Volvo Community Forum. The Forums of the Volvo Owners Club

Forum Rules Volvo Owners Club About VOC Volvo Gallery Links Volvo History Volvo Press
Go Back   Volvo Owners Club Forum > "Technical Topics" > S80 '98-'06 / S60 '00-'09 / V70 & XC70 '00-'07 General

Notices

S80 '98-'06 / S60 '00-'09 / V70 & XC70 '00-'07 General Forum for the P2-platform S60 / V70 / XC70 / S80 models

Information
  • VOC Members: There is no login facility using your VOC membership number or the details from page 3 of the club magazine. You need to register in the normal way
  • AOL Customers: Make sure you check the 'Remember me' check box otherwise the AOL system may log you out during the session. This is a known issue with AOL.
  • AOL, Yahoo and Plus.net users. Forum owners such as us are finding that AOL, Yahoo and Plus.net are blocking a lot of email generated from forums. This may mean your registration activation and other emails will not get to you, or they may appear in your spam mailbox

Thread Informations

XC70 2001 Dead cluster and dead climate control

Views : 1351

Replies : 8

Users Viewing This Thread :  

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old Jan 16th, 2020, 11:56   #1
Brit In Norway
Brit In Norway
 

Last Online: Sep 7th, 2020 06:44
Join Date: Jan 2020
Location: Drammen
Cool XC70 2001 Dead cluster and dead climate control

Hi guys. A Brit working on the top of a snow covered hill in Norway, running with spiked winter tyres for the snow until May, and I have a dead cluster, and a dead climate control unit (also no illumination to the automatic gear shift position). It was a sudden problem, and not intermittent. They all died without warning, and have remained dead.

It's a 2001 XC running on petrol with an LPG system installed. It's done 410000 km and I'm struggling to find a wiring diagram.
I've checked the fuses in the side wall of the dashboard by the drivers seat. All fuses are ok, but some have no power to the fuses.
The ones with no power are:
Fuse 7 front heated seats
Fuse 8 front heated seats
Fuse 24 climate control / instrument clusters/ power seat driver
Fuse 26 climate control fan

The fuse 23 for the light switch /climate control module OBD steering wheel modules has power.
The fuse 32 for the central electronic module / ECPS/courtesy lamps /glove box lamp, has power.

Everything else on the car is working ok. Car runs fine. I'm hoping that I can find a bad ground or connector that would affect the power to those fuses, and hopefully it isn't a damaged module. The cost of parts here is beyond belief !

I've tried disconnecting the battery and contacting the positive and negative cables for 30 seconds, but still no joy. I've tried turning the car on and off 5 times too.
I've stripped the ignition switch to make sure all f the contacts were clean, and getting power, but the diagram I used was for a 2007 model :-)

Stuck on this hill on a long winter working outside on the car isn't my best experience and not having the warm air to clear the screen is a bit frustrating. I'm managing to keep to the speed limits by using a sat nav plugged into the cigarette lighter power socket :-) and at least the radio works fine (if they didn't keep playing abba songs :-)

Any advice you can give (not relating to changing the radio station) would be truly appreciated. I'm not sure if there is a relay or fuse that gives power to those fuses which are dead ? I did find a wire hanging down by the accelerator peddle, which runs from behind the steering column console to the fuse box where those dead fuses were located, and wonder if that could have been damaged?

Thanks in advance for your help.

Last edited by Brit In Norway; Jan 16th, 2020 at 11:58. Reason: Typo
Brit In Norway is offline   Reply With Quote
Old Jan 16th, 2020, 16:04   #2
oragex
Premier Member
 
oragex's Avatar
 

Last Online: Jul 26th, 2021 22:24
Join Date: Jun 2013
Location: Coldnada
Default

I believe both are related to the CEM.. does the battery keep a good charge ? (I would disconnect it, let is sit 30min-1h then measure at the posts)
__________________
Several Volvo Repair Videos https://www.youtube.com/playlist?lis...ECTts0FSVSOT_c
oragex is offline   Reply With Quote
Old Jan 17th, 2020, 13:38   #3
Brit In Norway
Brit In Norway
 

Last Online: Sep 7th, 2020 06:44
Join Date: Jan 2020
Location: Drammen
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by oragex View Post
I believe both are related to the CEM.. does the battery keep a good charge ? (I would disconnect it, let is sit 30min-1h then measure at the posts)
Thanks for your help. The battery was new last year, but I've checked it and got the following results (seems ok to me, but I'm no autoelectrcian).

Voltage with battery connected after standing for 24 hours without the engine running and key out.
11.79 volts. May seem low but I had been checking fuses the previous day without running the engine.

With the engine running it was giving 14.1volts. After 5 minutes this decreased to 13.98 volts with the engine running. When I turned the engine off after that 5 minutes, it had increased to 12.73. (from 11.79 volts)
With the battery disconnected it was 12.67 volts.
After leaving the battery disconnected for 1 hour it was 12.42 volts (down from 12.67 volts)
Brit In Norway is offline   Reply With Quote
Old Jan 17th, 2020, 15:09   #4
oragex
Premier Member
 
oragex's Avatar
 

Last Online: Jul 26th, 2021 22:24
Join Date: Jun 2013
Location: Coldnada
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Brit In Norway View Post
Thanks for your help. The battery was new last year, but I've checked it and got the following results (seems ok to me, but I'm no autoelectrcian).

Voltage with battery connected after standing for 24 hours without the engine running and key out.
11.79 volts. May seem low but I had been checking fuses the previous day without running the engine.

With the engine running it was giving 14.1volts. After 5 minutes this decreased to 13.98 volts with the engine running. When I turned the engine off after that 5 minutes, it had increased to 12.73. (from 11.79 volts)
With the battery disconnected it was 12.67 volts.
After leaving the battery disconnected for 1 hour it was 12.42 volts (down from 12.67 volts)

Just my take on this (I'm not necessarily right). When the battery is tested with the engine off, if it's still connected, it's not going to be a useful reading because there may still be a computer running or even just a trunk light, and this drops the battery voltage significantly.

For the measures with the battery disconnected, the battery voltage will start dropping after the car was driven, until it stabilizes to its real charge. So the actual charge would be that measured a good moment after disconnecting it. At 12.40v this means the battery is only about 60-70% charged. A new battery would have about 12.7v, an almost fully discharged one, around 12.0v (these values increase and decrease a little with the temperature).

There are a few reasons the battery is not fully charged. Possible the car was driven too gently for several short distances - usually less probable. Your alternator puts out 14.1v which normally should be higher when the battery is this discharged. For a battery at 70-80%, the alternator should put out its maximum voltage, around 14.6v or so. It is also possible some power cables or grounds are not in good condition or have some cracks: near the alternator, near the fuse box inside the engine bay (right near the ABS unit). Another possibility is the battery has internal damage and is no longer accepting a full charge, which may force the alternator to give a lower charging voltage. Ideally the alternator charge is to be measured on a new battery. Finally, what usually damages a battery is two things: poor alternator charging, or overnight current drain (this causes the battery to have many charging-discharging cycles which can damage a new battery in a few months). I would first try to check if there's a current drain: it's fairly simple, but need a voltmeter with a 10Amp socket (usually it will have three sockets). Leave the car unlocked. Disconnect the - at the battery, put the voltmeter on the 10Amp socket and set it on the 10A direct current (straight line above), connect the voltmeter between the 'neg' battery post and between the disconnected battery cable with a tape and wait exactly 10 minutes after connecting it - at sharp 10 min all car computers will go to sleep. At that moment see what the numbers are: if they are small, switch to a smaller scale (20mA) : if you see 0.01 or 0.02 it's fine, 0.04 or 0.05 there may be a current drain.
__________________
Several Volvo Repair Videos https://www.youtube.com/playlist?lis...ECTts0FSVSOT_c
oragex is offline   Reply With Quote
Old Jan 17th, 2020, 15:25   #5
cheshired5
Premier Member
 

Last Online: Dec 26th, 2021 14:42
Join Date: Dec 2013
Location: Crewe
Default

The battery doesn't sound like the greatest so what does the voltage drop to during cranking?
Low system voltage can create multiple problems but I doubt even a bad battery is responsible for all of your problems. It would still need charging or even changing though.

Your model year is also prone to failing DIMs (the instrument cluster) which can be fixed cheaply by a guy in the UK. The DIM is also intertwined with a lot of systems so could be a possible cause.

The earliest wiring diagram I have available is from 2005 which would be a facelift so could potentially lead you astray as a lot of electrical stuff changed in the mid 2000s.
__________________
2002 S60 SE D5 Manual
209000 miles
cheshired5 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old Jan 21st, 2020, 14:58   #6
Brit In Norway
Brit In Norway
 

Last Online: Sep 7th, 2020 06:44
Join Date: Jan 2020
Location: Drammen
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by oragex View Post
Just my take on this (I'm not necessarily right). When the battery is tested with the engine off, if it's still connected, it's not going to be a useful reading because there may still be a computer running or even just a trunk light, and this drops the battery voltage significantly.

For the measures with the battery disconnected, the battery voltage will start dropping after the car was driven, until it stabilizes to its real charge. So the actual charge would be that measured a good moment after disconnecting it. At 12.40v this means the battery is only about 60-70% charged. A new battery would have about 12.7v, an almost fully discharged one, around 12.0v (these values increase and decrease a little with the temperature).

There are a few reasons the battery is not fully charged. Possible the car was driven too gently for several short distances - usually less probable. Your alternator puts out 14.1v which normally should be higher when the battery is this discharged. For a battery at 70-80%, the alternator should put out its maximum voltage, around 14.6v or so. It is also possible some power cables or grounds are not in good condition or have some cracks: near the alternator, near the fuse box inside the engine bay (right near the ABS unit). Another possibility is the battery has internal damage and is no longer accepting a full charge, which may force the alternator to give a lower charging voltage. Ideally the alternator charge is to be measured on a new battery. Finally, what usually damages a battery is two things: poor alternator charging, or overnight current drain (this causes the battery to have many charging-discharging cycles which can damage a new battery in a few months). I would first try to check if there's a current drain: it's fairly simple, but need a voltmeter with a 10Amp socket (usually it will have three sockets). Leave the car unlocked. Disconnect the - at the battery, put the voltmeter on the 10Amp socket and set it on the 10A direct current (straight line above), connect the voltmeter between the 'neg' battery post and between the disconnected battery cable with a tape and wait exactly 10 minutes after connecting it - at sharp 10 min all car computers will go to sleep. At that moment see what the numbers are: if they are small, switch to a smaller scale (20mA) : if you see 0.01 or 0.02 it's fine, 0.04 or 0.05 there may be a current drain.
Cheers for the info. The car only runs 2km max each day, so rarely any long trips with the exception of a 400km trip a few weeks ago. So I guess this would figure into the low readings. I've just had the battery disconnected for 3 days whilst I found time to resolder all of the connections in the DIM. After 3 days it started instantly. (Resolder of the DIM made zero difference)
Brit In Norway is offline   Reply With Quote
Old Jan 21st, 2020, 15:05   #7
Brit In Norway
Brit In Norway
 

Last Online: Sep 7th, 2020 06:44
Join Date: Jan 2020
Location: Drammen
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by cheshired5 View Post
The battery doesn't sound like the greatest so what does the voltage drop to during cranking?
Low system voltage can create multiple problems but I doubt even a bad battery is responsible for all of your problems. It would still need charging or even changing though.

Your model year is also prone to failing DIMs (the instrument cluster) which can be fixed cheaply by a guy in the UK. The DIM is also intertwined with a lot of systems so could be a possible cause.

The earliest wiring diagram I have available is from 2005 which would be a facelift so could potentially lead you astray as a lot of electrical stuff changed in the mid 2000s.
Cheers for the info. The car only runs 2km max each day, so rarely any long trips with the exception of a 400km trip a few weeks ago. So I guess this would figure into the low readings. I've just had the battery disconnected for 3 days whilst I found time to resolder all of the connections in the DIM. After 3 days it started instantly. (Resolder of the DIM made zero difference).
I'm hesitant to put a used DIM in, and then find the problem is still there. I'm thinking of popping the Central electrical module out to see if there is anything to be found there.

My partner told me that when she was driving my car and the problem occured, she had trouble with the ignition key (I believe she didn't have it in park, when she tried to start the car) the only other thing she said happened, was having lots of gear on the front passenger seat and in the football, and having to do an emergency stop when a guy pulled out in front of her. Then she noticed everything was dead (cluster and climate controls) but she can't remember if it was dead when she tried to start the car earlier without the gear in the park position. (Yes she is blond ;-) )
Brit In Norway is offline   Reply With Quote
Old Jan 24th, 2020, 19:17   #8
pierremcalpine
Premier Member
 
pierremcalpine's Avatar
 

Last Online: Jan 3rd, 2024 15:43
Join Date: Feb 2012
Location: Toronto Canada
Default

How good are you with interpreting wiring diagrams? I could try to gather up the related diagrams from Volvo VIDA and email to you but I have to warn you, they are not the most user friendly diagrams!!!
__________________
2003 V40 1.9T B4204T4, 197,000miles (sold but alive!), 2004 S60 2.5T, 160,000miles, 2010 V70 3.2, 125,000miles, 2002 V70XC 2.4, 175,000miles

Click here for my x40 and V70 P3 repair guides
pierremcalpine is offline   Reply With Quote
The Following User Says Thank You to pierremcalpine For This Useful Post:
Old Jan 24th, 2020, 20:34   #9
Brit In Norway
Brit In Norway
 

Last Online: Sep 7th, 2020 06:44
Join Date: Jan 2020
Location: Drammen
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by pierremcalpine View Post
How good are you with interpreting wiring diagrams? I could try to gather up the related diagrams from Volvo VIDA and email to you but I have to warn you, they are not the most user friendly diagrams!!!
Wow, that would be fantastic. I can work my way through some wiring diagrams, as I'm used to cigarette packet packet sketch standard diagrams from past coworkers and some more "complex" machine wiring diagrams from my industrial experience. But yes, they seem to like making car wiring and component wiring diagrams pretty tough to follow. But if you made able to obtain some, I'll try to decipher the trail and see what I can come up with. I'll post any successes and failures I have :-)

The snow is melting quite fast up here on the hill, so it's a lot more comfortable working on a sheet of insulation foam than kneeling in the snow :-)

If you can get any, you can send them to me at protectillian@gmail.com

Thanks again in advance :-)

Pete
Brit In Norway is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Tags
dead ccm, dead cluster, dead dim, no power ccm or dim


Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT +1. The time now is 09:28.


Powered by vBulletin
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.