Timing Belt replacement B234F

[pmcfadd]

Hello everyone,

I need some advice.
In the FAQ’s for Timing Belt replacement for the B234F Engine it is very clearly written “ If you have a B234 16- valve engine, you must maintain the entire timing end of the engine rigorously. This means new timing and balance belts and a new oil pump bolt every 50K miles”

My question is, Could I expect an official Volvo dealer to know that he has to replace the oil pump bolt when he replaced the belts.
My dealer did not, and now 1k later my engine is a right off.

Any advice would be appreciated

Pat.

[RollingThunder]

Hmm. A very grey area this one.

Anyone who knows anything about the B234F 16 valve engine knows that this bolt is a particular weakspot and is prone to failure unless changed regularly. However, I'm not sure whether it is listed as a service item on the service checklist, and as I'm at work I can't check VADIS to see if there are any service bulletins on it.

I think this is your problem - while its a known weakness, it may not be a specific checklist item, so the garage may claim that they've undertaken the job as per the sheet - but not as thoroughly as you and I would perhaps expect? Your argument is that you took the car to a main dealership to utilise their experience and they should know about this item, and should have changed it accordingly - or at least checked with you whether you wanted the work undertaken. If I was doing the job, I'd have replaced the bolt as a matter of course - the risk is simply too great and the effects catastrophic, as you've sadly found out.

As you are now car less and facing a substantial repair bill, I'd seek formal legal advice asap.

[pmcfadd]

Thanks,

I took your advice and have just come from a lawer.
Trying to explain something technical to a lawer is much the same as trying to explain to my wife how the VCR works.

Anyway to cut a long story short. He says I would be unlikely to get my car repaired. If I'm lucky I would get the insurance estimate of its worth (1991 945 GLE with 90K) but only if I can prove negligence.

It would help if I knew if there was a service bulletin on the problem.

regards
Patrick

[rogerthechorister]

This is not simple negligence. There is a contractual obligation. A contract for the supply of goods and services. There is an implied term that the services will be provided with reasonable care and skill. Print the FAQ (the relevant part). I think there is a similar section on the turbobricks FAQ too.

Next try to get hold of Volvo themselves to see if there is a service bulletin.

It is NOT on the standard volvo service schedule and it is NOT in the Haynes manual, not even as an item to be changed if the oil pump is removed.

However, the engine was damaged by the failure of an item (can you prove that?) they had removed and replaced in doing the contractual work - and there is a doctrine called "res ipsa loquitur" (literally "the thing speaks for itself").


Next issue - damages. Tort damages are designed to put you in the position as if the tort had NOT been committed, but contract damages are designed to put you in the position as if the contract HAD been performed.

However, you have to "mitigate" your loss. Maybe this would mean taking a replacement car or the money to get one (if less than the cost of engine repair, surely it only needs new valves and maybe pistons?) but there is a theoretical angle on this in that many textbooks assert that second hand cars are "unique goods" in that one is never the same, exactly, as another, and this is certainly the approach taken if a contract for the sale of a used car is broken by refusal to supply or refusal to accept. So it MAY be possible that the cost of repair is the proper measure of damage. It is a measure that has been applied (but only where the result would not be unreasonable) in relation to breaches of contract (including by breach of the contractual duty of care) relating to land - land being the classic unique item.



I bet they bottle if you fling a writ...

But before you do check your contents insurance and building insurance - they may have a section called "protecting your rights" and you may have been signed up to this without your realising (insurance companies do it all the time, at renewal) - so you MAY be able to fling the cost of litigating (if it is reasonable to bring the case) at insurers who will appoint their own solicitors, which will scare the garage much more.....

[RollingThunder]

I had a quick check on VADIS yesterday, and my initial findings were that there is no mention of the bolt I also couldn't find a service bulletin about it - BUT there are very few of these in VADIS so that doesn't mean that they don't exist.

Rogers reply sounds pretty good to me - he obviously has more legal knowledge than I do! One thing I would suggest though, and that is to go to a lawyer who knows the motor trade. A general practice solicitor won't have the industry knowledge and so won't be able to adequate fight your corner.

[rogerthechorister]

http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/VOLVO-Technica...QQcmdZViewItem

[pmcfadd]

One thing that I hadn’t mentioned is I live in Germany. I don’t know if the principles of the law are the same as in the UK.
Fortunately I do have legal insurance and have started the wheels rolling.
However I wasn’t impressed with the lawyer they sent me to.
The first step is to get the dealer to give me his explanation for the fault in writing.
He has already said that he didn't touch the bolt in question and wasn't aware that it was a critical item.
I have also been in touch with Volvo who say my problem is with the dealer.
When I contacted them first however I wasn’t aware of the reason for the failure. I will now get back to them, show them the FAC’s and ask them straight if there was a technical bulletin.
The way that I see it is that if there is a technical bulletin then the dealer should have known about it.
If there was no bulletin then I guess my problem is with Volvo.
As I mentioned before my car didn’t have high mileage, I am the only owner and had always been serviced by Volvo.
The bill for the service alone was €1500 = ₤1000 (Service + Timing belt + Fixing Leaking heater)

As I am without a car at the moment I am wondering if I should go ahead and have everything fixed. Then I could let the lawyers decide if there was a liability.

I think we are only talking about new valves and pistons but he is quoting about € 5000.
I haven’t inspected everything myself but I will do next week.
I’ m wondering if I could tackle the job myself. Can I do it in situ or do I need to remove the engine? The last engine I rebuilt was 30 years ago.

Thanks everyone for your advice.
I will keep you informed on my progress.

Regards

Patrick

[rogerthechorister]

German Law is different.

The EU is gradually approximating things and usually making a **** up of it.

There is a directive I need to check on to go further.

[rogerthechorister]

You should ask Volvo whether the dealer should have known to change the bolt.

A question for anyone here who has done the change - does that bolt have to come out and go back when changing the belt?

[rogerthechorister]

German Law is different.

The EU is gradually approximating things and usually making a **** up of it.

There is a directive I need to check on to go further and I can't find the expurgated thing.

I do know a couple of German lawyers, some more expensive than others, but you need one in the right district. Where in Germany are you?