Help! 2012 S60 D5 Water pump catastrophic failure

[misterrich]

Hi guys

I rarely post as I am generally smitten with my D5 Polestar and have had no problems with it...until now.

I was driving happily (but slowly) out of Birmingham last Thursday evening rush hour when I heard a fairly modest clunk and the car switched itself off in the second lane of 4 (you may have seen me as I was there for a full 45 minutes!).

AA rescued me (which meant Volvo assist will not provide a courtesy vehicle, but that's another story and probably known to many of you...) and discovered cam belt had worn through its housing and had effectively come off. AA guy thinks it was caused by a water pump failure which was probably longstanding given the type of damage.

Car was recovered to local dealer who suggested committing to replacing pump and belt (£700 odd) but that 90-95% sure that would be all that was required - hard to believe with a cam belt coming off I hear you say? I accept there is no way to know for sure without trying, but feel I was falsely reassured.

Well, surprise surprise the engine was not happy once the work was done, it has now been stripped down and basically needs replacing, with the work quoted circa £10,000!

The car is at 61,700 miles and was last serviced by dealer at around 50,000 last September. The only possible clue to any problem was that my coolant had dipped below the minimum about 1000 miles previously and I had added maybe 200mls (having never had to previously) - this was booked to be investigated but neither I nor the service receptionist thought it was significant (it may not have been, I do not know). [LESSON ONE - NEVER IGNORE LOSS OF COOLANT, HOWEVER SMALL!]

There had been no other warning lights, noises or obvious signs of overheating whatsoever.

Dealer says they have not seen this before given the age and mileage. They have also confirmed that the water pump is not routinely replaced, even at 108k cam belt change - should it therefore ever fail?

I have been in touch with Volvo UK, as has the dealer, and I await confirmation as to whether they will meet any or all of the cost. Dealer effectively asked today what I would be willing to pay, and I confirmed that my current position is that the pump must have had some inherent defect and the responsibility is therefore the manufacturers.

What are people's thoughts?

The £10k figure is an impossibility for me so I'd probably opt for a refurb - does anyone know someone reliable for such a job - and have a fight with Volvo.

I assume also that any replacement engine will lose me the benefit of the factory fitted Polestar upgrade (could this explain the early pump failure, I know there are not many about?) so will either have to pay further to repeat that or live with less oomph :-(

I would be pleased for any input, from customer or dealer perspective.

Thanks in anticipation.

[Clan]

Originally Posted by misterrich

Hi guys

I rarely post as I am generally smitten with my D5 Polestar and have had no problems with it...until now.

I was driving happily (but slowly) out of Birmingham last Thursday evening rush hour when I heard a fairly modest clunk and the car switched itself off in the second lane of 4 (you may have seen me as I was there for a full 45 minutes!).

AA rescued me (which meant Volvo assist will not provide a courtesy vehicle, but that's another story and probably known to many of you...) and discovered cam belt had worn through its housing and had effectively come off. AA guy thinks it was caused by a water pump failure which was probably longstanding given the type of damage.

Car was recovered to local dealer who suggested committing to replacing pump and belt (£700 odd) but that 90-95% sure that would be all that was required - hard to believe with a cam belt coming off I hear you say? I accept there is no way to know for sure without trying, but feel I was falsely reassured.

Well, surprise surprise the engine was not happy once the work was done, it has now been stripped down and basically needs replacing, with the work quoted circa £10,000!

The car is at 61,700 miles and was last serviced by dealer at around 50,000 last September. The only possible clue to any problem was that my coolant had dipped below the minimum about 1000 miles previously and I had added maybe 200mls (having never had to previously) - this was booked to be investigated but neither I nor the service receptionist thought it was significant (it may not have been, I do not know). [LESSON ONE - NEVER IGNORE LOSS OF COOLANT, HOWEVER SMALL!]

There had been no other warning lights, noises or obvious signs of overheating whatsoever.

Dealer says they have not seen this before given the age and mileage. They have also confirmed that the water pump is not routinely replaced, even at 108k cam belt change - should it therefore ever fail?

I have been in touch with Volvo UK, as has the dealer, and I await confirmation as to whether they will meet any or all of the cost. Dealer effectively asked today what I would be willing to pay, and I confirmed that my current position is that the pump must have had some inherent defect and the responsibility is therefore the manufacturers.

What are people's thoughts?

The £10k figure is an impossibility for me so I'd probably opt for a refurb - does anyone know someone reliable for such a job - and have a fight with Volvo.

I assume also that any replacement engine will lose me the benefit of the factory fitted Polestar upgrade (could this explain the early pump failure, I know there are not many about?) so will either have to pay further to repeat that or live with less oomph :-(

I would be pleased for any input, from customer or dealer perspective.

Thanks in anticipation.

very unfortunate , however I would be very very surprised indeed if the water pump had caused this, in fact I would be confident to say it didn't .. I would make very very sure you get an independent opinion on this .
What can happen is that the aux belt can break ,and tangle with the cambelt , this alone can rip the cambelt tensioner out of the block .. your aux belt should have been changed as part of the 54000 mile service , the crucial question is ,was it? Is the aux belt still on the pulley normally? If so then I suspect the cam belt tensioner failed , they should already know this if they have dismantled it ..
we need some more facts …

The polestar is locked into the Engine control unit and will work with a replacement engine . I wouldn't hesitate in fitting a good used engine , Depending on what kind of help you might get .
good luck

[misterrich]

Originally Posted by Clan

very unfortunate , however I would be very very surprised indeed if the water pump had caused this, in fact I would be confident to say it didn't .. I would make very very sure you get an independent opinion on this .
What can happen is that the aux belt can break ,and tangle with the cambelt , this alone can rip the cambelt tensioner out of the block .. your aux belt should have been changed as part of the 54000 mile service , the crucial question is ,was it? Is the aux belt still on the pulley normally? If so then I suspect the cam belt tensioner failed , they should already know this if they have dismantled it ..
we need some more facts …

The polestar is locked into the Engine control unit and will work with a replacement engine . I wouldn't hesitate in fitting a good used engine , Depending on what kind of help you might get .
good luck

Hi Clan

That is very interesting indeed - the AA guy initially came up with this hypothesis and not sure why he changed his mind. Presumably my local Volvo would have thought as you do?

I have the invoice from August 2015 (different dealer) under previous owner which states "54,000 mile service to manufacturer's latest specification - checklist attached". It looks like there was an oil and filter change, and new front pads with a cost of £445.76.

I can see no reference to an aux belt so the assumption must be that it was not done, right? Where can I find compelling evidence that this should have been done?

I shall be raising this with them tomorrow - presumably it "helps" my local dealer to point the finger elsewhere? Is there still any benefit in seeking an independent view as it has been taken to pieces?

Clan, if you are correct and Volvo cough up for the lot (still wishful thinking) I owe you big time!

Rich

[DTaylor]

Just for info - I purchased a 62 V60 2 years ago with full service history. I contacted Volvo to check if the cambelt had been replaced as it should have on the last service. They said not - it isn't included in the service, they only recommend it is replaced at a certain mileage but it is up to the person paying as to whether they want the belt changed or not.

Needless to say I took it to my local garage and had it done.

I purchased a 15 reg V60 last month - that goes in for Cambelt, Aux belt, water pump and tensions replacement tomorrow. Peace of mind for the next 3 years.

[misterrich]

Originally Posted by misterrich

Hi Clan

That is very interesting indeed - the AA guy initially came up with this hypothesis and not sure why he changed his mind. Presumably my local Volvo would have thought as you do?

I have the invoice from August 2015 (different dealer) under previous owner which states "54,000 mile service to manufacturer's latest specification - checklist attached". It looks like there was an oil and filter change, and new front pads with a cost of £445.76.

I can see no reference to an aux belt so the assumption must be that it was not done, right? Where can I find compelling evidence that this should have been done?

I shall be raising this with them tomorrow - presumably it "helps" my local dealer to point the finger elsewhere? Is there still any benefit in seeking an independent view as it has been taken to pieces?

Clan, if you are correct and Volvo cough up for the lot (still wishful thinking) I owe you big time!

Rich

Further to this I see that I had the auxiliaries belt replaced by my own dealer, free of charge, at the service in September 2017..? I didn't even know it had been done...or why for free

[S60RDesign]

That's gutting, I guess you could buy a similar S60 for that price.

In terms of goodwill, when I contacted Volvo UK earlier this month, they said the the dealers are authorised to offer this:

"Whilst ideally we would like all parts in our cars to last a lifetime, I regret this is not a guarantee us, nor any other manufacturer can offer. We therefore do have the 3 years 60,000 mile warranty in place to cover any manufacturing defects. However, as your vehicle is now out of this warranty period, we therefore cannot guarantee the lifetime of these parts.

Any financial support after this is deemed as goodwill. I can advise that goodwill is based solely off the age, mileage and service history of the vehicle. Our dealers are empowered to review goodwill and warranty decisions on our behalf, should they need to. They can then liaise with us in Customer Relations or our Warranty Department directly to discuss anything further."

[mordred1973]

have to admit the cambelt and aux belts concern me, my dealer has told me does need to be done until 6th annual service (or 108,000 miles, since I have the same engine as you in my XC60, a Polestar D5.)

Admittedly that service is due at the end of October this year, by which time I will be on give or take 105,000 miles, still concerns me a bit.

Asked my local garage if they could do the change with original Volvo parts, they said no as need a special locking tool for Volvo when changing the belt, which they don't have.

whilst posting however, Volvo do consider "good will", they paid more than half of my replacement auto gearbox when it failed at 75,000 miles....I was 18 months out of warranty at that point.

[kdst5]

I have a 2015 V70 with the D5 and as Clan says "aux belt should have been changed as part of the 54000 mile service" mine was although the mileage was only about 26,000 at 3 years old. I.E. At 3 years service or 54,000 mileage which ever is soonest.

Note that the cam belt is not due until something like 6th annual service or 108,000 miles.

There was also a problem with aux belt tensioner breaking and was changed under a recall I think (again Clan knows the details and there are threads on here where Clan explains that, just do a search to find them). However I believe that by 2015 which is my cars age this had been sorted but I think a 2012 car might have had the problem aux belt tensioner.

[Clan]

Originally Posted by misterrich

Further to this I see that I had the auxiliaries belt replaced by my own dealer, free of charge, at the service in September 2017..? I didn't even know it had been done...or why for free

If it was free it was probably the last recall for changing a hydraulic tensioner to a mechanical one , which involves drilling and tapping the block to take the "old" type mechanical tensioner all well and good as long as the thread was cut ok . The cause needs to be established first , you said the cambelt rode off the pulley grinding the casing ? was the aux belt in place ? If so and the block is damaged where the aux belt tensioner is fitted , it might be a faulty recall job which caused it, perhaps over tightening the securing screw .

[Ixion]

OP, sorry to hear of your problems. As others have said the Aux belt is done at 54,000 and 108,000 (when the cam-belt is done too).

When my cam-belt was changed last year (at 107,000) on my 62 plate at the dealers, they checked the water pump and confirmed it was working just fine - the dealer said they've never actually replaced a water-pump alongside a belt change (a VW thing apparently).

Was the aux belt changed in your 51,000 service?