End of D5

[volvorocks]

Originally Posted by Ashford

It does seem odd that the D5 AWD and D4 AWD have same emissions.

The D5 AWD and the D4 AWD both have the same engine, just in different states of tune, hence same emissions.

I am like you I suppose, in so far as I do not really need AWD, although in wet conditions, steep hills, setting off, grassy fields etc, it is more reassuring and feels more planted to have AWD. With AWD there is not the problem of torque steer that one or two may have mentioned occurs with FWD.

Is AWD worth the extra expense, both in terms of initial outlay and running costs? I don't really think so, tbh, although again probably like you and some others, despite the fact I don't really need AWD, I feel an XC60 type vehicle should have it.

I suppose the best thing to do is to compare a 2.4 D4 181/D5 215 AWD with a 2.0 181 D4 FWD VEA.

Regards

[volvorocks]

Originally Posted by Harvey1512

The size is actually very similar but weight difference is significant. The decision is, again one I am making, is whether you want the raised height and road presence that the XC60 offers.

As you say there is virtually nothing in it ref size,length wise think about a centimetre! Funnily an S60 and V60 I think are exactly the same size. Funnily again whilst being the virtual same size length wise an XC60 does indeed (to me at least) feel a much much much larger car, despite the fact it is only 3 or 4 centimetres wider. Possibly due perhaps to the extra height??

I find driving an S60 compared to an XC60 a bit like chalk and cheese. With the XC you kind of sit 'on it', whereas with S60 you feel more like you are sitting 'in it'. I think S60 is a more cosy driving environment as it is lower, although prefer the raised height of the XC.

Also as a passenger, and I have been a passenger more times in 2013 than a driver, I prefer being a passenger in the S60, it feels smoother.

Regards

[Harvey1512]

Originally Posted by volvorocks

As you say there is virtually nothing in it ref size,length wise think about a centimetre! Funnily an S60 and V60 I think are exactly the same size. Funnily again whilst being the virtual same size length wise an XC60 does indeed (to me at least) feel a much much much larger car, despite the fact it is only 3 or 4 centimetres wider. Possibly due perhaps to the extra height??

I find driving an S60 compared to an XC60 a bit like chalk and cheese. With the XC you kind of sit 'on it', whereas with S60 you feel more like you are sitting 'in it'. I think S60 is a more cosy driving environment as it is lower, although prefer the raised height of the XC.

Also as a passenger, and I have been a passenger more times in 2013 than a driver, I prefer being a passenger in the S60, it feels smoother.

Regards

I think you have given a really good description of the differences and how the XC60 feels. I used to have a Yeti and people used to ask did I mind driving and parking a larger car. When I told them it was smaller in size than a Golf they didn't believe me. Raising a car up distorts your perspective.

[simonjedrake]

Originally Posted by Ashford

Well thanks all for the debate, most enjoyable!

Having initially cast the net quite wide, I have now discounted all other makes of car and narrowed choice down to three Volvos...XC60 D5 AWD, XC60 D4 FWD, and V60 D4.

So if XC60 is the answer, then choice of AWD or FWD. As someone said, do I need AWD? Probably not is the answer, but currently drive an A4 Avant Quattro and it does give you a certain confidence and never slips in the wet and up and down hills in the country, plus I can reverse up the drive when it snows which I never could with previous S60s.

Really liked the winter tyres video, and that would be an option to go with the FWD version - would soon be able to pay for a set. But not sure the lease company would be happy for me to change them?

Ashford. Decisions...........Decisions.
I think you have already answered your questions in the above.

I went through the same decision process as well. Key factor was me was the need for AWD - Why?
I have a steep down sloping driveway (like yours!) with the garage at the bottom which I have to enter frontwards. Then everytime it snowed or got icy I just could never reverse up the driveway even with Winters on my prevoius FWD Volvos..............until I purchased my last XC60 AWD. Now what ever the snow/ice I have alawys been able to reverse up the driveway.

But more important to you is that being a lease car I very much doubt they will approve anything else than OEM tyres - so no winters for you!

Decision made I think..............

[wimorrison]

Originally Posted by simonjedrake

?..

But more important to you is that being a lease car I very much doubt they will approve anything else than OEM tyres - so no winters
...

They will be happy if you buy the tyres and they are approved for use on the car

[m2srt]

Originally Posted by Arianne

Guys, the thing the makes me overheat the keyboard is the fallacy that, in some ways, is perpetuated by manufacturers in their advertising about the miracle of AWD. For example, the current newspaper & magazine adverts for the Volvo D4 AWD at £397 p.m. PCP. It shows the car in the middle of a snowfield with the statement that snow doesn't stop Sweden in its tracks. There's no mention that 2" of snow in Britain will stop your D4 AWD XC60 in its tracks if you don't shell out £600 - £800 for a set of winter tyres and possibly another £600+ for an extra set of rims.

It's not that some folk love AWD, others FWD and a few RWD. That's cool. It's the misunderstanding that folk have about how amazing their cars will be if all four wheels can be powered. It's true that their AWD cars will be amazing......as long as the humble black rubber on each wheel is fit for purpose.

There were some excellent examples of all this undertaken on an indoor ski slope using FWD Honda Civics shod with Dunlop std summer tyres and their 4D winter tyres. Amazing and just as we remember it ourselves in Austria.

http://www.tyrereviews.co.uk/Article...-ski-slope.htm

If this little post helps just one person invest in the right rubber to maximise either their FWD XC60 or make their AWD version truly amazing then it's been worth it. Oh, and if it saves someone from investing in AWD for the wrong reason then that's good too.

For what it's worth.....I really don't have any real leaning for either drive system. But folk should be aware of the facts and then they can choose with their eyes wide open.....and be happy with that. I remember one poor soul on the Volvo UK review listing saying how disappointed he was with his XC60 AWD as it was hopeless in the snow. It wasn't the car though, but the standard fit pirelli boots.

PS. One other thing.....the raised ride height of the SUV is a great thing on the farm tracks. Has anyone seen the clearance needed when your tyres are in those ruts and the centre grassy bit is sitting well proud up towards your exhaust system? Farm tracks in the Ettrick, Yarrow & Manor valley are not for MPVs unless you want to be the laughing stock of the Scottish sheep & cattle farmers. That's no place for a Ford Galaxy or Seat Alhambra (& probably no place for my soon to arrive 20" Ixion rims either but that's another story yet to unfold, I suspect!)

awd on winter tires is very reassuring on snow however you cannot get complacent. braking can often be worse than a small fwd car due to the extra mass.