240 General: - Camshaft seizure - Page 2

john850kershaw · Apr 29th, 2019, 21:26

I have seen these camshafts seize, i have worked on these cars for 36 years and if the oil is not changed at regular intervals the oil clogs up the oil way to the camshaft, the oil comes up the second head bolt on the exhaust manifold side and feeds the camshaft bearings, i have removed camshafts cleaned the bearing faces with wet and dry, removed the head bolt and cleaned, then remove the 2 plugs on the same side of the head as the head bolt and sent a rod down it getting the blockage removed, if my memory is correct the 2 plugs are 10mm headed, once the blockage is clear and the timing belt removed you can try and spin the sprocket that turns the distributor as fast as you can and see if oil comes up the oil ways to the head camshaft bearings, if that happens then just put it back together and change oil and filter and restart, get engine hot and run for a couple of weeks and change oil and filter again when engine is hot.

Stephen Edwin · Apr 30th, 2019, 04:00

To all who have given advice re camshaft seizure, thank you. It is all serious informative. I hope I never need the advice but I do like to learn.

I have thought for a very long time that older good quality cars are likely to be very well maintained by enthusiasts, but are otherwise in danger of inadequate maintenance as they age because later owners are unlikely to have the funds that original owners had. I am not well heeled myself.

But it puzzles me why people buy a motor car and then fail to even have oil and filter changes done. Is life.

To be controversial, who me? This makes a nonsense of older cars getting exemption from MOT .... what else do some later owners neglect?

.

CACTUSTWO · Apr 30th, 2019, 08:20

John850 & Clifford -
Thanks this is really useful information. I'll be heading to my trusted garage armed with your advice.

Stephen-
In this particular case I bought the car off an enthusiast who gave me a stack of maintenance receipts. I've not done 1000 miles in the car since purchasing it so was planning to take it for a full service in June. I've learnt the hard way!

Thanks for everyone's comments on this post.

Bob Meadows · Apr 30th, 2019, 11:30

I suppose that the crankcase venting system will also point to the condition / service of the engine so all part of regular maintenance- you can still get flushing oils or additives to clean the engine internals- once done then you are back to a regular schedule of filter/oil changes.
Good Luck & enjoy the car!
Bob.

Clifford Pope · Apr 30th, 2019, 15:35

John Kershaw's advice sounds really useful - I for one had no idea how the oil reached the camshaft.

Presumably the bolt must pass through an oil gallery, oil flowing up from below and then out somewhere through a hole at the side of the bolt?
Does that mean the top of the bolt has to be oil-tight - some kind of seal, or just metal to metal, relying on the flange on the bolt head?

I can't identify the two plugs he mentions - are these in the head - next to the 2nd bearing, or outside the cam chamber by the exhaust?
Are all engines the same in this design? It just occured to me that if access is as simple as this it would be easy to check an engine just by removing a plug and giving the starter a spin to see if oil flowed out.

Stephen Edwin · Apr 30th, 2019, 16:41

Cactus. It sounds as if your engine has had regular maintenance and has just been unlucky. I suppose that's life init.

CACTUSTWO · May 3rd, 2019, 11:42

Managed to get the cover off today and take a few photos of the condition of the cam.
Pic attached (hopefully)

CACTUSTWO · May 3rd, 2019, 12:07

Couple more pics

Bugjam1999 · May 3rd, 2019, 22:36

Hard to tell on the photos but the cam lobes don’t look particularly damaged- perhaps someone else has an opinion?

The question really though is what damage is hiding under the cam bearing caps- if the top end was starved of oil, instead of there being a film of oil between the cam and the head/bearing cap the two would have been directly touching.

Can you take one off, turn it the other way up and take another photo, that shows the inside of the bearing cap and the surface of the cam it was covering?

Cheers

mocambique-amazone · May 4th, 2019, 10:16

Not enough oil into the head. Blocked oil channel , John wrote about this.
The lobes won't block the cam, even worn out totally.
Remove the caps and post pics from the cam bearings. Both parts, head and camshaft.
Oil change longer overdone on this engine.
Fixable nevertheless
Good luck, Kay

Apr 30th, 2019, 04:00	#12
Stephen Edwin Premier Member Last Online: Oct 26th, 2023 20:42 Join Date: Jun 2010 Location: Thurrock	To all who have given advice re camshaft seizure, thank you. It is all serious informative. I hope I never need the advice but I do like to learn. I have thought for a very long time that older good quality cars are likely to be very well maintained by enthusiasts, but are otherwise in danger of inadequate maintenance as they age because later owners are unlikely to have the funds that original owners had. I am not well heeled myself. But it puzzles me why people buy a motor car and then fail to even have oil and filter changes done. Is life. To be controversial, who me? This makes a nonsense of older cars getting exemption from MOT .... what else do some later owners neglect? . Last edited by Stephen Edwin; Apr 30th, 2019 at 04:37.

Apr 29th, 2019, 21:26	#11
john850kershaw New Member Last Online: Apr 8th, 2023 14:17 Join Date: May 2017 Location: Four Crosses	I have seen these camshafts seize, i have worked on these cars for 36 years and if the oil is not changed at regular intervals the oil clogs up the oil way to the camshaft, the oil comes up the second head bolt on the exhaust manifold side and feeds the camshaft bearings, i have removed camshafts cleaned the bearing faces with wet and dry, removed the head bolt and cleaned, then remove the 2 plugs on the same side of the head as the head bolt and sent a rod down it getting the blockage removed, if my memory is correct the 2 plugs are 10mm headed, once the blockage is clear and the timing belt removed you can try and spin the sprocket that turns the distributor as fast as you can and see if oil comes up the oil ways to the head camshaft bearings, if that happens then just put it back together and change oil and filter and restart, get engine hot and run for a couple of weeks and change oil and filter again when engine is hot.

Apr 30th, 2019, 08:20	#13
CACTUSTWO New Member Last Online: Aug 10th, 2020 20:46 Join Date: Apr 2019 Location: London	John850 & Clifford - Thanks this is really useful information. I'll be heading to my trusted garage armed with your advice. Stephen- In this particular case I bought the car off an enthusiast who gave me a stack of maintenance receipts. I've not done 1000 miles in the car since purchasing it so was planning to take it for a full service in June. I've learnt the hard way! Thanks for everyone's comments on this post.

Apr 30th, 2019, 11:30	#14
Bob Meadows Premier Member Last Online: Yesterday 19:14 Join Date: Sep 2017 Location: STANDISH LANCASHIRE	I suppose that the crankcase venting system will also point to the condition / service of the engine so all part of regular maintenance- you can still get flushing oils or additives to clean the engine internals- once done then you are back to a regular schedule of filter/oil changes. Good Luck & enjoy the car! Bob.

Apr 30th, 2019, 15:35	#15
Clifford Pope Not an expert but ... Last Online: Yesterday 17:48 Join Date: Dec 2001 Location: Boncath	John Kershaw's advice sounds really useful - I for one had no idea how the oil reached the camshaft. Presumably the bolt must pass through an oil gallery, oil flowing up from below and then out somewhere through a hole at the side of the bolt? Does that mean the top of the bolt has to be oil-tight - some kind of seal, or just metal to metal, relying on the flange on the bolt head? I can't identify the two plugs he mentions - are these in the head - next to the 2nd bearing, or outside the cam chamber by the exhaust? Are all engines the same in this design? It just occured to me that if access is as simple as this it would be easy to check an engine just by removing a plug and giving the starter a spin to see if oil flowed out.

Apr 30th, 2019, 16:41	#16
Stephen Edwin Premier Member Last Online: Oct 26th, 2023 20:42 Join Date: Jun 2010 Location: Thurrock	Cactus. It sounds as if your engine has had regular maintenance and has just been unlucky. I suppose that's life init.

May 3rd, 2019, 22:36	#19
Bugjam1999 Master Member Last Online: Yesterday 13:54 Join Date: Nov 2012 Location: London and Cambridge	Hard to tell on the photos but the cam lobes don’t look particularly damaged- perhaps someone else has an opinion? The question really though is what damage is hiding under the cam bearing caps- if the top end was starved of oil, instead of there being a film of oil between the cam and the head/bearing cap the two would have been directly touching. Can you take one off, turn it the other way up and take another photo, that shows the inside of the bearing cap and the surface of the cam it was covering? Cheers

May 4th, 2019, 10:16	#20
mocambique-amazone Master Member Last Online: Jan 24th, 2022 17:08 Join Date: Nov 2008 Location: small village in the north of Germany	Not enough oil into the head. Blocked oil channel , John wrote about this. The lobes won't block the cam, even worn out totally. Remove the caps and post pics from the cam bearings. Both parts, head and camshaft. Oil change longer overdone on this engine. Fixable nevertheless Good luck, Kay

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