Spare Tyre Poll

[RoyMacDonald]

Originally Posted by id5

By your interpretation that means that nobody cannot legally perform a recovery of a vehicle either as that is not mentioned in the regulation, and the motorways are not littered with broken down cars so therefore....

It does specifically state that you may stop on a motorway hard shoulder for the purpose of recovering a broken down vehicle. That's one of the things the law does mention.

[id5]

Originally Posted by RoyMacDonald

It does specifically state that you may stop on a motorway hard shoulder for the purpose of recovering a broken down vehicle. That's one of the things the law does mention.

Please tell me which section and paragraph of the Motorway Traffic (England and Wales) Regulations 1982 states it. I cannot find any such reference and it is certainly not in Section 3?

[RoyMacDonald]

Originally Posted by id5

Please tell me which section and paragraph of the Motorway Traffic (England and Wales) Regulations 1982 states it. I cannot find any such reference and it is certainly not in Section 3?

Exceptions and relaxations
16 (1) (e) (ii)

[id5]

Originally Posted by RoyMacDonald

Exceptions and relaxations
16 (1) (e) (ii)

Which is clearly in the context of the maintenance and repair of the motorway and why the previous sentence ends in 'or' and so does the sentance the word removal is in, a means to join it to the next. Then notice that (iii) does not, it uses a semi-colon to indicate it is a different context.

(e)(i) the maintenance, repair cleaning, clearance, alteration or improvement of any part of a motorway, or
(ii) the removal of any vehicle from any part of a motorway, or
(iii) the erection, laying, placing, maintenance, testing, alteration, repair or removal of any structure, works or apparatus in, on, under or over any part of a motorway; or

This is a relaxation that allows workmen to maintain the road, it is not a restriction that stops any repair.

[RoyMacDonald]

Originally Posted by id5

Which is clearly in the context of the maintenance and repair of the motorway and why the previous sentence ends in 'or' and so does the sentance the word removal is in, a means to join it to the next. Then notice that (iii) does not, it uses a semi-colon to indicate it is a different context.

(e)(i) the maintenance, repair cleaning, clearance, alteration or improvement of any part of a motorway, or
(ii) the removal of any vehicle from any part of a motorway, or
(iii) the erection, laying, placing, maintenance, testing, alteration, repair or removal of any structure, works or apparatus in, on, under or over any part of a motorway; or

This is a relaxation that allows workmen to maintain the road, it is not a restriction that stops any repair.

I never said it was a restriction to stop any repair, I just said that it was specifically mentioned that it was OK to recover a vehicle.

It reads Exemptions and Relaxations.

(ii) the removal of any vehicle from the motorway.

The breakdown companies say it's legal for them to remove broken down vehicles from motorways.

[id5]

Originally Posted by RoyMacDonald

I never said it was a restriction to stop any repair, I just said that it was specifically mentioned that it was OK to recover a vehicle.

It reads Exemptions and Relaxations.

(ii) the removal of any vehicle from the motorway.

....

There is a difference in meaning between the words recover and remove.

The word remove, the action of taking away something unwanted, only fits in the context of motorway maintenance, to which that relaxation is specific to, which you are ignoring.

You cannot isolate a single clause in a sentance to make it fit another context, it is only effective within the context of the complete sentance.

[844PHW]

To me, "repair" could be a necessary part of "recovery" of a vehicle. In other words, taking action so that the vehicle does not remain where it is.

[RoyMacDonald]

Originally Posted by id5

There is a difference in meaning between the words recover and remove.

The word remove, the action of taking away something unwanted, only fits in the context of motorway maintenance, to which that relaxation is specific to, which you are ignoring.

You cannot isolate a single clause in a sentance to make it fit another context, it is only effective within the context of the complete sentance.

I broke down on the motorway and had to stop on the hard shoulder in 1995 in my 940 TD and the Police did not give me the option to repair, only to remove my car, and they organised a recovery vehicle. They said I had to remove the vehicle from the hard shoulder. My 940 was certainly not unwanted.

I still think the law is open to interpretation and however the Police choose to apply it. You contradict them at your peril. You only have to look at the dissention on the internet as to whether it's legal or not to realise this is not a clear well drafted law.

I see no relationship between the title Exemptions and Relaxations and the list attached that means it only applies to motorway maintenance. If that was the case why would it not specifically say that was all it covered.

[volvorocks]

Originally Posted by RoyMacDonald

I looked at the legislation and it implies it is illegal in that repairs of any kind are not listed as being legal. All the legal items are listed.

You are ok if you have a woman with you though as the rules and regulations only apply to men according to The Motorway Traffic (England and Wales) Regulations 1982.....

Regards

[id5]

Originally Posted by RoyMacDonald

I broke down on the motorway and had to stop on the hard shoulder in 1995 in my 940 TD and the Police did not give me the option to repair, only to remove my car, and they organised a recovery vehicle. They said I had to remove the vehicle from the hard shoulder. My 940 was certainly not unwanted.

I still think the law is open to interpretation and however the Police choose to apply it. You contradict them at your peril. You only have to look at the dissention on the internet as to whether it's legal or not to realise this is not a clear well drafted law.

I see no relationship between the title Exemptions and Relaxations and the list attached that means it only applies to motorway maintenance. If that was the case why would it not specifically say that was all it covered.

As you have said before, a car sitting on the hard shoulder is a dangerous thing, that is why they asked you to have it recovered from the motorway. I suspect that you did not have roadside recovery insurance and could not offer them a plan that would either repair or recovery it in what they considered would be a reasonable time frame.

If laws were drafted to list everything that you can do then they would be massive; most are complex enough.

As to the quality of the Regulation is it actually very good but it is over thirty years old and was never meant to cater for the sheer volume of traffic that occurs now and the stupidity of a minority of its users. I think most would agree that it needs updating but until then the Police have to stretch the limits of what they are allowed to do for the sake of safety.