Help! Electrical Gremlin; Indicators

[Big 240]

I don't see the point in an old alarm (potential for all kinds of issues) AND a kill switch?

I will be fitting my own kill switch at some point, don't see the point in an alarm as they are ignored as annoying most times.

Maybe worth removing the alarm system?

[hreg240]

Originally Posted by Big 240

I don't see the point in an old alarm (potential for all kinds of issues) AND a kill switch?

I will be fitting my own kill switch at some point, don't see the point in an alarm as they are ignored as annoying most times.

Maybe worth removing the alarm system?

That's what I'm thinking.

I will be adding in my own security measures anyway. Might be the case of removing the alarm, but as this is my only functioning car, I hesitate at the thought of it being laid up for any period of time.

There is a well established auto-electrical company in town, which I am going to give a ring - to see if they may be able to provide help.

[Othen]

Originally Posted by hreg240

Update, for all that are interested in the saga:

Issue: Indicators don't operate from the stalk. Hazard switch operates lights correctly and the seatbelt warning light works. Dipped/Main beam functions work fine too.

So far the following has been checked:

• Fuses, none are blown. Replaced No.9 and sprayed contacts with cleaner. Bought some spares today and will swap over in my lunch hour.

• Relay. Original one looked a bit worn, I went to a local indie parts store and got another. Replacing the relay does nothing - same as before.

• Checked the readings on the stalk. This was done by Mr. AA last night. He was getting readings over/around 12V when the stalk was operated (up or down) and nothing when it returned to the 'off' position (middle). Mr. AA was confident that the stalk was working fine.

Other factors that could be important:

• The car has a battery cut-off switch in the engine bay (like on a racing car).

• It seems to have a period alarm system fitted. The operation of this system is unknown. There are stickers in the window saying 'DIGITAL' alarm system fitted.

The car is running alright (one might say a tad lumpy, but that is by-the-by); all other operations seem functional albeit the electric windows are intermittent; they were completely not working (both driver and passenger switches inoperative) yesterday, however are working fine today.

I'm not surprised that the fault isn't with the relay - the same unit is used for both the indicators and the 4 way flasher system. It won't be anything to do with the battery cut-off switch, so discount that. It is very unlikely to be anything connected with the alarm, although I would remove it - they are much more trouble than they are worth.

Looking at the wiring diagram (1981-84, but that bit probably didn't change if you have a later motor car) I can see the indicator system is powered up by fuse 9, and the 4-ways by fuse 13 (check that is the same on your car). The most likely fault is either with fuse 13 or the wiring leading to it. First pull fuse 9 (or whatever on your car) and see if the 4 ways stop working to make sure you have the right cct. Replace it. Next pull fuse 13 (check it is the right one), clean up the contacts and replace it with a new one you know is good.

If that doesn't fix the problem just follow the voltage through from the fuse to the 4 way flasher switch (it goes there first), then to the relay. Just be methodical with your meter and you must find the problem - you won't need an auto electrical company to fix a little issue like this.

[hreg240]

Originally Posted by Othen

I'm not surprised that the fault isn't with the relay - the same unit is used for both the indicators and the 4 way flasher system. It won't be anything to do with the battery cut-off switch, so discount that. It is very unlikely to be anything connected with the alarm, although I would remove it - they are much more trouble than they is worth.

Looking at the wiring diagram (1981-84, but that bit probably didn't change if you have a later motor car) I can see the indicator system is powered up by fuse 9, and the 4-ways by fuse 13 (check that is the same on your car). The most likely fault is either with fuse 13 or the wiring leading to it. First pull fuse 9 (or whatever on your car) and see if the 4 ways stop working to make sure you have the right cct. Replace it. Next pull fuse 13 (check it is the right one), cleaan up the contacts and replace it with a new one you know is good.

If that doesn't fix the problem just follow the voltage through from the fuse to the 4 way flasher switch (it goes there first), then to the relay. Just be methodical with your meter and you must find the problem - you won't need an auto electrical company to fix a little issue like this.

Thanks Alan, you're brilliant as ever!

I have called up my Uncle, who is going to go through the wiring with me this evening. We are erring that it is the switch.

I'm confident he will be able to get the bottom of things, as electronics are his bread and butter.

I'll keep the thread updated, as I'm sure someone else who is not electronically minded may find the results useful.

I also haven't forgotten to post some pics / a project thread - today has been rather more busy than I anticipated.

[Othen]

Originally Posted by Othen

I'm not surprised that the fault isn't with the relay - the same unit is used for both the indicators and the 4 way flasher system. It won't be anything to do with the battery cut-off switch, so discount that. It is very unlikely to be anything connected with the alarm, although I would remove it - they are much more trouble than they are worth.

Looking at the wiring diagram (1981-84, but that bit probably didn't change if you have a later motor car) I can see the indicator system is powered up by fuse 9, and the 4-ways by fuse 13 (check that is the same on your car). The most likely fault is either with fuse 13 or the wiring leading to it. First pull fuse 9 (or whatever on your car) and see if the 4 ways stop working to make sure you have the right cct. Replace it. Next pull fuse 13 (check it is the right one), clean up the contacts and replace it with a new one you know is good.

If that doesn't fix the problem just follow the voltage through from the fuse to the 4 way flasher switch (it goes there first), then to the relay. Just be methodical with your meter and you must find the problem - you won't need an auto electrical company to fix a little issue like this.

This will probably help:



... as you may see, fuse 9 just protects the hazard system, fuse 13 does a whole bunch of stuff including the indicators. Does your seat belt reminder work (it is really irritating)? If not it will be this fuse.

This won't be difficult to find and fix, it isn't really electronics and one does not need to be an expert to sort it. You will have a lot of electrical issues with your 30-40 year old Volvo (particularly if it is an estate car), so you might as well get used to fixing them.

[hreg240]

Originally Posted by Othen

This will probably help:



... as you may see, fuse 9 just protects the hazard system, fuse 13 does a whole bunch of stuff including the indicators. Does your seat belt reminder work (it is really irritating)? If not it will be this fuse.

This won't be difficult to find and fix, it isn't really electronics and one does not need to be an expert to sort it. You will have a lot of electrical issues with your 30-40 year old Volvo (particularly if it is an estate car), so you might as well get used to fixing them.

The seatbelt warning lamp does work, however that panel is very useful! The inside of my fuse box cover is written in French.

[hreg240]

Alan;

Just checked the fuse again…It had a 16a instead of an 8a in.

Now the relay makes a tick even if the hazards are off and indicators are off. Still no working indicators.

The seatbelt warning also only works when the hazards are on - I’ve just found this out.

[Bob 1967]

Originally Posted by hreg240

The seatbelt warning lamp does work, however that panel is very useful! The inside of my fuse box cover is written in French.

Mon Dieu!

[Othen]

Originally Posted by hreg240

Alan;

Just checked the fuse again…It had a 16a instead of an 8a in.

Now the relay makes a tick even if the hazards are off and indicators are off. Still no working indicators.

The seatbelt warning also only works when the hazards are on - I’ve just found this out.

Okay, that is sort of progress in that something changed.

First the fuse rating will not be critical, it should work exactly the same with a 16A or 8A. It is interesting that it has been changed though - maybe there was a fault that led to it blowing? If so it will return soon enough.

Which fuse did you change 9 or 13? That fact that it has made a change to the relay probably indicates the issue is either with the fuse's seating or the wiring close by that you may have disturbed. I think the most likely fault is a poor connection to fuse 13, take it out and clean the seating - a small drill bit wrapped in a bit of electrical tape is useful. Make sure the metal is shiny and also the ends of the fuse. You can check it is conducting with the multi-meter you bought today (on the DC voltage scale).

The seatbelt warning only working when the hazards are on rather confirms my thoughts as above - the fault is with or near fuse 13. The warning buzzer should work in all circumstances, not just with the hazards on.

This really should not be a hard problem to solve now - you are in the right area, just be methodical with that meter and follow the voltage.

[hreg240]

Morning all,

We went through the whole indicator / flasher system last night and finally - success!

Tested each wire, from the hazard switch, to the stalk, the relay and the fuse box.

It turned out to be the 16a fuse for the blue wires (can't remember which number off the top of my head). The fuse wasn't blown per-se and I have never seen a fuse break like this (pic below).

So, in short. If you're having electrical faults and are still using the continental type fuses (ceramic ones) CHECK ALL FUSES.... Even if they don't look blown, there could be a dodgy connection.

The upshot of this farce was, however, that we confirmed the rest of the indicator wiring is in good stead - no interference from the alarm, which was a worry.


Thank you all once again for the very sound advice. There are plenty of other jobs that need tending to on the 240, which I will be documenting on here. Now that I can drive the car safely on the road, I am less frantic!



P.s I have no idea how to reduce the size of that image here; I uploaded it to Imgur if that helps.