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New (to me) 1980 Volvo 244

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Old May 22nd, 2020, 15:34   #1071
Othen
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Pleased to hear the RB is now doing what it says on the tin once more! Have you driven it any distance yet?
I've just taken the RB on about a 15 mile run and everything seems fine. The first part was open dual carriageway cruising at 70MPH, then I came back through town (traffic is returning, there was lots of waiting and ticking over in neutral).

The gauge only rose slightly in traffic and the electric fan never came on (it is about 24C today) - although I did test it with the switch on the dash, so that seems fine.

I can't help thinking the RB is running a bit rich - it is a bit lumpy at lower revs but smooths out higher. With a bike I'd be looking to fit a smaller pilot jet, but there is no option with the Pierburg. When it was off the car I noticed there was no anti-tamper cover over the CO adjustment screw at the bottom, so I wonder if someone has fiddled with it in the past. I'm tempted to try moving that adjuster in 1/8 turn at a time to see if that improves it.

Stay alert,

Alan

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Old May 22nd, 2020, 17:01   #1072
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I've just taken the RB on about a 15 mile run and everything seems fine. The first part was open dual carriageway cruising at 70MPH, then I came back through town (traffic is returning, there was lots of waiting and ticking over in neutral).

The gauge only rose slightly in traffic and the electric fan never came on (it is about 24C today) - although I did test it with the switch on the dash, so that seems fine.

I can't help thinking the RB is running a bit rich - it is a bit lumpy at lower revs but smooths out higher. With a bike I'd be looking to fit a smaller pilot jet, but there is no option with the Pierburg. When it was off the car I noticed there was no anti-tamper cover over the CO adjustment screw at the bottom, so I wonder if someone has fiddled with it in the past. I'm tempted to try moving that adjuster in 1/8 turn at a time to see if that improves it.

Stay alert,

Alan
Ticking over in neutral?

Don't touch the mixture screw Alan!

First, check the choke control is returning all the way and the cable has some slack in it when the choke control is pushed fully home.

Next, check and if necessary, adjust the ignition timing. Despite your best efforts with the timing belt, it's possible the auxiliary shaft was a tooth out before and now it's correct, you may have slightly retarded ignition timing.

Once the ignition timing is correct, adjust the idle speed to where it should be. Then check the HBoF to see if they suggest a rudimentary method of adjusting the mixture - often this will involve backing off the idle air volume screw if fitted (as opposed to the throttle butterfly stop screw) and then adjusting the mixture for the smoothest, fastest idle and either resetting the idle speed or turning the mixture screw a little one way or t'other before resetting the idle speed.

My first thoughts would be ignition timing though.
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Old May 22nd, 2020, 17:18   #1073
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Othen.

I'm pleased the engine is working.

It sounds as if you have newer type head bolts on the earlier head/engine. I guess that's probably OK.

I wonder what torque/degrees you did/should use? Hopefully all will be well.

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Old May 22nd, 2020, 21:20   #1074
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Ticking over in neutral?

Don't touch the mixture screw Alan!

First, check the choke control is returning all the way and the cable has some slack in it when the choke control is pushed fully home.

Next, check and if necessary, adjust the ignition timing. Despite your best efforts with the timing belt, it's possible the auxiliary shaft was a tooth out before and now it's correct, you may have slightly retarded ignition timing.

Once the ignition timing is correct, adjust the idle speed to where it should be. Then check the HBoF to see if they suggest a rudimentary method of adjusting the mixture - often this will involve backing off the idle air volume screw if fitted (as opposed to the throttle butterfly stop screw) and then adjusting the mixture for the smoothest, fastest idle and either resetting the idle speed or turning the mixture screw a little one way or t'other before resetting the idle speed.

My first thoughts would be ignition timing though.
Thanks Dave,

Timing is a good place to tart, I was thinking I might check it tomorrow. It is a pretty quick job as long as I can find somewhere dark enough for the neon strobe to show up. I might try first thing in the morn as the side of the house where the car port is will be in the shade.

There isn't much about Pietburg tuning in the B0fH; the Autodata book is a bit better. Pietburg is a really simple carburettor - apart from the cables and topping up the dashpot the only real adjustment is the slow running screw. The CO adjustment (which is I suppose the mixture screw) would have been set in the factory 40 years ago, I've noticed the emissions seal is missing though, so I'm wondering if someone has fiddled with it sometime? I'm curious because the car ticks-over with the slow running circuit adjustment screwed right in. I've checked all 3 cables.

I'm thinking of changing the two engine mounts - I had a look at them whilst the head was off and it looks like a pretty easy job (2 nuts each side) and cheap (6/side). The mounts on the car now seem fine but I'm thinking the rubber might be 40 years old. What do you think, is this a job worth doing for just over a tenner?

What is wrong with ticking-over in neutral in traffic? I always put the car into neutral when stopped in traffic, just like on a manual.

Stay safe,

Alan
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Old May 22nd, 2020, 23:45   #1075
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Thanks Dave,

Timing is a good place to tart, I was thinking I might check it tomorrow. It is a pretty quick job as long as I can find somewhere dark enough for the neon strobe to show up. I might try first thing in the morn as the side of the house where the car port is will be in the shade.

There isn't much about Pietburg tuning in the B0fH; the Autodata book is a bit better. Pietburg is a really simple carburettor - apart from the cables and topping up the dashpot the only real adjustment is the slow running screw. The CO adjustment (which is I suppose the mixture screw) would have been set in the factory 40 years ago, I've noticed the emissions seal is missing though, so I'm wondering if someone has fiddled with it sometime? I'm curious because the car ticks-over with the slow running circuit adjustment screwed right in. I've checked all 3 cables.

I'm thinking of changing the two engine mounts - I had a look at them whilst the head was off and it looks like a pretty easy job (2 nuts each side) and cheap (6/side). The mounts on the car now seem fine but I'm thinking the rubber might be 40 years old. What do you think, is this a job worth doing for just over a tenner?

What is wrong with ticking-over in neutral in traffic? I always put the car into neutral when stopped in traffic, just like on a manual.

Stay safe,

Alan
Timing is the first place to start Alan - you can't check/adjust the mixture if the timing is wrong. There's also a chance that might sort it all out with no further intervention.

Which screw are you referring to as the slow running screw? A photo would be helpful as i'm not wildly familiar with the Pierburg carbs, i know they can give problems but given the mileage on yours, the problems are going to be age rather than mileage related and finger trouble from people playing with things they shouldn't.

The mixture screw is the CO adjuster, usually on the bottom of the jet and many Strombergs had a castellated nut for adjustment - chances are this was carried over onto the Pierburg but i can't be sure.
If it's reached 40 years old without ever having been touched, even to correct a rich mixture due to jet/needle wear at MoT time, i'd be surprised.

Might pay to invest in something like this Gunson Gastester for checking/adjusting the mixture.
This mixture adjusting tool might also be useful depending what sort of end your mixture adjuster has on it, the Stromberg style castellated nut or the later sort.

*** EDIT *** Forgot to say, if you get the back of the car facing the sun and have the bonnet up to do the timing, it should give you enough shade to see the flashes from the neon bulb. You can also lower the bonnet a bit to reduce any ambient light getting in but it gets a bit cramped doing that!
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Old May 23rd, 2020, 06:35   #1076
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Timing is the first place to start Alan - you can't check/adjust the mixture if the timing is wrong. There's also a chance that might sort it all out with no further intervention.

Which screw are you referring to as the slow running screw? A photo would be helpful as i'm not wildly familiar with the Pierburg carbs, i know they can give problems but given the mileage on yours, the problems are going to be age rather than mileage related and finger trouble from people playing with things they shouldn't.

The mixture screw is the CO adjuster, usually on the bottom of the jet and many Strombergs had a castellated nut for adjustment - chances are this was carried over onto the Pierburg but i can't be sure.
If it's reached 40 years old without ever having been touched, even to correct a rich mixture due to jet/needle wear at MoT time, i'd be surprised.

Might pay to invest in something like this Gunson Gastester for checking/adjusting the mixture.
This mixture adjusting tool might also be useful depending what sort of end your mixture adjuster has on it, the Stromberg style castellated nut or the later sort.

*** EDIT *** Forgot to say, if you get the back of the car facing the sun and have the bonnet up to do the timing, it should give you enough shade to see the flashes from the neon bulb. You can also lower the bonnet a bit to reduce any ambient light getting in but it gets a bit cramped doing that!
Good morn Dave,

As always, many thanks.

It is a bit overcast here this morn, so I'll check the timing when I get back from Bob's first walk (but late enough not to offend my neighbours). You are right, that may solve the issue (and I should do it anyway after moving the auxiliary shaft).

Here is a photo of the slow running adjustment screw:



That is more or less the only regular adjustment on the Pierburg - the low throttle stop is changed by bending the tab a bit (yes, really) plus the 3 cables.

The CO adjuster is right at the bottom of the carburettor and difficult to photograph, but easier to see in the drawing from the Autodata book:



When the head was off I had a look at it and saw the anti-tamper seal was not fitted (nothing nefarious, as you say the CO has probably been adjusted for the MoT some time over the past 40 years). I noticed a long 8mm socket fits perfectly.

The Gunson gastester is an interesting idea, I had not come across that previously, but I'm tempted (I like gadgets). It would only be of use with an older car (but the the RB is an older car)... so I've saved it on eBay and will think about that one.

As often with my relationship with the Royal Barge - there is not much wrong and I'm looking around for issues. The engine vibrates a bit on tick-over and the slow running jet is screwed right in at 1000RPM (probably 900RPM as per my previous measurement). The timing check may well resolve the issues.

What did you think about changing the two engine mounts? They seem okay, but I'm mindful the rubber is probably 40 years old. It looks like quite an easy job and the parts are cheap. New rubber may well change the harmonic frequency away from tick-over speed?

Stay alert,

Alan

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Old May 23rd, 2020, 07:53   #1077
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I'm thinking of changing the two engine mounts - I had a look at them whilst the head was off and it looks like a pretty easy job (2 nuts each side) and cheap (6/side). The mounts on the car now seem fine but I'm thinking the rubber might be 40 years old. What do you think, is this a job worth doing for just over a tenner?
Two thoughts - the standard mounts are pretty soft anyway, so don't be misled - the engine wobbles about anyway. Diesel mounts are firmer, I think.
Check that the rubber hasn't come unbonded.

The job isn't quite as easy as it seems, because the engine is mounted at a tilt and it's hard to find a safe jacking point that lets it balance without falling over.
It's hard to get the mounting holes to line up, especially if the gearbox mount is soft and it lets the engine shift backwards a bit.

My advice would be replace the gearbox mount first - it is crucial to engine location fore-and-aft, and straightforward. I found it much easier to unbolt the each bracket assembly from the engine block and the sub-frame, and then unbolt the rubber mounting on the bench. Fit the new block, bolt up to the engine, then lower the engine while guiding the 3 bolts down through the holes in the subframe. The block's flexibility gives a bit of leeway for levering the bolts to get alignment.

Only do one side at a time! Don't ask me about the nightmare of having a very heavy engine/gearbox lying on its side having fallen over in the engine compartment.
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Old May 23rd, 2020, 08:12   #1078
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Two thoughts - the standard mounts are pretty soft anyway, so don't be misled - the engine wobbles about anyway. Diesel mounts are firmer, I think.
Check that the rubber hasn't come unbonded.

The job isn't quite as easy as it seems, because the engine is mounted at a tilt and it's hard to find a safe jacking point that lets it balance without falling over.
It's hard to get the mounting holes to line up, especially if the gearbox mount is soft and it lets the engine shift backwards a bit.

My advice would be replace the gearbox mount first - it is crucial to engine location fore-and-aft, and straightforward. I found it much easier to unbolt the each bracket assembly from the engine block and the sub-frame, and then unbolt the rubber mounting on the bench. Fit the new block, bolt up to the engine, then lower the engine while guiding the 3 bolts down through the holes in the subframe. The block's flexibility gives a bit of leeway for levering the bolts to get alignment.

Only do one side at a time! Don't ask me about the nightmare of having a very heavy engine/gearbox lying on its side having fallen over in the engine compartment.
Good morn,

Thank you so much for that... exactly what I was after.

I'm not sure this job really needs doing, but I didn't think it would do any harm!

I'll put the car up on some ramps some time over the weekend and have a poke around with a pry bar.

Stay alert,

Alan

PS. Regarding jacking - I was thinking of rigging up a beam (maybe a piece of 4"x4" timber or similar) above the motor and securing it to the lift point on the thermostat housing - then hoisting it up. The 244's nice flat wings would make that quite easy (with a bit of padding). That would prevent the engine from falling. What do you think?

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Old May 23rd, 2020, 09:14   #1079
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When I had Olaf-the-2 (the blue 244 photographed MUCH further up this thread) its idle varied between a sweet-as-a-nut 500 rpm and a lumpy 1100 after a run from Renfrew to Glasgow (say 15 miles) for no apparent reason; adjusting the idle screw made no difference, the car seemed to decide of its own volition that today's idle speed would be - whatever I want it to be!

The 1981 edition of the Haynes manual (ISBN 0 85696 591 X) has a section in the supplement about setting up the CDSU. Once I've sorted out resizing/uploading I'll post the images/link.
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Old May 23rd, 2020, 10:00   #1080
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When I had Olaf-the-2 (the blue 244 photographed MUCH further up this thread) its idle varied between a sweet-as-a-nut 500 rpm and a lumpy 1100 after a run from Renfrew to Glasgow (say 15 miles) for no apparent reason; adjusting the idle screw made no difference, the car seemed to decide of its own volition that today's idle speed would be - whatever I want it to be!

The 1981 edition of the Haynes manual (ISBN 0 85696 591 X) has a section in the supplement about setting up the CDSU. Once I've sorted out resizing/uploading I'll post the images/link.
Many thanks.
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