Volvo Community Forum. The Forums of the Volvo Owners Club

Forum Rules Volvo Owners Club About VOC Volvo Gallery Links Volvo History Volvo Press
Go Back   Volvo Owners Club Forum > "Technical Topics" > 700/900 Series General

Notices

700/900 Series General Forum for the Volvo 740, 760, 780, 940, 960 & S/V90 cars

Information
  • VOC Members: There is no login facility using your VOC membership number or the details from page 3 of the club magazine. You need to register in the normal way
  • AOL Customers: Make sure you check the 'Remember me' check box otherwise the AOL system may log you out during the session. This is a known issue with AOL.
  • AOL, Yahoo and Plus.net users. Forum owners such as us are finding that AOL, Yahoo and Plus.net are blocking a lot of email generated from forums. This may mean your registration activation and other emails will not get to you, or they may appear in your spam mailbox

Thread Informations

97 s90 no transponder key

Views : 1979

Replies : 20

Users Viewing This Thread :  

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old Nov 11th, 2019, 15:33   #11
loki_the_glt
Torquemeister
 
loki_the_glt's Avatar
 

Last Online: Mar 27th, 2024 15:56
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Asgard, Cheshire
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Stalledvolvos90 View Post
That will be the first thing I check tomorrow. If a work around is do-able I’d love to save some money and enjoy the car! How tough are these workarounds?
Not difficult - and quick.
__________________
loki_the_glt - Skipper of the Exxon Valdez, driver of Sweden's finest sporting saloon - and pining for another Slant-4.

loki_the_glt is offline   Reply With Quote
The Following 2 Users Say Thank You to loki_the_glt For This Useful Post:
Old Nov 12th, 2019, 00:58   #12
TonyS9
Premier Member
 

Last Online: Mar 4th, 2024 00:49
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: Holywood
Default

There is no work around for the RFID immobiliser, other than replacing the ECU and reader module or ECU chip. Its only on cars 96 on.

The alarm/immobiliser is also used at the same time and is easy to work around, guard 1 or guard 2.

The Key chip immobiliser is completely independant of the alarm/immbiliser, its always armed when the engine is switched off. It requires modules to talk and authorise the fuel computer to run the engine. Am I missing something?
TonyS9 is offline   Reply With Quote
The Following User Says Thank You to TonyS9 For This Useful Post:
Old Nov 12th, 2019, 12:41   #13
Rversteeg
Master Member
 

Last Online: Yesterday 16:59
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Amersfoort (NL)
Default Immobilizer

The immobilizer is not actually armed when the engine is switched off.
As soon as the engine is started, the fuel ECU sends a digital signal to the immo module. If the immo module recognises the RFID key, the module sends a signal back to the fuel ECU and the ECU will authorize the fuel pump to run.
If there is no signal returned, the engine will stall within one or two seconds with the lambda light illuminated all the time. Upon a second start attempt the engine will not even pick up anymore.

There is no way of bypassing this, as a bypass should actively respond to the fuel ECU.
Easiest is to find an RFID key with corresponding immo module, as these are the only two items that are paired. Tape the RFID key somewhere close to the antenna ring around the ignition barrel and replace the original immo module. This way you can use a simple, non RFID key for opening doors and starting.
Rversteeg is offline   Reply With Quote
The Following 2 Users Say Thank You to Rversteeg For This Useful Post:
Old Nov 13th, 2019, 00:43   #14
TonyS9
Premier Member
 

Last Online: Mar 4th, 2024 00:49
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: Holywood
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Rversteeg View Post
The immobilizer is not actually armed when the engine is switched off.
As soon as the engine is started, the fuel ECU sends a digital signal to the immo module. If the immo module recognises the RFID key, the module sends a signal back to the fuel ECU and the ECU will authorize the fuel pump to run.
If there is no signal returned, the engine will stall within one or two seconds with the lambda light illuminated all the time. Upon a second start attempt the engine will not even pick up anymore.

There is no way of bypassing this, as a bypass should actively respond to the fuel ECU.
Easiest is to find an RFID key with corresponding immo module, as these are the only two items that are paired. Tape the RFID key somewhere close to the antenna ring around the ignition barrel and replace the original immo module. This way you can use a simple, non RFID key for opening doors and starting.
I agree on the temporary start, but I'm calling that immobilised.

When it is armed then? My understanding is that for fail safe reasons it stay unarmed once the engine starts (or once the ignition is on and the key is recognised).

I found it wasn't transplantable with another ECU from the same year, as stated in the Volvo manual they are coded together for life. You can transplant them to an older ECU, but it doesn't immobilise the engine.

If you gonna buy a immobiliser unit and tape up the RFID chip to it, you may aswell not bother and just chip the ECU.
TonyS9 is offline   Reply With Quote
The Following User Says Thank You to TonyS9 For This Useful Post:
Old Nov 13th, 2019, 13:42   #15
Rversteeg
Master Member
 

Last Online: Yesterday 16:59
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Amersfoort (NL)
Default Paired with ECU

I know that the Volvo Manual states that ECU and immo-unit are coded together, but when I had an intermittent immo-problem, I have exchanged the immo-module + key without a problem. But I agree, a reprogrammed chip without immo-function is just as easy.
Rversteeg is offline   Reply With Quote
The Following 2 Users Say Thank You to Rversteeg For This Useful Post:
Old Nov 18th, 2019, 18:24   #16
martin calva
Senior Member
 
martin calva's Avatar
 

Last Online: Feb 8th, 2024 22:33
Join Date: Apr 2015
Location: Falaise
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Stalledvolvos90 View Post
Hey I actually do not have anything but a cut key that unlocks everything but the trunk at the moment. I’m keeping on with getting it sorted.
Added after posting: I just re-read the title of the thread and I see that you do not have a transponder key, so the following is probably of no use to you. I'll leave it just in case it might be of some use at some stage.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Can you start the car with the cut key? If so, it has the transponder chip in it and it can be cloned for a modest price. However, it would involve sending the key to the cloner, involving delay and risk of it being lost in transit.

There is a key cloner in the UK that I have found reliable and reasonable (around £40 to cut a key for my V90 and clone its transponder chip). All I can find at the moment is his email address enquiries@keymoon.uk He made a key for me earlier this year and also several years ago.

I think the key that opens everything but the trunk is intended to lending (for example) to valet parking personnel. Obvioulsly not being able to open the trunk is not ideal.

Martin

Added: Found his website: https://www.keymoon.uk/

Last edited by martin calva; Nov 18th, 2019 at 18:36.
martin calva is offline   Reply With Quote
The Following 2 Users Say Thank You to martin calva For This Useful Post:
Old Nov 18th, 2019, 22:35   #17
Piet22
Junior Member
 

Last Online: Mar 5th, 2024 20:22
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: Amsterdam
Default

In the first message the topicstarter complains that the car (hopefully he means the starter motor) refuses to turn over.
This typically indicates a problem with the Guard II alarm as the immobilizer blocks the fuel injection. First step is to have the starter engine working, after that worry about the immobilizer.

Easiest way to bypass the Guard II alarm is to remove its fuse; this will remove power from the alarm and the central locking.
As Volvo was dumb enough to use Normally Closed relays, removing the power from the alarm will bridge the interruption in the starter motor circuit.
I cannot mention the fuse-number in this public forum, but it's the same number the Dutch football player Johan Cruijff used all his life.

Perhaps the TS is in luck as the so called garage key, while preventing access to the glove compartiment and the trunk, should have a RFID chip installed.

Last edited by Piet22; Nov 18th, 2019 at 22:55.
Piet22 is offline   Reply With Quote
The Following 2 Users Say Thank You to Piet22 For This Useful Post:
Old Nov 19th, 2019, 13:58   #18
TonyS9
Premier Member
 

Last Online: Mar 4th, 2024 00:49
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: Holywood
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Piet22 View Post
In the first message the topicstarter complains that the car (hopefully he means the starter motor) refuses to turn over.
This typically indicates a problem with the Guard II alarm as the immobilizer blocks the fuel injection. First step is to have the starter engine working, after that worry about the immobilizer.

Easiest way to bypass the Guard II alarm is to remove its fuse; this will remove power from the alarm and the central locking.
As Volvo was dumb enough to use Normally Closed relays, removing the power from the alarm will bridge the interruption in the starter motor circuit.
I cannot mention the fuse-number in this public forum, but it's the same number the Dutch football player Johan Cruijff used all his life.

Perhaps the TS is in luck as the so called garage key, while preventing access to the glove compartiment and the trunk, should have a RFID chip installed.
There are 2 immobilisers in a 96 on car
1 for the starter (basic relay, alarm activated)
1 for the fuel system (not related to the alarm being on or off, need chip key)
TonyS9 is offline   Reply With Quote
The Following User Says Thank You to TonyS9 For This Useful Post:
Old Jan 9th, 2020, 13:34   #19
Stalledvolvos90
New Member
 

Last Online: Feb 26th, 2020 11:48
Join Date: Nov 2019
Location: Sydney
Default

Hey, so sorry I forgot to update my situation as people were trying to help me out at a rather stressful time for me.

The key I had cut to the passenger door barrel would not work as it didn’t have a chip programmed to the car.
After calling many locksmiths most did not want to help me, they all said it’s a risky job and could render my car a brick which I didn’t want.
For $350 AUD someone did come and explained to me the risk again, he started to go to work on my car and literally 10 minutes later I heard the engine start.
The key he cut was not traced well by the machine though, my key that opens the door has ridges that are more pronounced so the new key is purely a ignition key. It has a little square tab that I’m sure has the chip inside and one day I will remove it and place it in a position that both keys will work. I’m just not sure if the chip is easily damaged so will have to call the locksmith to ask him before I proceed.
I registered the car over the holiday period and started planning its maiden voyage and decided my next ice hockey game was a perfect first outing for me and my sweedish car. I have literally fallen in love with this car, it has a few broken interior pieces and the aircon is not cold at all (which sucks with the climate in Australia at the moment) but I will tackle these issues as me and my girl absolutely love driving it.
We are planning to get some nice wheels after I touch up some body work. As a spray painter I would love it to look stunning.
If anyone in Sydney ever has this issue Marcos locksmiths is the company you need, I have kept his business card incase another Volvo driver needs him some day.
Thanks for the responses, having people try to help is a nice thing in this world but as I got stressed money was the best way out. Sorry again for not updating.

Last edited by Stalledvolvos90; Jan 9th, 2020 at 13:40.
Stalledvolvos90 is offline   Reply With Quote
The Following 2 Users Say Thank You to Stalledvolvos90 For This Useful Post:
Old Jan 9th, 2020, 18:53   #20
Laird Scooby
Premier Member
 
Laird Scooby's Avatar
 

Last Online: Yesterday 21:57
Join Date: May 2012
Location: Lakenheath
Default

Glad to hear you're mobile again and have returned another Volvo to its natural hunting ground - the road!
__________________
Cheers
Dave

Next Door to Top-Gun with a Honda CR-V & S Type Jag Volvo gone but not forgotten........
Laird Scooby is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply


Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT +1. The time now is 09:03.


Powered by vBulletin
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.