LED H4 lights only work on full beam

[ANDTWENTY]

Ive been out and got some pictures of what is what. Ive never noticed the dim-dip before but I see what this is now.

here are a couple of pictures of the bulb, I hope this is what you're after -



This is my original light, only the offside bulb is in. the images are sidelights and dim-dip, dipped beam and then full beam with driving lights in -




This is with just the offside side LED bulb in and the same 3 light modes. the bulb in this is upside down though so the light bleeds up a bit but you can see just about that the bulb also has the dim-dip, dip and full beam but without the driving light bulbs in-




This is with just the offside bulb in but put the right way to give a better beam pattern, this is dip beam and full beam without the driving light bulbs -



This is with both bulbs in, the correct way and with the 3 light modes, dim-dip, dip and then full beam with no driving light bulbs-

[Laird Scooby]

In short, those LED bulbs aren't fit for purpose - even on a wall/door you can see the pattern is very "blobby" so will fail the MoT on beam pattern alone.

https://www.classiccarleds.co.uk/pro...333e3660&_ss=r

Have a look at those and you'll see the difference! These are a bit cheaper but i'd go for the first ones - err, i did in fact!

https://www.classiccarleds.co.uk/pro...=8299353243743

Granted dearer than fleabay but at least the beam pattern is known before you try them!

[ANDTWENTY]

Originally Posted by Laird Scooby

In short, those LED bulbs aren't fit for purpose - even on a wall/door you can see the pattern is very "blobby" so will fail the MoT on beam pattern alone.

https://www.classiccarleds.co.uk/pro...333e3660&_ss=r

Have a look at those and you'll see the difference! These are a bit cheaper but i'd go for the first ones - err, i did in fact!

https://www.classiccarleds.co.uk/pro...=8299353243743

Granted dearer than fleabay but at least the beam pattern is known before you try them!

I was on the phone chatting to this guy this morning as it happens. Although the beam pattern is all over the place it doesn't sit too high so would it be acceptable? if not I might go for the ones he sells as most of my driving is when its pitch black so id like some nice lights.

[ANDTWENTY]

My other question is I wanted to upgrade my driving lights which are H3 I think to LED's, am I right in thinking these don't have a beam pattern so any bulbs will do?

[Laird Scooby]

Originally Posted by ANDTWENTY

I was on the phone chatting to this guy this morning as it happens. Although the beam pattern is all over the place it doesn't sit too high so would it be acceptable? if not I might go for the ones he sells as most of my driving is when its pitch black so id like some nice lights.

No, it isn't acceptable as anything over the blue line in the image i put up earlier is called the "anti-glare zone" and shouldn't have any light at all - even on your door you can see it's blobby above that line but the halogen bulb gives a crisp line.

The LED bulbs i've linked to do give that crisp line so will pass the MoT, notwithstanding the post above about the possibility o the regs changing yet again.

As my MoT tester has said to me recently on two occasions "I can't fail them as the beam pattern is perfect".

I take it you mean you were talking to Duncan at Classic Car LEDs? Very helpful and knowledgeable bloke!

[Laird Scooby]

Originally Posted by ANDTWENTY

My other question is I wanted to upgrade my driving lights which are H3 I think to LED's, am I right in thinking these don't have a beam pattern so any bulbs will do?

Errr................ yeah, but no................. but yeah but!

They do have a beam pattern, it's an ellipsoid like a squashed circle, not just a blob! The outer edges of the circle should line up with the lines in a Beamsetter or similar piece of optical test equipment but the main beam pattern isn't tested for the MoT, the onus is on you to ensure you don't dazzle oncoming traffic.

Also if the LEDs don't produce the right pattern you will get serious glare back from all kinds of strange things, not just road signs. I have a pair in my Rover that are very bright with no real beam pattern (not dissimilar to your H4 bulbs with the LEDs that are used) and although they light up the road like daylight, they also light up the trees, fields, parallel roads half a mile away - that's a slight exaggeration on the last bit but you get the idea?

I will be changing them for something a bit more focused (literally) but can't for the time being.

[ANDTWENTY]

Originally Posted by Laird Scooby

No, it isn't acceptable as anything over the blue line in the image i put up earlier is called the "anti-glare zone" and shouldn't have any light at all - even on your door you can see it's blobby above that line but the halogen bulb gives a crisp line.

The LED bulbs i've linked to do give that crisp line so will pass the MoT, notwithstanding the post above about the possibility o the regs changing yet again.

As my MoT tester has said to me recently on two occasions "I can't fail them as the beam pattern is perfect".

I take it you mean you were talking to Duncan at Classic Car LEDs? Very helpful and knowledgeable bloke!

yea I see what you're saying then, thats the issue then its just dazzling everyone!! ill get in contact with the seller of my bulbs and see what I can do, he's already offered a partial refund cus they weren't working properly I said. Yea I guess its him, I'll give him a call and see what he says about the other ones you sent.

Originally Posted by Laird Scooby

Errr................ yeah, but no................. but yeah but!

They do have a beam pattern, it's an ellipsoid like a squashed circle, not just a blob! The outer edges of the circle should line up with the lines in a Beamsetter or similar piece of optical test equipment but the main beam pattern isn't tested for the MoT, the onus is on you to ensure you don't dazzle oncoming traffic.

Also if the LEDs don't produce the right pattern you will get serious glare back from all kinds of strange things, not just road signs. I have a pair in my Rover that are very bright with no real beam pattern (not dissimilar to your H4 bulbs with the LEDs that are used) and although they light up the road like daylight, they also light up the trees, fields, parallel roads half a mile away - that's a slight exaggeration on the last bit but you get the idea?

I will be changing them for something a bit more focused (literally) but can't for the time being.

Ah okay, maybe Duncan has some good H3's too, I don't like hoe I have the white led but then the yellow H3 so will look into it.

[Laird Scooby]

Originally Posted by ANDTWENTY

yea I see what you're saying then, thats the issue then its just dazzling everyone!! ill get in contact with the seller of my bulbs and see what I can do, he's already offered a partial refund cus they weren't working properly I said. Yea I guess its him, I'll give him a call and see what he says about the other ones you sent.



Ah okay, maybe Duncan has some good H3's too, I don't like hoe I have the white led but then the yellow H3 so will look into it.

The only LED bulbs that will give a good beam pattern are those that have LEDs that mimic the filament pattern of a filament bulb. Those you've bought clearly don't.

Not sure i understand the bit about the white LED and the yellow, those are sleeves you can fit to the bulb to alter the colour if you want. I'd prefer the standard white, it's closest to daylight in frequency so makes driving more relaxing on your eyes at night. I suspect the blue and yellow filters would take the edge off their effectiveness.

Fairly sure Duncan will have some H3 LEDs, have a quick search on the site.

[ANDTWENTY]

Originally Posted by dingov70

Just been reading this posting and I have some bad news for you . Your car was designed to use halogen bulbs , new MOT regulations entering service shortly will prohibit the fitting of HID or LED light sources into such headlights


https://www.gov.uk/guidance/mot-insp...ical-equipment

4.1.4. Compliance with requirements

Existing halogen headlamp units should not be converted to be used with high intensity discharge (HID) or light emitting diode (LED) bulbs. If such a conversion has been done, you must fail the headlamp.
And that is direct from our test manual .

The only " legal " method of using HID or LED in an old vehicle is to retro fit projector units , having removed the reflectors or find projector headlights for your car

On a side note from my lights I also bought a set of these for my Dad's Freelander 2, he has projector lenses in his headlights which seem to work with the LED bulbs although I haven't tried his yet. It seems though that from the gov site they are also not allowed because he had halogen bulbs before but you're saying it's okay if LEDs are fitted to projector lenses?

[dingov70]

I've heard rumours of "approved" LED bulbs being allowed to be retrofitted becoming law soon as well so i'm going to sit it out.[/QUOTE]


Laird , to be honest if DVSA have gone to the trouble of updating our test manual & specifically mentioned HID /LED light sources , you can be pretty sure no " approved " LED light sources are hiding over the horizon .

Andtwenty , I saw the bulbs you have , the only LED I have seen that truly replicate the light output of filament bulbs have very thin LED such as these in the link to Amazon https://www.amazon.co.uk/NOVSIGHT-He...2s9dHJ1ZQ&th=1