Volvo Community Forum. The Forums of the Volvo Owners Club

Forum Rules Volvo Owners Club About VOC Volvo Gallery Links Volvo History Volvo Press
Go Back   Volvo Owners Club Forum > "Technical Topics" > C30 / S40 & V50 '04-'12 / C70 '06-'13 General

Notices

C30 / S40 & V50 '04-'12 / C70 '06-'13 General Forum for the P1-platform C30 / S40 / V50 / C70 models

Information
  • VOC Members: There is no login facility using your VOC membership number or the details from page 3 of the club magazine. You need to register in the normal way
  • AOL Customers: Make sure you check the 'Remember me' check box otherwise the AOL system may log you out during the session. This is a known issue with AOL.
  • AOL, Yahoo and Plus.net users. Forum owners such as us are finding that AOL, Yahoo and Plus.net are blocking a lot of email generated from forums. This may mean your registration activation and other emails will not get to you, or they may appear in your spam mailbox

Thread Informations

Deadlocked car with no working key - observations

Views : 1689

Replies : 24

Users Viewing This Thread :  

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old Mar 1st, 2019, 16:02   #1
LizardOfBodom
WowIcanwriteAnythingHere!
 
LizardOfBodom's Avatar
 

Last Online: Mar 26th, 2024 17:05
Join Date: May 2016
Location: Dublin/Meath
Default Deadlocked car with no working key - observations

Just thought I will share it here for future readers, as some info may come handy in similar situation.
Work colleague locked key inside his S40 2006 yesterday. As you know, its fairly easy to do it as all you need is to press the fob to lock the car with one door open, then leave key on the seat/floor/whatnot and close the door shut. Car does a nice "indicator flash" showing it is fully armed and will deadlock itself in 10 seconds.

Now, the plot thickens as replacement key he brought did not work - the fob was unresponsive even after changing battery, and also there was no physical blade on it (thats how it was bought) so we couldnt open the car with it either. The only option was to call in a mobile locksmith that opened the car in exactly 5m30s from approaching the car. No idea how (trades secret blah blah) but there is no signs of forced entry and drivers door are open. IMHO he musty have picked the lock as its the same as opening it with blade. The lock on drivers door is now opened, while all other doors remain locked and not possible to open from inside (deadlock still activated).

Now the twist: there was NO key inside the car. Whatever happened, its still unclear but the main key was not inside.... With alarm blaring I tried that second key but exactly as I suspected - didnt work. Car didnt even do "bzzt" of accepting the key and unlocking the lock, clearly showing car is not paired to it.
Now, I did a test on my own car to replicate the issue and I was able to disable blaring alarm by putting key into ignition evben when car was in deadlock mode, so it only proven that his car was not paired to that key.
Its a 1.6D by the way so as you all know its really easy to loose pairing with them....

Summary: its a bit unclear what to do now, the original key evaporated (literally), second one doesnt work. Even if towed to dealership, they will probably need to order brand new one as I am not sure the key can be programmed back in OR it its a key from this car at all (it was never tested before). Also car is blaring the alarm every time I open the bonnet or enter the key in ignition, Im wondering if its not gonna loose all the power etc before its sorted. Currenty, its sitting on work's parking lot with drivers door unshut so its accessible, but thats all.

I doubt anyone will have any advices as I am pretty sure not much can be done in that point, car wont even connect to my Vida as key is not present in POS2. Bit of a weird situation, so i thought someone may find it interesting.

also a warning to mind your keys after you press "lock" button as it can end up badly....
__________________
2005 V50 T5AWD M66, Stage1 Hilton tune
E-focus torque mount, E46 bi-xenon retrofit v2 , (also available in PDF form), DTSC fully-off mod, Brembo discs+ATE ceramic pads
LizardOfBodom is offline   Reply With Quote
The Following User Says Thank You to LizardOfBodom For This Useful Post:
Old Mar 1st, 2019, 16:39   #2
Welton
Premier Member
 

Last Online: Sep 14th, 2021 18:03
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: Market Harborough
Default

Bizarre.

If I try to lock my car with a door open it goes nuts and won't allow it, never tried just shutting it though and walking away.

I think your mate's only option is new keys/coding at the dealer, good luck with that £££££££
__________________
2005 S40 T5 SE - Manual. Bilstein B4's. (For Sale)
2010 Citroen C4 1.6 HDi (bizarre Gearbox model).
2010 Renault Twingo (refreshingly simple)
2018 Infiniti Q30 1.6T Business Executive (what's this button do?)
Welton is offline   Reply With Quote
Old Mar 1st, 2019, 16:43   #3
LizardOfBodom
WowIcanwriteAnythingHere!
 
LizardOfBodom's Avatar
 

Last Online: Mar 26th, 2024 17:05
Join Date: May 2016
Location: Dublin/Meath
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Welton View Post
Bizarre.

If I try to lock my car with a door open it goes nuts and won't allow it, never tried just shutting it though and walking away.
...
I suspect it may be different on FL model, its highly possible they change it just for that very reason. I was also very surprised that you can do that on my car. It wont allow to lock it with "lock" button on door, but WILL allow with a key fob.
__________________
2005 V50 T5AWD M66, Stage1 Hilton tune
E-focus torque mount, E46 bi-xenon retrofit v2 , (also available in PDF form), DTSC fully-off mod, Brembo discs+ATE ceramic pads
LizardOfBodom is offline   Reply With Quote
Old Mar 2nd, 2019, 09:58   #4
MDS40
Senior Member
 

Last Online: Mar 19th, 2024 11:45
Join Date: Sep 2017
Location: Berkshire
Default

Would removing fuse 56 for the siren control module shut up the alarm?
__________________
2006 S40 2.4 SE Auto. Ruby Red. 83K Miles

Some previous cars include: Jaguar x type: Mazda 6 : Mazda 626: Ford Sierra 2.0: Toyota Celica ST 1600 : Hillman Avenger: Triumph Spitfire:
Oh and a Volvo 340 GL 1984 company car from new.
MDS40 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old Mar 2nd, 2019, 18:54   #5
poiuytre111
Member
 

Last Online: Apr 15th, 2020 17:32
Join Date: Mar 2017
Location: Amersham
Default

Do you mean - after the alarm's internal battery eventually goes flat ?
poiuytre111 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old Mar 4th, 2019, 11:48   #6
LizardOfBodom
WowIcanwriteAnythingHere!
 
LizardOfBodom's Avatar
 

Last Online: Mar 26th, 2024 17:05
Join Date: May 2016
Location: Dublin/Meath
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by MDS40 View Post
Would removing fuse 56 for the siren control module shut up the alarm?
To answer, I havent tried, but after 30mins or something alarm actually gave up and doesnt react on current condition (physicaly opened door) anymore. It will hovewer trigger when I pop up the bonnet or put inactive key in ignition.
its like it disabled 1 sensor because its constantly "on" and only triggers events from other sensors.
__________________
2005 V50 T5AWD M66, Stage1 Hilton tune
E-focus torque mount, E46 bi-xenon retrofit v2 , (also available in PDF form), DTSC fully-off mod, Brembo discs+ATE ceramic pads
LizardOfBodom is offline   Reply With Quote
Old Mar 4th, 2019, 13:06   #7
SwissXC90
Premier Member
 

Last Online: Mar 20th, 2024 19:26
Join Date: Jan 2016
Location: Cross Country
Default

If you still have the doors locked and deadlock engaged, you can unlock all doors (and deadlocks) with VIDA.
But that requires the ignition to be ON, which might stump you.
You might be able to trick the car into coming alive by hotwiring the fusebox to provide power where power is needed to allow VIDA to talk to the car, and for the car to wake up sufficiently.

That will at least allow the doors to be opened, and thus allow a through search of the car for the key. If it is there.

Note that a virgin replacement key will not unlock the vehicle until it has been paired to the vehicle - which requires the ignition to be ON, which may also stump you.

If you cannot locate any of the original physical keys, then your next steps are:

1. Flatbed vehicle to dealer (cannot be towed unless all wheels off ground)
2. Dealer gets identical physical keys from Sweden. Hopefully possible, as this will save changing physical locks.
3. Dealer programs new keys to car (immobiliser and remote lock/unlock) This also disables all lost keys, ensuring the car cannot be stolen.

NOTE THAT if you do not change the physical locks, someone with the original key can still access the interior of the vehicle.

If you wish to have full security, then the dealer needs to replace physical locks and keys, which of course costs a lot more.

Not a cheap exercise whatever you do, be expected to pay easily >500 GBP.
__________________
XC90 R-Design MY2009, Black Sapphire Metallic. HP-Sound, RSE, Nav, Tel, ParkingCam, BLIS, ParkingHeater, RestHeat, Removable Towbar, Summer: CRATUS 20x8 on Pirelli Scorpion Zeros 255/45, Winter: NEPTUNE 17x7 on Continental WinterContact 4x4 235/65.
SwissXC90 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old Mar 4th, 2019, 13:58   #8
MDS40
Senior Member
 

Last Online: Mar 19th, 2024 11:45
Join Date: Sep 2017
Location: Berkshire
Default

Looking at my car settings in Vida i noticed one that says " auto locking on door open " mine is set to no.
Maybe your friends is enabled.
__________________
2006 S40 2.4 SE Auto. Ruby Red. 83K Miles

Some previous cars include: Jaguar x type: Mazda 6 : Mazda 626: Ford Sierra 2.0: Toyota Celica ST 1600 : Hillman Avenger: Triumph Spitfire:
Oh and a Volvo 340 GL 1984 company car from new.
MDS40 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old Mar 4th, 2019, 14:29   #9
LizardOfBodom
WowIcanwriteAnythingHere!
 
LizardOfBodom's Avatar
 

Last Online: Mar 26th, 2024 17:05
Join Date: May 2016
Location: Dublin/Meath
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by SwissXC90 View Post
....
You might be able to trick the car into coming alive by hotwiring the fusebox to provide power where power is needed to allow VIDA to talk to the car, and for the car to wake up sufficiently.
...
Uh, thats an interesting idea! Wonder if it could work, thanks for the thought.
Key is not in the car, we literally ripped interior apart and I dont think it can fit in sill-door space so opening doors probably wont change much. Oh, and this one can easily be towed - its 1.6D of my colleague, not mine. Regardless of anything, and even if succeding with hooking up Vida without a key (eager to try it now :P) car will end up at dealership as until now key is not found and looks like it vanished. Getting a replacement and programming it to car might be only solution for him (and no, he wont change locks as car is worth more stolen than lock replacement, heh).

I wonder - does second key (the one that is confirmed NOT working) can be programmed to the car if it once was working? (assuming it was for this car but just lost the code)?

MDS - that may be setting that is also available to change on waterfall console, so car locks itself when you start driving. Dont think it relates to deadlocking in this case, but thanks!
__________________
2005 V50 T5AWD M66, Stage1 Hilton tune
E-focus torque mount, E46 bi-xenon retrofit v2 , (also available in PDF form), DTSC fully-off mod, Brembo discs+ATE ceramic pads
LizardOfBodom is offline   Reply With Quote
Old Mar 4th, 2019, 16:35   #10
SwissXC90
Premier Member
 

Last Online: Mar 20th, 2024 19:26
Join Date: Jan 2016
Location: Cross Country
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by LizardOfBodom View Post
I wonder - does second key (the one that is confirmed NOT working) can be programmed to the car if it once was working? (assuming it was for this car but just lost the code)?
Yes.
The process of adding a key requires that ALL keys be present

The process will enable only those keys physically present, and also disable all keys not physically present.
Thus ensuring all lost / missing / stolen keys not present on the day cannot be used to start the engine.

Part of the robust security concept.

And remember the way the keys work:

A passive (non-powered) transponder with a unique serial number is fitted to each key-fob. The serial number of the transponder is entered into the vehicle's immobiliser system, thus only known transponders can mobilise the vehicle (permit engine start).

An active (powered by the little battery inside the key) rolling code transmitted is used for the lock/unlock functions. The rolling code needs to be synchronised with the car's UEM to permit that remote control to lock / unlock car (and whatever other functions exist as buttons on the key).

A physical key blade is mechanically paired to the physical key lock in the driver's door, ignition switch and sometimes glove-box. A replacement means cutting a new key. Key blades cannot be disabled electronically. Only physical replacement of the locks can stop a stolen key blade from physically opening the driver's door.
__________________
XC90 R-Design MY2009, Black Sapphire Metallic. HP-Sound, RSE, Nav, Tel, ParkingCam, BLIS, ParkingHeater, RestHeat, Removable Towbar, Summer: CRATUS 20x8 on Pirelli Scorpion Zeros 255/45, Winter: NEPTUNE 17x7 on Continental WinterContact 4x4 235/65.
SwissXC90 is offline   Reply With Quote
The Following User Says Thank You to SwissXC90 For This Useful Post:
Reply


Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT +1. The time now is 03:07.


Powered by vBulletin
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.