this forum can tell you, i was really losing my rag with it. Test suggested starter motor as a feed was going into it but not turning, so i changed it, problem did not go away. It turned out that the ignition switch had got hot and malfunctioned causing it to get really hot, and as a result the wiring from my ignition switch to ignition system had all but burnt away. My car is now fine and starts first time everytime. One thing i strongly suggest though is to get it sorted asap. if you leave it,like i did, the problem will get worse and it will not start when at running temp, and you'll have to wait til the engine is stone cold before it will re start again, a real pain in the arse i can assure you. If your anywhere near the North West i can strongly recommend north west trading in wigan, their number is usually in driver. They sorted me an ignition switch, and a starter for less than £30 (with voc discount).Good luck.
PS. the live feed to my starter was only about 3 volts,it may appear to be your starter at first til you check the voltage.

[cootuk]

My led code reader must have saved me about £100 in reading fees now.
Ive just had a new radiator fitted and the muppets managed to get two fault codes logged (MAP sensor and intake air temp).
I even found someone who had an OBD-II male socket so got a proper socket rather than just using flyleads.

[Adam850]

Thank you Dean. Ignition switch might be the culprit. It would make sense. When it all started the engine would not turn only occasionally when hot, but on the second attempt it would always start. Now it takes five or more attempts to make it turn. It always starts fine when cold. But why bad ignition switch would not trigger any codes? Short of replacing is there any way to test the switch?

Ignition switch and a starter for less than £30! I am moving to UK. Her in Canada I called the dealer today about possible starter change. Remanufactured Bosch = $400CDN plus $100 for installation plus VAT. Online auto parts stores in the states sell the Bosch starter for $180US (around$225CDN).

Adam

[Adam850]

Chris, the car is automatic. In neutral it is still no go.

Adam

[Chris_Rogers]

I would try the ignition switch first.

This link shows how.

http://www.volvospeed.com/Repair/ignit_switch.htm

To test the switch, wiring diagrams here:

http://www.a-b.com.pl/VOLVO/850/

See, starter circuits.

On some models there is a service starter wire in the engine compartment which bypasses the ign switch, you could try +12V on that to prove the ign switch (or get you home).

[Adam850]

Today I have changed ignition switch, but unfortunately this was not the solution. I also checked all visible ground wires. One of them was nearly broken. I fixed it and all the contacts, but still no go. I played with the shifter and this seems to help a bit, but it is not permanent solution. Maybe it is a gear positioning sensor that needs to be replaced. I think of it more, because I can not start the car in neutral, not even a sound when I turn the key. But once started from parked the car runs fine and there is no problems with transmission shifting or lights on the dash. Today I was trying to show the starting problem to automobile electrical system garage and I was unable. The car started fine every time, but I was playing with the shifter shortly before that. This guy is a starter specialist and looked puzzled when I told him that the car starts fine when cold and does not want to turn over when hot. Any further suggestions would be appreciated.

Adam

[warthog]

Adam,

if playing with the gear selector seems to have an effect on the problem then I think you've probably nailed the source. If the selector cables are out of adjustment then this can stop the car starting in neutral (mine does this and I just haven't got round to readjusting the cable). Dirty or worn contacts in the PNP switch are a known problem, but the switches aren't cheap so I'd investigate further before parting with cash.