2 Problems, fuel leak? And dash lights...

yragyrag90 · Dec 2nd, 2009, 18:43

Hi, 2 problems with my 92 Tor'.

Problem 1. Dashboard lights...
Tonight when I started the car the warning light on the dash were on. (Handbrake, Battery and oil or brake sensor lights) They stayed on my whole journey, not fully lit but at about 80% illumination. They appeared to darken at higher rev's.
Recently the lights had started to come on when the car was travelling at speed and pushing the revs but this seems to have changed tonight.

Problem 2. Fuel leak...
Just noticed the other day. When refuelling I noticed a fair bit of fuel on the garage forecourt floor. On closer inspection dripps were coming from the front end of the fuel tank. I put a bit more in to check but couldn't locate the source.
It only seems to leak when being filled, and I don't seem to be losing fuel efficiancy by too much (although I think I'm getting a bit less petrol for my money - I had put this down to recent price rises).

Any help on either of these is much appreciated, and if at all possible could you explain any solutions/ideas as if you were talking to a 5 year old or someone who struggles to put together Ikea furniture. I'm not the greatest with, er... anything.

BrianH · Dec 2nd, 2009, 19:42

Alternator brushes. Two screws to replace.

wooble · Dec 2nd, 2009, 20:34

The tank leak will almost certaily be a smll rust hole in the tank, they usually form either at the top where condensation poolson the top of the tank, or at the seam around the middle of the tank. You have 2 options to fix it:

Option A, which involves dropping the fuel tank, draining it, and having the leak repaired or replacing the tank, is a permanent, long-lasting fix and will cause you no problems for the rest of the life of the car. It will also cost a few hundred quid to be done by a garage, or take you a weekend, lots of cursing, and the cost of a new tank or a repair.

Option B involves only filling the tank up halfway for the rest of the car's life so the petrol doesn't reach the level of the leak. It's free, but you'll still need a new tank in a few years. As long as you clean any traces of the leak off the outside of the tank, you'll have no problems with the MOT man.

chesters6 · Dec 3rd, 2009, 07:51

what about
http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/Granville-Petr...item19b7ba3e45

Clifford Pope · Dec 3rd, 2009, 08:26

The difficulty with a leak at the seam is that it isn't really an identifiable hole to patch, more a kind of seepage from possibly a length of rusty and opening seam.

I have successfully repaired such a leak, by removing the tank, cleaning the seam thoroughly with Jenolite, then soldering the leaking section with a heavy-duty electric iron.
Before that I staved off action for a few years by lowering the tank to its maximum extent - about an inch, cleaning out the seam, and pressing in JB Weld.

An alternative, once you have the tank out and the unit removed, is to pour in bodywork repair resin and tilt the tank so that it seals from the inside.

yragyrag90 · Dec 3rd, 2009, 18:18

Ok, a quick update....

Problem 1... Major problem! Caused me to break down this morning on the A1. Not very nice. The car slowly died travelling from 70mph, I pulled onto the hard shoulder and waited to be towed by a helpful friend.

Luckily I've got a donor car, same year same model, I took the alternator off today, and when comparing the two they seem to have some slight differences in wiring... What's with that?
Will I be able to put the donor one on and will it work? Or.... If indeed it is simply the bushes that have worn, can I switch the bushes from the donor onto the new one? Will there be differances in the bushes?

I managed to remove the alternator all on my own which made me feel slightly proud after my early morning problems (I've written a short story that's probably entertaining but more likely familiar, below)... I feel like I'm starting to learn, albeit the hard way.

Problem 2... Fuel tank, thanks so much for the help with both of these by the way. Again with the donor car... How hard would it be to switch the petrol tank from the donor to the daily? Will the corosion cause too many problems and is there a good chance that the old one will be too coroded to make the swap?

____Comedy follows (no more info, just my morning breakdown story)_____

Ok, so this morning going along the A1, the power goes, my CD player darkens then turns off and my windscreen wipers start slow mo'ing... I pull off onto the hard shoulder and call the AA then the RAc, I called both because I'm a member of niether but thought one would have the sympathy to come and give me a hand... No beans.
So called a friend of the family who owns a van, a sandwich shop and a strong rope. But he's a bit of a character... While waiting I noticed the morniong traffic starting to become busier and two police cars rushing down the other side of the motorway, (thinking to myself *they must be busy, at least someones worse off than me...) 2 minutes later the police cars are behind me...
I get out and the first one asks, "how did you crash then?" "How did you manage to end up half on the verge?"... I explain that I haven't crashed, only broke down. He calls off the ambulance..
One of the police officers notices the prancing moose badge on my grille, as they are both in motorway patrol Volvo V40's or whatever, I tell them where to get them. No doubt that they'll have them on by tomorrow morning.
We chat for a while (you don't see many of these anymore, kind of thing) and he suggests putting the whole car onto the verge for safety, I explain that the car weights two ton, he smirks and gets his pal over, they give a push with me stearing and pushing with one leg, until the smirker slips over...
So, I think to myself my friend with the van and rope will be here shortly, he's a dodgy charachter and I'm sure he'd benefit from the knowledge that the police are on the scene, so with gloved hands I pull out my phone (and keys) and call him, but it's too late he's here...
We hitch the car and I jusm in, I'm just about to take off the handbrake and the steering lock, when I notice I don't have my keys...
But it's too late for that also, he's already started towing me, with my steering lock on, wheels facing into the road, and now my car going sideways into the slip road... I try shouting but he can't hear me and doesn't notice until I'm in the middle of the lane....
So that was me, at 6 am this morning. In the middle of a major slip road, blocking the carriageway with three poilce cars behind me a queue of traffic 200 meters long and being towed by a guy who may be known to the police... If they could only stop themselves laughing long enough to check...
I don't know if you've heard of the website, but FML!!!!

Ben '71 1200 · Dec 3rd, 2009, 20:55

That made me chuckle greatly, thank you

Re alternator, what's the difference in wiring? Haynes manual lists 5 different alternators for the 240.. Is the main plug the same shape? Same amount of wires of the same colour? From the manual, it looks like some are internally, and some externally regulated.. If you can get those details, and preferably model numbers, then I'm sure we can figure out intercompatibility. The models listed are
SEV Marchal C14/55A
SEV Marchal D14/70A
Bosch N1 14V 70A
Bosch K1/35A
Bosch K1/55A

Cheers

Ben

EDIT: a model that late should have an integral voltage regulator, not a separate one.

yragyrag90 · Dec 4th, 2009, 18:26

Ok, daily update No3.

Thanks so much for all the help, I checked the alternator, my spare was a Bosch N1 14V 70A... But the one in place didn't have a number or any markings I could see. when I took out the bushes, one was stumped, the other had alright length. I made a swap for the bushes in my spare...
The car started and the battery warning/battery charge light went off... Good news I thought.
Took off... Got half a mile and it conked again.

I'm told, it may be, that the battery has suffered too much trauma and has just given up (I know how it feels) So, I've got a spare battery too :-D So I'm gonna charge that up for a good while and try that...

If anyone thinks I'm missing something, or suspects there may be something else to blame, please, any help is appreciated.

On a brighter note, I felt really good getting to grips with some mechanical work on the car, although I'd have appreciated less pressure and better weather. These things, I suppose, can't be helped. My dad helped and we felt pretty good after getting it "working" again.
When I broke down it was rush hour. How inconsiderate can some people be? I needed to pull across a slow moving lane to get off the road, but no one would let me out... We need more Volvo drivers.

yragyrag90 · Dec 6th, 2009, 21:49

Ok... This is getting stupid.

Switched the bushes from a good alternator to my dodgy one.
The battery appeared to be dead so we swapped that for a good one.
Now it's conked out again... What's going on?

If it's not the alternator or the battery what else could it be?

Steve and his 244 · Dec 6th, 2009, 22:59

bad earths?

Dec 2nd, 2009, 18:43	#1
yragyrag90 Senior Member Last Online: Jan 15th, 2019 20:45 Join Date: Jan 2009 Location: Newcastle	2 Problems, fuel leak? And dash lights... Hi, 2 problems with my 92 Tor'. Problem 1. Dashboard lights... Tonight when I started the car the warning light on the dash were on. (Handbrake, Battery and oil or brake sensor lights) They stayed on my whole journey, not fully lit but at about 80% illumination. They appeared to darken at higher rev's. Recently the lights had started to come on when the car was travelling at speed and pushing the revs but this seems to have changed tonight. Problem 2. Fuel leak... Just noticed the other day. When refuelling I noticed a fair bit of fuel on the garage forecourt floor. On closer inspection dripps were coming from the front end of the fuel tank. I put a bit more in to check but couldn't locate the source. It only seems to leak when being filled, and I don't seem to be losing fuel efficiancy by too much (although I think I'm getting a bit less petrol for my money - I had put this down to recent price rises). Any help on either of these is much appreciated, and if at all possible could you explain any solutions/ideas as if you were talking to a 5 year old or someone who struggles to put together Ikea furniture. I'm not the greatest with, er... anything.

Dec 3rd, 2009, 20:55	#7
Ben '71 1200 Member Last Online: Apr 14th, 2018 10:24 Join Date: Nov 2009 Location: Yeovil	That made me chuckle greatly, thank you Re alternator, what's the difference in wiring? Haynes manual lists 5 different alternators for the 240.. Is the main plug the same shape? Same amount of wires of the same colour? From the manual, it looks like some are internally, and some externally regulated.. If you can get those details, and preferably model numbers, then I'm sure we can figure out intercompatibility. The models listed are SEV Marchal C14/55A SEV Marchal D14/70A Bosch N1 14V 70A Bosch K1/35A Bosch K1/55A Cheers Ben EDIT: a model that late should have an integral voltage regulator, not a separate one. Last edited by Ben '71 1200; Dec 3rd, 2009 at 20:59.

Dec 2nd, 2009, 19:42	#2
BrianH VOC Member Last Online: Jan 16th, 2024 18:10 Join Date: Apr 2006 Location: Bournemouth	Alternator brushes. Two screws to replace.

Dec 2nd, 2009, 20:34	#3
wooble Stay gold baby! Last Online: Jul 24th, 2022 16:15 Join Date: May 2009 Location: Bristol	The tank leak will almost certaily be a smll rust hole in the tank, they usually form either at the top where condensation poolson the top of the tank, or at the seam around the middle of the tank. You have 2 options to fix it: Option A, which involves dropping the fuel tank, draining it, and having the leak repaired or replacing the tank, is a permanent, long-lasting fix and will cause you no problems for the rest of the life of the car. It will also cost a few hundred quid to be done by a garage, or take you a weekend, lots of cursing, and the cost of a new tank or a repair. Option B involves only filling the tank up halfway for the rest of the car's life so the petrol doesn't reach the level of the leak. It's free, but you'll still need a new tank in a few years. As long as you clean any traces of the leak off the outside of the tank, you'll have no problems with the MOT man.

Dec 3rd, 2009, 07:51	#4
chesters6 Master Member Last Online: Oct 17th, 2012 16:14 Join Date: May 2007 Location: Farnham View Photos By: chesters6	what about http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/Granville-Petr...item19b7ba3e45

Dec 3rd, 2009, 08:26	#5
Clifford Pope Not an expert but ... Last Online: Apr 26th, 2024 12:45 Join Date: Dec 2001 Location: Boncath	The difficulty with a leak at the seam is that it isn't really an identifiable hole to patch, more a kind of seepage from possibly a length of rusty and opening seam. I have successfully repaired such a leak, by removing the tank, cleaning the seam thoroughly with Jenolite, then soldering the leaking section with a heavy-duty electric iron. Before that I staved off action for a few years by lowering the tank to its maximum extent - about an inch, cleaning out the seam, and pressing in JB Weld. An alternative, once you have the tank out and the unit removed, is to pour in bodywork repair resin and tilt the tank so that it seals from the inside.

Dec 3rd, 2009, 18:18	#6
yragyrag90 Senior Member Last Online: Jan 15th, 2019 20:45 Join Date: Jan 2009 Location: Newcastle	Ok, a quick update.... Problem 1... Major problem! Caused me to break down this morning on the A1. Not very nice. The car slowly died travelling from 70mph, I pulled onto the hard shoulder and waited to be towed by a helpful friend. Luckily I've got a donor car, same year same model, I took the alternator off today, and when comparing the two they seem to have some slight differences in wiring... What's with that? Will I be able to put the donor one on and will it work? Or.... If indeed it is simply the bushes that have worn, can I switch the bushes from the donor onto the new one? Will there be differances in the bushes? I managed to remove the alternator all on my own which made me feel slightly proud after my early morning problems (I've written a short story that's probably entertaining but more likely familiar, below)... I feel like I'm starting to learn, albeit the hard way. Problem 2... Fuel tank, thanks so much for the help with both of these by the way. Again with the donor car... How hard would it be to switch the petrol tank from the donor to the daily? Will the corosion cause too many problems and is there a good chance that the old one will be too coroded to make the swap? ____Comedy follows (no more info, just my morning breakdown story)_____ Ok, so this morning going along the A1, the power goes, my CD player darkens then turns off and my windscreen wipers start slow mo'ing... I pull off onto the hard shoulder and call the AA then the RAc, I called both because I'm a member of niether but thought one would have the sympathy to come and give me a hand... No beans. So called a friend of the family who owns a van, a sandwich shop and a strong rope. But he's a bit of a character... While waiting I noticed the morniong traffic starting to become busier and two police cars rushing down the other side of the motorway, (thinking to myself *they must be busy, at least someones worse off than me...) 2 minutes later the police cars are behind me... I get out and the first one asks, "how did you crash then?" "How did you manage to end up half on the verge?"... I explain that I haven't crashed, only broke down. He calls off the ambulance.. One of the police officers notices the prancing moose badge on my grille, as they are both in motorway patrol Volvo V40's or whatever, I tell them where to get them. No doubt that they'll have them on by tomorrow morning. We chat for a while (you don't see many of these anymore, kind of thing) and he suggests putting the whole car onto the verge for safety, I explain that the car weights two ton, he smirks and gets his pal over, they give a push with me stearing and pushing with one leg, until the smirker slips over... So, I think to myself my friend with the van and rope will be here shortly, he's a dodgy charachter and I'm sure he'd benefit from the knowledge that the police are on the scene, so with gloved hands I pull out my phone (and keys) and call him, but it's too late he's here... We hitch the car and I jusm in, I'm just about to take off the handbrake and the steering lock, when I notice I don't have my keys... But it's too late for that also, he's already started towing me, with my steering lock on, wheels facing into the road, and now my car going sideways into the slip road... I try shouting but he can't hear me and doesn't notice until I'm in the middle of the lane.... So that was me, at 6 am this morning. In the middle of a major slip road, blocking the carriageway with three poilce cars behind me a queue of traffic 200 meters long and being towed by a guy who may be known to the police... If they could only stop themselves laughing long enough to check... I don't know if you've heard of the website, but FML!!!!

Dec 4th, 2009, 18:26	#8
yragyrag90 Senior Member Last Online: Jan 15th, 2019 20:45 Join Date: Jan 2009 Location: Newcastle	Ok, daily update No3. Thanks so much for all the help, I checked the alternator, my spare was a Bosch N1 14V 70A... But the one in place didn't have a number or any markings I could see. when I took out the bushes, one was stumped, the other had alright length. I made a swap for the bushes in my spare... The car started and the battery warning/battery charge light went off... Good news I thought. Took off... Got half a mile and it conked again. I'm told, it may be, that the battery has suffered too much trauma and has just given up (I know how it feels) So, I've got a spare battery too :-D So I'm gonna charge that up for a good while and try that... If anyone thinks I'm missing something, or suspects there may be something else to blame, please, any help is appreciated. On a brighter note, I felt really good getting to grips with some mechanical work on the car, although I'd have appreciated less pressure and better weather. These things, I suppose, can't be helped. My dad helped and we felt pretty good after getting it "working" again. When I broke down it was rush hour. How inconsiderate can some people be? I needed to pull across a slow moving lane to get off the road, but no one would let me out... We need more Volvo drivers.

Dec 6th, 2009, 21:49	#9
yragyrag90 Senior Member Last Online: Jan 15th, 2019 20:45 Join Date: Jan 2009 Location: Newcastle	Ok... This is getting stupid. Switched the bushes from a good alternator to my dodgy one. The battery appeared to be dead so we swapped that for a good one. Now it's conked out again... What's going on? If it's not the alternator or the battery what else could it be?

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