Volvo Community Forum. The Forums of the Volvo Owners Club

Forum Rules Volvo Owners Club About VOC Volvo Gallery Links Volvo History Volvo Press
Go Back   Volvo Owners Club Forum > "Technical Topics" > 200 Series General

Notices

200 Series General Forum for the Volvo 240 and 260 cars

Information
  • VOC Members: There is no login facility using your VOC membership number or the details from page 3 of the club magazine. You need to register in the normal way
  • AOL Customers: Make sure you check the 'Remember me' check box otherwise the AOL system may log you out during the session. This is a known issue with AOL.
  • AOL, Yahoo and Plus.net users. Forum owners such as us are finding that AOL, Yahoo and Plus.net are blocking a lot of email generated from forums. This may mean your registration activation and other emails will not get to you, or they may appear in your spam mailbox

Thread Informations

B23A to B230FT conversion

Views : 2757

Replies : 57

Users Viewing This Thread :  

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old Oct 1st, 2018, 19:25   #1
240ratrod
Junior Member
 

Last Online: Nov 8th, 2020 12:22
Join Date: Oct 2018
Location: Nottingham
Default B23A to B230FT conversion

Hi members,

After a while browsing this forum I have found you all to be very helpful.
So...I am now in a position to ask a few questions, please excuse my lack of certain knowledge and don't hesitate to point me in the right direction.

I have a 1984 240 GLE B23A.
I also have a 1996 940 turbo B230FT.

The 240 is my daily driver and has been somewhat 'rat-rod-ed'! Not to everyones tastes but I love it. Due to a lack of power and poor MPG I decided to start an engine swap.
I purchased a complete 940 turbo as a donor car. I drove this 200 miles home so can attest it's fully working condition.

So far I have pulled the engine and box (auto) from the 940, the wiring looms, ECU's, etc, and other bits from the engine bay.

I hope you will watch this project with interest, though I know I'm not reinventing the wheel by any stretch of the imagination.

I ask kindly for advice on mating the new drivetrain with the aged 240.
What am I going to come up against?

First thoughts are:

- Fuel pumps needed
- Gauge/clocks compatibility
- Speed sensor (diff mounted? My 240 does not have this unlike the 940)
- Custom downpipe/exhaust will be fabricated
- Wiring looms in general

Obviously I will do a full 'stage 0' tune up before starting 'stage 1' mods and the install itself.

All advice appreciated.Thanks, Matt.
Attached Images
File Type: jpg 32116258_10160252668325697_3692150025913106432_n.jpg (264.2 KB, 23 views)
240ratrod is offline   Reply With Quote
Old Oct 2nd, 2018, 09:38   #2
mylittletony
Master Member
 
mylittletony's Avatar
 

Last Online: Mar 7th, 2024 10:01
Join Date: Oct 2011
Location: East Sussex
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by 240ratrod View Post

First thoughts are:

- Fuel pumps needed
- Gauge/clocks compatibility
- Speed sensor (diff mounted? My 240 does not have this unlike the 940)
- Custom downpipe/exhaust will be fabricated
- Wiring looms in general
Hi Matt

Great conversion, I've recently finished the same conversion on my 79 (B21A)

Fuel pump - get an injection pump and sender, they fit the tank in the same way. I mounted a repro 255lph pump in tank, it's a bit noisy but flows plenty. You only need that one, instead of 2 like an injection car. Use carb feed line as return and run a new feed line.

Speedo and sensor - you can swap injection clocks into your car which will work with the diff sensor and LH injection, but you would then need a diff sensor. You can either swap in a post '85 axle, or "just" the diff and cover. Wiring is very easy.
OR, if you have an M46 or M47 and don't plan on going wild with the power (<250hp) I would keep the gearbox, speedo and axle you have.


Downpipe - you can cut and shut the 940 one if you're tight on funds

Wiring - I spent a loooong time thinning down the 940 loom and it then didn't work. I ended up buying a custom loom from https://www.elbertbos.nl/index.php/en/ and I wish I'd known about them sooner. I couldn't recommend him highly enough. Dai at Classicswede also stocks them.

Engine mounts - get some Jag XJ6 ones, they're strong rubber ones.

Do crank and cam seals and HG while the engine is out.

Try and fit a different oil cooler, the 940 arrangement gets close on the downpipe and steering column.

You might want to fit the B23A cam, check what letter is stamped in the bulkhead end. The B23A is a fairly desirable engine so don't chuck it away

p.s. are you going auto?? Having driven a 940 auto for a while and really enjoying the way it delivers power, good shout.

Good luck, join the FB group as well!
mylittletony is offline   Reply With Quote
Old Oct 2nd, 2018, 10:32   #3
240ratrod
Junior Member
 

Last Online: Nov 8th, 2020 12:22
Join Date: Oct 2018
Location: Nottingham
Default

Hi, thank you for your reply.

Fuel pump: so will the 940 injection pump fit inside the 240 tank? and am I understanding correct that this is sufficient to provide enough pressure to the rail?

Speedo: So I have to track down an injection set of clocks. Regarding the diff, will the 940 diff fit straight in to the 240 housing? Both the 940 and 240 have auto boxes which I intend to keep. The B230ft was pulled with the gearbox attached so I was going to do the same with the B23A and just straight swap.

Downpipe: My first thought was to cut'n'shut but I'd prefer to up the diameter so 2.5" minimum. So I'll be making a new downpipe and complete 2.5" system.

Loom: Yeah my plan is to thin down the 940 loom, removing the parts we won't need, ie: AC, headlights, ABS, etc. Mating this to the interior loom and the 240 was the scary bit. Did you identify where you went wrong and why it didn't work? Thank you for the link, I'll investigate this for sure.

Cam: I know I have a desirable A cam in the 240 engine. Having read lots on the difference between the standard T and the A I am still unsure whether I'll notice the extra? If you recommend doing HG as part of the 'stage 0' then it would make sense to swap the cams over too.

Distributor: Did you move the set up from the head to the block? I was going to just make a hole (neatly!) in the firewall. I understand that the heater box will then be in the way...there must be a way of making it all work, or get a new heater box assembly (I used to build kit cars and we used a standalone unit).

The plan is to take the engine to around 200bhp by way of installing a boost controller, larger FMIC, 2.5" exhaust, (A-cam maybe).
Would you pull the A-cam of leave it to sell the B23A complete? It's only done 120k miles and pulls very well with no issues, just a bit thirsty and I like more power (used to have a X5 4.8 V8 so I like power!)

Again thanks and I what was going to be a quick swap is turning in to a more complex program, but who doesn't enjoy a challenge!
240ratrod is offline   Reply With Quote
Old Oct 2nd, 2018, 11:49   #4
mylittletony
Master Member
 
mylittletony's Avatar
 

Last Online: Mar 7th, 2024 10:01
Join Date: Oct 2011
Location: East Sussex
Default

Hi, replies in red below. It's all fairly straightforward as engine conversions go, but not quite plug and play.

One other tip is to relocate the alternator - I've left mine in the 240 location and it's all pretty tight what with oil pipes and turbo

Quote:
Originally Posted by 240ratrod View Post
Hi, thank you for your reply.

Fuel pump: so will the 940 injection pump fit inside the 240 tank?
No, you need to go aftermarket pump. Search for "Walbro 255" and this should fit in place of the 240 in-tank lift pump from an injection model

Speedo: So I have to track down an injection set of clocks. Regarding the diff, will the 940 diff fit straight in to the 240 housing? Both the 940 and 240 have auto boxes which I intend to keep. The B230ft was pulled with the gearbox attached so I was going to do the same with the B23A and just straight swap.
Not necessarily. The 240 went electronic speedo in 85, so any set after that will give you a speedo signal. If you went for an LH equipped 240 (91-93) then it would have the speedo signal for the ECU (although you don't need this to run and drive). The 940 diff will have 48 teeth if the car had ABS, most 240s didn't and would have 12 teeth on the diff. This will be your biggest hurdle I think, might be easier to get axle and clocks from the same donor 240.
The 940 auto box is much more developed than your 240 one, but the prop length may well be different. I think you could get a 240 with the AW71 in which case you'll need a prop from one of them


Downpipe: My first thought was to cut'n'shut but I'd prefer to up the diameter so 2.5" minimum. So I'll be making a new downpipe and complete 2.5" system.
If you're going to fabricate, then 3" will fit and provide more benefits

Loom: Yeah my plan is to thin down the 940 loom, removing the parts we won't need, ie: AC, headlights, ABS, etc. Mating this to the interior loom and the 240 was the scary bit. Did you identify where you went wrong and why it didn't work? Thank you for the link, I'll investigate this for sure.
I think my problem was at the bulkhead, I cut the 940 loom and attempted to rejoin it with connectors. There are several shielded wires and the same colours going to multiple places so I assume I got confused. For €300 a new loom was a guaranteed fix and is a lot of peace of mind for me

Cam: I know I have a desirable A cam in the 240 engine. Having read lots on the difference between the standard T and the A I am still unsure whether I'll notice the extra? If you recommend doing HG as part of the 'stage 0' then it would make sense to swap the cams over too.
It's hard to make a direct comparison as I did other mods and had a long period between drives, but the A cam feels very strong in the upper rev range. If you do swap cams, you will almost definitely have to change shims to ensure the correct valve clearance

Distributor: Did you move the set up from the head to the block? I was going to just make a hole (neatly!) in the firewall. I understand that the heater box will then be in the way...there must be a way of making it all work, or get a new heater box assembly (I used to build kit cars and we used a standalone unit).
Yes, I changed to block mounted. I would strongly advise to not cut the bulkhead, technically it's a chassis modification which is BIVA territory. You have the parts required to make it work

The plan is to take the engine to around 200bhp by way of installing a boost controller, larger FMIC, 2.5" exhaust, (A-cam maybe).
Would you pull the A-cam of leave it to sell the B23A complete? It's only done 120k miles and pulls very well with no issues, just a bit thirsty and I like more power (used to have a X5 4.8 V8 so I like power!)
200hp should be a breeze with those mods. I used a non-AC 940 intercooler which is a decent size. You should probably pull the aux shaft to run the block distributor so might as well pull the cam too, either for now or the future. Most of the value of the B23A is the forged bottom end

Again thanks and I what was going to be a quick swap is turning in to a more complex program, but who doesn't enjoy a challenge!
mylittletony is offline   Reply With Quote
Old Oct 2nd, 2018, 12:07   #5
Stephen Edwin
Premier Member
 

Last Online: Oct 26th, 2023 21:42
Join Date: Jun 2010
Location: Thurrock
Default

I know nothing but re the pump. Is the Walbro 255 the pump that Antz recommends? There is a recent post by Antz that mentions there are, not exactly genuine, ones available. That post points to a reliable source for a genuine pump.




Engine swap? &c. &c. I really do know nothing. I'm a driver of a bog standard 240 SE and I'm pleased with it. I'll go back in to my box.

I did do an engine swap helping a neighbour on an Anglia in about 1974. A lovely evening. A neighbour upstairs had a lovely meal aromas wafting down upon us ..... EEK


.
Stephen Edwin is offline   Reply With Quote
Old Oct 2nd, 2018, 12:23   #6
classicswede
Trader Volvo in my veins
 
classicswede's Avatar
 

Last Online: Yesterday 23:41
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Anglesey
Default

Fuel pump the Walbro 255 is a noisy pump and a lot of fakes about.
Another alternative is https://h-tune.co.uk/deatschwerks-pe...=3826&188=3804

Speedo the best bet would be to get a axle and speedo head from a slightly later 240.

Exhaust 2.5inch is the way to go if staying under 300BHP

Distributor, dont hack the bulkhead up, changing cap etc will be a horrible job. Also note the cap and rotor arm for teh head mounted dizzy are about 3 times the price of teh block mounted type. You can use the parts from your B23

The A cam is noticably much better than the T but better still is a cam designed for a performance turbo engine like the T2 or T3 cam I would not use anything more agressive than that with a Auto box
classicswede is offline   Reply With Quote
Old Oct 2nd, 2018, 17:56   #7
skidje
Master Member
 
skidje's Avatar
 

Last Online: Mar 8th, 2024 06:45
Join Date: Nov 2002
Location: Eindhoven
Default

All of above confirmed except:
- many examples around running the stock standard 940 pump in their 240 with this b230fk/ft engine.
- Why not get the wiring loom with ECU/EZK and ignition from a late 91-92 model 240 with LH? This is most probably the same loom Tony received from this well respected dutch Elbert Bos. He is btw really very supportive and trustworthy with his stuff and well known among most of us here in NLD.
- BTW a knowledgeable guy in NLD went B230F +T on a NA engine. Pressure from Turbo is slightly increased and has customer made IC.But he went back T-Cam and claims hardly noticeable difference.

Haven't heard any comments to the turbo. What gives best torque at low rev's? How would this set up be made?

What is meant with HG in the above?
skidje is offline   Reply With Quote
Old Oct 2nd, 2018, 18:48   #8
classicswede
Trader Volvo in my veins
 
classicswede's Avatar
 

Last Online: Yesterday 23:41
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Anglesey
Default

HG = Head Gasket

13c is very good for low down power but is too small to make good high end power. Turbo size is trade of between bottom and top end power

The loom from Elbert (that I stock) is not the same as the late 240 loom. The late 240 is still intergrated into teh main wiring loom. The conversion loom is a simple plug and play job
classicswede is offline   Reply With Quote
Old Oct 2nd, 2018, 18:52   #9
240ratrod
Junior Member
 

Last Online: Nov 8th, 2020 12:22
Join Date: Oct 2018
Location: Nottingham
Default

mylittletony:

If you went for an LH equipped 240 (91-93) then it would have the speedo signal for the ECU (although you don't need this to run and drive).

So the ECU(s) will operate without a speed signal from the diff?
So I don't need to swap out the axle? And I won't have ABS as it's not fitted and I can do away with cruise control from the 940 too. Of course I'll need to retain my auto box for the cable speedo drive in this scenario.

I'll look into how one swaps the distributor from the head to the block. So I have everything needed between the B23 and B230? Of course I'll need to buy/fabricate a plug for the head.

skidje: HG = head gasket. I'll look in to finding someone breaking a car with all the right bits too. Thanks.
240ratrod is offline   Reply With Quote
Old Oct 2nd, 2018, 19:20   #10
classicswede
Trader Volvo in my veins
 
classicswede's Avatar
 

Last Online: Yesterday 23:41
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Anglesey
Default

To swap the distributor you need the drive shaft from inside the engine, it is easy to do.

The ECU does not need the speed signal. Using your original box would work to solve the speedo issue. You must use the flex plate from the turbo engine

The plug for the head is still available from Volvo
classicswede is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply


Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT +1. The time now is 16:37.


Powered by vBulletin
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.