Amazon: Vague + Heavy Steering

[altrezia]

Hey guys

The first of my many issues - the steering.

Drove the car (a '66 121) home from collection today and while it was pretty well behaved, the steering was causing me some concern - it's really heavy (but I suppose I expected that) - but also very vague. The car tends to wander about on the road, and needs constant correction, but the corrections aren't consistent.

Moving the steering wheel clockwise and anti-clockwise seems to only suggest the car should turn and it decides if it wants to and so on.

I'm going to check the steering box, and replace the rubber doughnut thing - anyone know the best place to order parts for the old cars in the UK?

In addition - can the rubber be replaced by a UJ, and/or the box replaced with a more modern rack?

Many thanks!

[Rustinmotion]

Originally Posted by altrezia

Hey guys

The first of my many issues - the steering.

Drove the car (a '66 121) home from collection today and while it was pretty well behaved, the steering was causing me some concern - it's really heavy (but I suppose I expected that) - but also very vague. The car tends to wander about on the road, and needs constant correction, but the corrections aren't consistent.

Moving the steering wheel clockwise and anti-clockwise seems to only suggest the car should turn and it decides if it wants to and so on.

I'm going to check the steering box, and replace the rubber doughnut thing - anyone know the best place to order parts for the old cars in the UK?

In addition - can the rubber be replaced by a UJ, and/or the box replaced with a more modern rack?

Many thanks!

Brookhouse Volvo have most parts, Amazon cars are another source but best to phone them as the web sites a shocker

[altrezia]

Amazing, thank you

[Ron Kwas]

altre;

Welcome to this forum!

The first thing I would check is tire pressure!...after that, condition of front suspension, including separating upper Ball Joint to remove Spring preload forces, then checking all bushings and components for slop...

You should introduce yourself, and state your experience and capabilities...then we will know to what level to give advice and suggestions.

Before speaking of modifications, like replacing the Steering Box (a MAJOR re-engineering job!), you should bring the systems back to proper and decent condition, including adjusting the Steering Box (and that means per the procedure, and NOT simply wanging down on the Adjustment Screw!!). Half the time people speak of wanting to "upgrade"...they should first restore!

I invite you to peruse the sw-em.com site to steepen your learning curve.

Good Hunting and Greets from Connecticut!

[altrezia]

Originally Posted by Ron Kwas

altre;

Welcome to this forum!

The first thing I would check is tire pressure!...after that, condition of front suspension, including separating upper Ball Joint to remove Spring preload forces, then checking all bushings and components for slop...

You should introduce yourself, and state your experience and capabilities...then we will know to what level to give advice and suggestions.

Before speaking of modifications, like replacing the Steering Box (a MAJOR re-engineering job!), you should bring the systems back to proper and decent condition, including adjusting the Steering Box (and that means per the procedure, and NOT simply wanging down on the Adjustment Screw!!). Half the time people speak of wanting to "upgrade"...they should first restore!

I invite you to peruse the sw-em.com site to steepen your learning curve.

Good Hunting and Greets from Connecticut!

Hey! All good advice.
I did some more forum reading after posting, and a lot of the replies to other threads mention that a joint or idler arm maybe be bad, meaning stiff steering and/or vagueness - so makes sense I should check all that first.

I'm totally new to Volvos, but rebuilt loads of cars previously, and raced cars for a decade, so not scared of spanners

Edit to add: That sw-em website is amazing!

Thanks!

[gjr0]

If the car has sat in a collection for a long time the grease in all the joints may be dried out, giving the car a bad case of memory steer. Once you are moving the steering should not be particularly heavy.

The rubber coupler in the steering column is there to keep you from getting speared by the steering column in a front end collision. A u-joint could work but you would have to re-engineer the angle between the upper and lower columns.

[altrezia]

Originally Posted by gjr0

If the car has sat in a collection for a long time the grease in all the joints may be dried out, giving the car a bad case of memory steer. Once you are moving the steering should not be particularly heavy.

The rubber coupler in the steering column is there to keep you from getting speared by the steering column in a front end collision. A u-joint could work but you would have to re-engineer the angle between the upper and lower columns.

It was in a collection but used weekly (or so) by my uncle. I'll give everything a check if/when the sun ever comes out.

I've ordered a rubber doughnut and a couple of other bits and bobs to start with and will check which joints/arms before doing anything else. Thanks!

[Derek UK]

It doesn't need it but does it have an MOT? Sounds as if your Amazon knowledge is rather limited so an MOT will let you know how the car is faring. Your description of the steering sounds as if the box is adjusted too tight. Don't try to adjust out the side to side play at the steering wheel. Even when new the play is about 1" to either side and a worn box, they are all rather old now, can double that. You get used to it! The steering boxes are also very prone to having a leaking lower oil seal. This can quite quickly relieve the box of its contents. Use SAE90 the same as the back axle even though the book says SAE80.

[altrezia]

It's MOT expired about a month ago, so I may look at having one done just so someone can cast an eye over it.

[142 Guy]

So many possible issues.

Raise the front end of the car so that both front wheels are no longer in contact with the ground. Go to each wheel, grasp the tires at 03:00 and 09:00 o'clock and give them a back - forth shake. If you get unconstrained movement / rattling / clicking then you know you have a wear problem which requires further exploration. Repeat at 06:00 and 12:00 o'clock. This may also flag wheel bearing issues. Spin the wheels and listen for bearing rumble.

With the car back on the ground, reach through the open driver's side window and move the steering wheel back and forth. You will get movement; but, if you have somebody observe the steering shaft they can assess whether there is excessive movement in the steering shaft couplings. They can also listen for clunking in the steering box which is a sign that the pitman arm shaft is moving up and down. As Ron K notes, the proper procedure for setting the adjustment of the steering box pitman arm shaft is set out in the service manual.

The idler arm bushing on vintage Volvos has a bit of a reputation for failing which usually leads to 'slop'. Modern exact replacements are of not so good quality. You can find replacement brass bushings which are more durable. If you disconnect the two joints from the idler arm, it is relatively easy to assess the condition of the idler arm by grabbing it and moving it. It should move smoothly with no play.

Amazon's come with the absolute minimum amount of positive caster that is safe. I think the factory spec is 0 to +1.0 deg. Volvo uses very little caster in an attempt to reduce low speed steering effort; however, that small amount of caster also results in very little self centering in the steering at highway speeds (a tendency to wander). After you have remedied any wear issues in the front suspension / steering have the alignment checked. If you want stability at speed, setting the caster to +1.0 deg is the way to go. You can go higher which will make the car more stable; but, the steering at low speeds will become heavier. Modern cars with power steering run +3 to +7 deg caster. If you take the car to an alignment shop, make sure that they know that gross caster values are set by applying shims between the body and the cross member. The shims located at the upper wishbone are for adjusting camber and correcting differences between left and right caster. If you try to adjust caster with large amounts of shim differential on the upper wishbone you can damage the crossmember. Check the procedure in the service manual for setting caster and make sure the shop is aware of it - they will hate it because you need to raise the car off the crossmember, install the shims, button things up and check. Alignment jigs are not really set up to allow the car to be raised. You can also play with the toe in. Adding more positive toe in will improve straight line stability; but, reduce steering response.