Any Advice?

[Chris152]

Here's a little question while the search continues. The boy found this table of Volvo engines on Wikipedia:

1985–1992 B200 — 2.0 L (1,986 cc) SOHC 8-valve Volvo 340/360 and 200/700/900 series for certain markets

1985–1995 B230 — 2.3 L (2,316 cc) SOHC 8-valve Volvo 240/Volvo 740/Volvo 940
1985–1986 B230F — 9.8:1 compression — 114 hp (85 kW; 116 PS) — U.S. models
1985–1987 B230E — 9.8:1 compression — 131 hp (98 kW; 133 PS)
1988–1993 B230F — 9.8:1 compression — 114 hp (85 kW; 116 PS) — U.S. models
1985-1990 B230ET — 10.3:1 compression — 182 hp (136 kW; 185 PS) — European models
1985–1998 B230FT — 8.7:1 compression — 165 hp (123 kW; 167 PS) — U.S./European models

(The following of less interest as post-240...)
1993-1995 B230FB — 9.8:1 compression — 136 hp (101 kW; 138 PS) — European models
1994–1998 B230FK — 8.7:1 compression — 135 hp (101 kW; 137 PS) — European models

What's the difference between an E and an F engine, and did we get both here (UK) - this table suggests we just got the E on 240s, unless FT (turbo?)?

[Clan]

Originally Posted by Chris152

Here's a little question while the search continues. The boy found this table of Volvo engines on Wikipedia:

1985–1992 B200 — 2.0 L (1,986 cc) SOHC 8-valve Volvo 340/360 and 200/700/900 series for certain markets

1985–1995 B230 — 2.3 L (2,316 cc) SOHC 8-valve Volvo 240/Volvo 740/Volvo 940
1985–1986 B230F — 9.8:1 compression — 114 hp (85 kW; 116 PS) — U.S. models
1985–1987 B230E — 9.8:1 compression — 131 hp (98 kW; 133 PS)
1988–1993 B230F — 9.8:1 compression — 114 hp (85 kW; 116 PS) — U.S. models
1985-1990 B230ET — 10.3:1 compression — 182 hp (136 kW; 185 PS) — European models
1985–1998 B230FT — 8.7:1 compression — 165 hp (123 kW; 167 PS) — U.S./European models

(The following of less interest as post-240...)
1993-1995 B230FB — 9.8:1 compression — 136 hp (101 kW; 138 PS) — European models
1994–1998 B230FK — 8.7:1 compression — 135 hp (101 kW; 137 PS) — European models

What's the difference between an E and an F engine, and did we get both here (UK) - this table suggests we just got the E on 240s, unless FT (turbo?)?

Don't believe wikipedia there are more reliable sources . Remember any tom dick or harry can make a wikepedia entry , i guess others can correct it too, but who bothers? The B200 B230 did not come out until 1984 !

The E is a high compression higher power engine , with no lambda sensor The F is the lower power lower compression engine with Catalytic converter and lambda sensor .

yes we got both , E up to about 1989 and F afterwards

[Laird Scooby]

Originally Posted by Chris152

Here's a little question while the search continues. The boy found this table of Volvo engines on Wikipedia:

1985–1992 B200 — 2.0 L (1,986 cc) SOHC 8-valve Volvo 340/360 and 200/700/900 series for certain markets

1985–1995 B230 — 2.3 L (2,316 cc) SOHC 8-valve Volvo 240/Volvo 740/Volvo 940
1985–1986 B230F — 9.8:1 compression — 114 hp (85 kW; 116 PS) — U.S. models
1985–1987 B230E — 9.8:1 compression — 131 hp (98 kW; 133 PS)
1988–1993 B230F — 9.8:1 compression — 114 hp (85 kW; 116 PS) — U.S. models
1985-1990 B230ET — 10.3:1 compression — 182 hp (136 kW; 185 PS) — European models
1985–1998 B230FT — 8.7:1 compression — 165 hp (123 kW; 167 PS) — U.S./European models

(The following of less interest as post-240...)
1993-1995 B230FB — 9.8:1 compression — 136 hp (101 kW; 138 PS) — European models
1994–1998 B230FK — 8.7:1 compression — 135 hp (101 kW; 137 PS) — European models

What's the difference between an E and an F engine, and did we get both here (UK) - this table suggests we just got the E on 240s, unless FT (turbo?)?

This table isn't complete for UKDM engines Chris, for example it omits the B23ET which was fitted to a few, very early 740 Turbos.

There was a B200E and also a B230E - both with K-Jetronic (K from Kontinuierlich, German for Continuous) injection. The "E" designation originally came from the D-Jetronic systems fitted to the 140/160 models in the late 60s/early 70s and again, comes from the German "Einspritzt" which means "injects".
As the systems were Bosch (and therefore German) i suspect Volvo used the German word - perhaps there wasn't a Swedish word for injection back then?

The B2x0F is electronic injection, usually LH2.4-Jetronic (sometimes referred to as "Motronic" and has Lambda feedback control of the mixture and a catalytic converter.
The addition of a "T" suffix indicates a Turbo so as you can guess, the B23ET mentioned above was K-Jet Turbo.

When they changed to 3 digits after the B (for Benzin = petrol), they also changed the B230ET to LH2.4-Jetronic which can be confusing.

Sometime around 1988-90, the K-Jetronic system was dropped and any engines after that such as the B200E were LH2.4-Jetronic for the most part. However, some K-Jets still existed (and were made) so it pays to find out for certain on any given model.

It's a bit of a confusing thing!

A little more information that may (or may not!) help clarify things is around 1986 give or take, Volvo revamped a lot of their engines.
This is when the B23 became the B230 and the B28E became the B280E - this one is really confusing as the B28E had K-Jet, the B280E has LH2.2-Jetronic. There is a B280F with Lambda control and a cat and 24bhp less than the "full-fat" counterpart B280E which is still more than the B28E it replaced!
However the B23E and B230E both had K-Jet!

While those tables will make interesting reading for your lad, they aren't by any means definitive as Volvo often fitted whatever they felt like based on the alignment of the stars and the results of a sacrificial moose and whatever Erik in the main stores gave them!

[Clifford Pope]

Just to further confuse the issue there were different versions of LH2.4 within the overall designation.
Earlier versions had a 5th cold start injector hidden on the underside of the inlet manifold. At a casual glance they look exactly like an ordinary version, with the same injector rail with 4 injectors. I read on Brickboard that the 5th injector is only an unnecessary boost, later dropped, and that the output from all the injectors is increased anyway when starting.

[Laird Scooby]

Originally Posted by Clifford Pope

Just to further confuse the issue there were different versions of LH2.4 within the overall designation.
Earlier versions had a 5th cold start injector hidden on the underside of the inlet manifold. At a casual glance they look exactly like an ordinary version, with the same injector rail with 4 injectors. I read on Brickboard that the 5th injector is only an unnecessary boost, later dropped, and that the output from all the injectors is increased anyway when starting.

It depends how you view "unnecessary". On the older ignition where there was a Hall Effect trigger in the distributor, you didn't have to wait 2 full turns of the crank for the system to register the first impulse from the CPS and then the second to fire. That's why the cold start valve was viewed as unnecessary by some. Meanwhile the ECU had read the sensor value of the CTS and increased the injection time to compensate for a cold engine.

Both systems have their merits, the cold start valve is on a thermoswitch and timer so it can't run for more than 8 seconds anyway.

[classicswede]

Originally Posted by Laird Scooby

The B2x0F is electronic injection, usually LH2.4-Jetronic (sometimes referred to as "Motronic" and has Lambda feedback control of the mixture and a catalytic converter.
The addition of a "T" suffix indicates a Turbo so as you can guess, the B23ET mentioned above was K-Jet Turbo.

When they changed to 3 digits after the B (for Benzin = petrol), they also changed the B230ET to LH2.4-Jetronic which can be confusing.

Sometime around 1988-90, the K-Jetronic system was dropped and any engines after that such as the B200E were LH2.4-Jetronic for the most part. However, some K-Jets still existed (and were made) so it pays to find out for certain on any given model.

It's a bit of a confusing thing!

Other than its a bit confusing all the above is wrong.

UK NEVER had any K jet turbo cars. The B23ET and B230ET with both Motronic (not LH) and used a mechanical flap air meter and no lambda. US Market and Euro market B21ET was K jet with Turbo.
B230FT B230FK and B230GT were LH2.4 closed loop lambda feedback electronic injection

Motronic and LH2.4 are very diffent systems with nothing in common other then being electronic injection

B200/230E engines were dropped 1990 with some cross over but easy to identify just by looking at the manifold. The LH2.4 engines are B200/230F

B230K is carb (early are a normal engine and later Heron heads)

[Laird Scooby]

Originally Posted by classicswede

Other than its a bit confusing all the above is wrong.

UK NEVER had any K jet turbo cars. The B23ET and B230ET with both Motronic (not LH) and used a mechanical flap air meter and no lambda. US Market and Euro market B21ET was K jet with Turbo.
B230FT B230FK and B230GT were LH2.4 closed loop lambda feedback electronic injection

Motronic and LH2.4 are very diffent systems with nothing in common other then being electronic injection

B200/230E engines were dropped 1990 with some cross over but easy to identify just by looking at the manifold. The LH2.4 engines are B200/230F

B230K is carb (early are a normal engine and later Heron heads)

I've seen a B reg, 760 Turbo with a K-Jet B23ET - owned from new and never modified.

I didn't say the LH2.4 was correctly known as Motoronic, i just said it was sometimes referred to as Motronic. That much is definitely true.

The proper Motronic was a complete engine management system including ignition in one ECU.

The "Motronic" you describe as fitted to the B23ET and B230ET with the flap air meter was L-Jetronic, later versions were LE-Jetronic and were definitely NOT Motronic! Motronic didn't come until the mid-90s for ANYTHING.

Simple reason is it wasn't releaed by Bosch until then.

[Clifford Pope]

Originally Posted by Laird Scooby

It depends how you view "unnecessary". On the older ignition where there was a Hall Effect trigger in the distributor, you didn't have to wait 2 full turns of the crank for the system to register the first impulse from the CPS and then the second to fire. That's why the cold start valve was viewed as unnecessary .

My point was (some ?) earlier LH2.4 systems had a 5th injector too. Mine has (1991 B230).
There is no Hall Effect trigger or anything else in the distributor.

It does have to rotate twice before firing, as you describe, unlike my 1993 B200 which fired the instant the starter engaged - sometimes kicking the starter out of engagement it was so quick.

[Clan]

Originally Posted by Laird Scooby

I've seen a B reg, 760 Turbo with a K-Jet B23ET - owned from new and never modified.

I didn't say the LH2.4 was correctly known as Motoronic, i just said it was sometimes referred to as Motronic. That much is definitely true.

The proper Motronic was a complete engine management system including ignition in one ECU.

The "Motronic" you describe as fitted to the B23ET and B230ET with the flap air meter was L-Jetronic, later versions were LE-Jetronic and were definitely NOT Motronic! Motronic didn't come until the mid-90s for ANYTHING.

Simple reason is it wasn't releaed by Bosch until then.

Motronic was launched with the B23ET in summer 1982 on the 760 Turbo , the early demonstrators were " A " registration and yes it used the Mechanical air mass meter .
Motronic was Jetronic with the ignition components integrated into it .

You will not have seen a 1983 760 turbo with K jetronic in UK or anywhere else ,unless it was a pre production prototype . where is your evidence? so much hearsay on here 🙄

[Laird Scooby]

Originally Posted by Clan

Motronic was launched with the B23ET in summer 1982 on the 760 Turbo , the early demonstrators were " A " registration and yes it used the Mechanical air mass meter .
Motronic was Jetronic with the ignition components integrated into it .

You will not have seen a 1983 760 turbo with K jetronic in UK or anywhere else ,unless it was a pre production prototype . where is your evidence? so much hearsay on here 🙄

Again, my words are being altered! I said i had seen a B reg 760 Turbo. Check what years that applies to! You'll find it was 1984 and 1985.

Motronic as a stand-alone didn't come about until the early to mid 90s, not the 80s and the nechanical air flap flow meter was L-Jetronic, later versions were known as LE-Jetronic although i've never found the exact difference between the two.

Proper motronic controlled the idle speed with an AICV as used on LH systems rather than the AAV as used on L/LE-Jetronic. I also pointed out that Motronic was a complet stand-alone unit that coped with ignition as well as injection. Having a separate EZK or similar ignition unit does not consitute Motronic in my book.

However, as i originally pointed out, LH2.4 was often referred to as Motronic, as was the l-Jetronic - neither were IMHO as they weren't fully integrated untis with just one ECU for injection and ignition.
That's why the CTS uses two elements, one thermistor feeds the ignition ECU (EZK) and the other feeds the injection ECU - if they were integrated there would not be a need for twin sensors in one housing.