XC90 Fault & Dealer conduct - what should I do next?

[Watsonmr]

Hi all,
My first posting here and looking for your advice on how to resolve a fault.

I have a 2010 xc90 185 BHP Manual drive 80k miles. Regularly serviced, we've driven the last 40k miles. The car had been working fine then one morning after 2-3 miles it completely cut out as if someone had turned off the ignition. After a while of sitting there, the engine would turn over but not fire. After a little longer it started and we limped a mile to home, but as soon as we put our foot down it would stall again. Once the engine was left for a while it would then start. I drove it a short distance and it cut out again but would not start at all, so I was recovered to our local main dealer. That was 7 weeks ago and the car is still there.
The main dealer first replaced the fuel filter, the low pressure fuel pump, the a fuel pressure sensor, then the CEM, then the fuel pressure regulator, and now they are telling me I need to also buy a new ECU. Every time they replace something it does not resolve the fault. The bill for labour and parts is around £3k-£4k, with the dealer telling me they'll work something out for the labour, but I am liable for the parts at the very least.

So my questions are this; has the main dealer acted fairly in a) consistently wrongly diagnosing the fault and then expecting me to pay for the part they wrongly diagnose, with this ECU likely to be another expensive addition to the bill, even if the fault is a tricky one? Do I have any real choice? How can I challenge their diagnosis or recommendations?

There's clearly something very dodgy going on, such as an electrical fault of some connections breaking down when they heat up [their latest thinking on the ECU is that when they heat it up and tap it, the engine stops; when they cool it, the engine starts again]. I feel like the garage has me over a barrel and there is nothing I can do but pay out more money if every I want to see my car again?

Do I have any option?

Mark

Guildford

[skippyfox]

Had something very similar to that on my 14 plate 200bhp xc90. Total shut down, then limp mode home, Turned out to be a lamda sensor and the DPF being clogged up. Only a thought, but it seems to me the dealer as really Bull f@@@ed you on this one. best of luck getting it sorted.

[Watsonmr]

Thanks Skippyfox.
The dpf is reporting fault codes of being clogged but the dealer is saying they can't force a regeneration until the car is running properly.
We'd only driven 200 miles the w/e before, pulling a caravan, so ample time for the dpf to have naturally regenerated anyway. But definitely feeling bull f@@@ed, as you say.

[Tannaton]

Oh what a horrible story.... it’s vey, very rare that we hear stories as bad as that on here.

My personal view is that sometimes you can get a very elaborate fault that means parts have been replaced that need not have - however the service you get from a main dealer (for which you pay a premium) should protect you from that. I see no reason why you should pay for parts that were clearly not needed, if the DPF is clogged then it will never run well so aiming to do a regen is pointless - it needs to come off and be cleaned or replaced.

Suggest you get some legal advice on the sale of goods and services act... do you have legal services on your house insurance?

[Watsonmr]

Tannaton, That's a really good point - I do have Legal insurance. I'll give them a call tomorrow to get some advice. Good idea!!!

[XC90Mk1]

I would ask the dealership to provide you with the list of fault codes and then post up back here. Chances are it’s happened to others on here. I would also find out what Volvo are going to charge you, I don’t know what the cem is that you refer to but the other items, fuel filter etc I would have thought would be pretty cheap, how that runs to over a grand I don’t know.

[Tannaton]

Originally Posted by Watsonmr

Tannaton, That's a really good point - I do have Legal insurance. I'll give them a call tomorrow to get some advice. Good idea!!!

Remember that the goods and services you are buying from them must be of "merchantable quality". The services include the diagnostic work which identified the parts they replaced. If this was flawed, I don't see why you should pay for the parts as well? (The Sales of Goods Act has been largely superseded but the principles of the current consumer protection legislation are broadly the same).

The problem with some mechanics at some dealers these days is they are so used to following the manufacturers flowcharts and swimlanes for fault finding they don't think or attempt to work out for themselves what is going on, so when you get an intermittent or unusual fault which may be a combination of 2 or more minor faults - they're hopelessly lost.

[Clan]

Originally Posted by Watsonmr

Hi all,
My first posting here and looking for your advice on how to resolve a fault.

I have a 2010 xc90 185 BHP Manual drive 80k miles. Regularly serviced, we've driven the last 40k miles. The car had been working fine then one morning after 2-3 miles it completely cut out as if someone had turned off the ignition. After a while of sitting there, the engine would turn over but not fire. After a little longer it started and we limped a mile to home, but as soon as we put our foot down it would stall again. Once the engine was left for a while it would then start. I drove it a short distance and it cut out again but would not start at all, so I was recovered to our local main dealer. That was 7 weeks ago and the car is still there.
The main dealer first replaced the fuel filter, the low pressure fuel pump, the a fuel pressure sensor, then the CEM, then the fuel pressure regulator, and now they are telling me I need to also buy a new ECU. Every time they replace something it does not resolve the fault. The bill for labour and parts is around £3k-£4k, with the dealer telling me they'll work something out for the labour, but I am liable for the parts at the very least.

So my questions are this; has the main dealer acted fairly in a) consistently wrongly diagnosing the fault and then expecting me to pay for the part they wrongly diagnose, with this ECU likely to be another expensive addition to the bill, even if the fault is a tricky one? Do I have any real choice? How can I challenge their diagnosis or recommendations?

There's clearly something very dodgy going on, such as an electrical fault of some connections breaking down when they heat up [their latest thinking on the ECU is that when they heat it up and tap it, the engine stops; when they cool it, the engine starts again]. I feel like the garage has me over a barrel and there is nothing I can do but pay out more money if every I want to see my car again?

Do I have any option?

Mark

Guildford

Obviously it isn't always straightforward sorting these kinds of problems out , But it is pretty obvious they have been guessing rather than diagnosing , If they had followed the normal professional methods using the volvo tools and adapters provided for monitoring circuits and signals it would have cost a lot less in the longer labour times than replacing things left right and centre. You don't change something unless you can prove it is faulty . They can't have tested it properly in between changing things can they ...I would contest the whole job or get a third part in the trade to do it for you . Have you paid out anything yet I wonder? you don't normally until its fixed .. ?

[Watsonmr]

Thanks for the ongoing advice and comments. they are really helpful. We are definitely now pursuing the legal angle. We haven't paid yet, but they have made clear that they expect us to apy the parts and they'll then reduce the labour and if I don't agree then they'll sting me on the labour instead.

The CEM is an ECU for the fuel supply side, amongst other things. There are multiple types of ECU on the vehicle I'm led to understand. They diagnosed that the CEM wasn't sending a control voltage to the low pressure fuel pump so it was clearly faulty. I then sent my CEM to VolvoDiagnostics who could not find a fault, but I bought a reconditioned one off them (£340) to be sure and to get back on the road. Once fitted, the garage said there was still no control voltage to the pump so this reconditioned unit was faulty and I should buy a new one from them (£940). That didn't work either... So now they are saying I need another ECU type device that I should pay for, I've finally decided I have to find the time to challenge and investigate things further.

[Watsonmr]

Originally Posted by Clan

... it is pretty obvious they have been guessing rather than diagnosing ... You don't change something unless you can prove it is faulty .

Quite. exactly my thoughts. and as Tannaton says, I do wonder how much they are simply following flow charts and not engaging brain.