Volvo Community Forum. The Forums of the Volvo Owners Club

Forum Rules Volvo Owners Club About VOC Volvo Gallery Links Volvo History Volvo Press
Go Back   Volvo Owners Club Forum > "Technical Topics" > LPG, CNG & LNG - General Info and Issues
Register Members CarsBlogs Help Calendar Mark Forums Read

Notices

LPG, CNG & LNG - General Info and Issues Share experiences and problems

Information
  • VOC Members: There is no login facility using your VOC membership number or the details from page 3 of the club magazine. You need to register in the normal way
  • AOL Customers: Make sure you check the 'Remember me' check box otherwise the AOL system may log you out during the session. This is a known issue with AOL.
  • AOL, Yahoo and Plus.net users. Forum owners such as us are finding that AOL, Yahoo and Plus.net are blocking a lot of email generated from forums. This may mean your registration activation and other emails will not get to you, or they may appear in your spam mailbox

Thread Informations

LPG: When will people learn! (???)

Views : 5316

Replies : 76

Users Viewing This Thread :  

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old Jan 7th, 2019, 11:48   #31
XC90Mk1
Master Member
 

Last Online: Yesterday 10:48
Join Date: May 2018
Location: Southampton
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by mentepazza View Post
Because you dont know how it works. It S safer than running petrol.
Except...

You still have petrol (I would image less than 5% if installs remove the tank and have a split lpg/petrol tank) so your point makes no sense what so ever in those situations.

For the 95% covered the lpg tank goes in the spare whee well (crumple zone), boot (crumple zone) or under the side of the car (maybe not crumple zone but 4 inches from edge).

So no, clearly its not safer is it?

:-)
__________________
2012 XC90 SE Lux 90,000 miles
XC90Mk1 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old Jan 7th, 2019, 20:44   #32
mentepazza
Member
 

Last Online: Yesterday 16:48
Join Date: Feb 2016
Location: Glasgow
Default

In a car accident it has been proved (Holland independent test TNO) lpg car are safer than petrol cars.
The tank makes the structure more resistant not the other way round.
Also the tank has at least 3 safety valves.
There is nothing to discuss about safety.
mentepazza is offline   Reply With Quote
Old Jan 7th, 2019, 20:56   #33
XC90Mk1
Master Member
 

Last Online: Yesterday 10:48
Join Date: May 2018
Location: Southampton
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by mentepazza View Post
In a car accident it has been proved (Holland independent test TNO) lpg car are safer than petrol cars.
The tank makes the structure more resistant not the other way round.
Also the tank has at least 3 safety valves.
There is nothing to discuss about safety.
Right,

So my petrol car for example with 60l of petrol remains equipped with 60l of petrol AND 40l of lpg.

Somehow taking the same vehicle with the same amount of petrol its safer when you add lpg?


I am sure you can understand my confusion.
__________________
2012 XC90 SE Lux 90,000 miles
XC90Mk1 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old Jan 10th, 2019, 13:27   #34
Tannaton
Premier Member
 
Tannaton's Avatar
 

Last Online: Today 00:02
Join Date: Aug 2014
Location: Beverley, East Yorks
Default

I'm just going to join the safety debate as it's a popular "discussion" with my dad....

The LPG tanks are very strong pressure vessels so are significantly less likely to rupture in a crash than a plastic petrol tank.

However if there was to be a major leak, LPG will immediately vaporise and disperse, unlike petrol which will spill and linger. But you do not want to be within a hundred yards of it if it does burst or snap a connector off.... however unlikely that might be.

So whilst logic says a car in a crash carrying 60L of petrol and 30L of LPG is going to be less safe than just 60L of petrol, but I think the probability of there being an issue like that is very low.

Interesting watch :

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AG4JwbK3-q0
__________________
2012 V40 D3 SE, 2003 XC90 D5 SE, 2009 Ford Ranger SC, 1977 Triumph Spitfire 1500
Tannaton is offline   Reply With Quote
The Following User Says Thank You to Tannaton For This Useful Post:
Old Jan 13th, 2019, 23:18   #35
XC90Mk1
Master Member
 

Last Online: Yesterday 10:48
Join Date: May 2018
Location: Southampton
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tannaton View Post
I'm just going to join the safety debate as it's a popular "discussion" with my dad....

The LPG tanks are very strong pressure vessels so are significantly less likely to rupture in a crash than a plastic petrol tank.

However if there was to be a major leak, LPG will immediately vaporise and disperse, unlike petrol which will spill and linger. But you do not want to be within a hundred yards of it if it does burst or snap a connector off.... however unlikely that might be.

So whilst logic says a car in a crash carrying 60L of petrol and 30L of LPG is going to be less safe than just 60L of petrol, but I think the probability of there being an issue like that is very low.

Interesting watch :

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AG4JwbK3-q0
Or buy a diesel which will not readily combust in an accident, offers similar mpg, is available at all service stations and works.
__________________
2012 XC90 SE Lux 90,000 miles
XC90Mk1 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old Jan 14th, 2019, 20:58   #36
classicswede
Trader Volvo in my veins
 
classicswede's Avatar
 

Last Online: Yesterday 18:54
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Anglesey
Default

And makes lots of noise, clogs a DPF if used on short runs, pumps out black soot and has a lot of harmful small particles coming out of the exhaust.

Thats a real I'm fine thanks and two fingers up to the next generation attitude

Back to the fire aspect a VW I converted many years ago. A year or so I had a phone call from the owner saying the camper had caught fire. A petrol hose had started leaking causing it to catch on fire while parked. The LPG tank survived intact and the fire brigade who attended were impressed at how safely the LPG side burned. The LPG tank was still intact while the rest of the van had disapeared. The reason for the call is they had now purchased a replacement and wanted that converting. Also while we were there adding a fire exitnguisher system aimed mainly at all the petrol components just in case the same kind of thing should ever happen again. The safest thing would be to remove all the petrol system and run LPG only but regulary checked and any suspect items replaced at the first sign of problems petrol can be a fairly safe fuel. Whatever fuel you use there is always a risk
__________________
www.classicswede.co.uk
classicswede is offline   Reply With Quote
Old Jan 21st, 2019, 23:42   #37
volvo_pete
New Member
 

Last Online: Yesterday 22:00
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: Manchester
Default

Thought I would chime in and have a few questions too.
For past 14 years all of my cars have been LPG converted (volvo v40 2002reg, smart forfour 55reg, BMW 328 convertible Nreg and now BMW 330 convertible 02reg).
LPG has been great (the v40 was used all over Europe, where LPG could be had for 29cents).
Reliability has not been an issue, when I had the conversion done and has only been a problem when I bought the car already converted (poor conversions). The current BMW I had converted at 118k 5 years ago and about to hit 200k. There have been no issues with the car at all.
However, as much as I love the savings (220 miles for 25) I am getting very annoyed at the profiteering by big fuel companies. Non supermarket LPG is now 65-73 a litre but a big supermarket or gas suppliers sell it at 52-55p a.litre, so why am I being ripped off by at least 4 every fillup?
Secondly, all my cars have been "normal injection" so perfectly convertable to LPG. However, as I understand new cars are now all direct injection and the conversion is not easy nor is it cheap - am I right in this respect?
Finally, I found it rather difficult to find an LPG installer who knew what they are doing. I know that there are lots listed on the LPGA site, but in my experience this stands for nothing. I found that there are only about 10 companies/individuals in the UK that I would trust to fit a system.

All in all, LPG can work great, but you.do need to have a good system fitted by a trustworthy person/company.
volvo_pete is offline   Reply With Quote
Old Jan 22nd, 2019, 19:05   #38
classicswede
Trader Volvo in my veins
 
classicswede's Avatar
 

Last Online: Yesterday 18:54
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Anglesey
Default

The rip off prices is typical of shell and BP some have been so bad you are better off using a bit of petrol to get to the next LPG filling station. I have seen 10p variation from 2 filling stations opposite each other! One flowgas and the other BP.

A lot of petrol cars now are going direct injection. The injectors need to be cooled or will melt when running LPG. For these engines there are two ways to convert them. 1) still run some petrol through the petrol injector at the same time as the LPG. The downside of this is you are using about 20% petrol so conversion repay is longer.
2) run the LPG through the petrol injector. This means running liquid LPG and modification to the petrol system.

The big downside in both cases is they need manufacturers time and development to make the system work reliably. That means the kits are car/engine specific and cost more, install cost is also then higher.

There are still normal engines out there but the choice of simple to convert cars gets more limited the newer you go.
__________________
www.classicswede.co.uk
classicswede is offline   Reply With Quote
The Following User Says Thank You to classicswede For This Useful Post:
Old Jan 28th, 2019, 22:04   #39
yoda960
Volvo 960
 

Last Online: May 26th, 2019 08:15
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Huddersfield
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by XC90Mk1 View Post
OK, I will admit to being the poster of that comment....

Unfortunatly I can only say it as I find it and I maintain that close friends and others vehicles that I have been in have been very unreliable and that based on this I would not buy or consider a conversion.

Due to the nature of my work I purchase my vehicle privately and then charge 45P for the first 10,000 miles and 20P there after (I do 15-25K a year).

If I thought I could buy an LPG equipped car and run it whilst claiming 45P a mile I would do so this afternoon.

Based on experience however I don't feel I can.

To me LPG is a somewhat niche offering which is really applicable to those with the knowledge and ability to run them, a personal interest and ability to work from home or get paid if they break down.

For the average person who runs a 2012 model car onwards (as I do) and who is not interested in tinkering they are not really a reliable product based on what I have seen.

The EML on is now an MOT failure despite assurances from an LPG owner on here that its not.

My post above was regarding someone looking into converting a 2018 model T6 and I voiced my opinion that this is likely more complex and involved than they may think.

Its not for me, if you have been successful and have not had EML on etc then that's great, I am happy for you.
If I were in your position getting paid 45p and 20p a mile, i'd be running a gassed 940. It doesn't have a load of complex rubbish to go wrong. Super reliable and cheap to run!
yoda960 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old Jan 29th, 2019, 01:05   #40
barrybritcher
Master Member
 

Last Online: Jul 19th, 2019 22:46
Join Date: Nov 2016
Location: Norwich
Default

from what I gather you still have to run / start the car on petrol until it's warmed up or has these changed now?

So thoroughly pointless for short journeys + the cost of conversion makes it not worth it for me.
__________________
2007 Volvo S60 T5 2.4 Geartronic
barrybritcher is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply


Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT +1. The time now is 07:29.


Powered by vBulletin
Copyright ©2000 - 2019, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.