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53 D5 gearbox slip on long drive, lucas stop slip fluid??

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Old Mar 22nd, 2013, 01:11   #11
Phil in england
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Last Online: Mar 29th, 2013 12:03
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Location: Bristol
Default Torque converter lockup sluggish and slipping

Volvo D5 Auto with engine remap - haven't been driving it like and idiot but occasionally get a smile from putting it in D3 and blowing past the traffic.

However in the last couple of years a fault has begun to creep in. At first it only happened in D5 but now it does it in D4 and even slightly in D3. (When I say "D" I mean I manually select the gear with the geartronic shift).

Problem as follows: Put it in say, D4 or D5 after the torque converter lockup clutch is activated and floor the accelerator right away and you get a nasty juddering with the revs going up more than they should. Ease off the accelerator a little and it all settles down. It only happens when the lockup is engaged, never when it isn't.

It seems that the lockup clutch is slipping, it's very similar to when a manual gearbox clutch is slipping/worn and you get that nasty clutch judder.

However, here's the mystery: If you press the accelerator down more slowly, for instance take a couple of seconds to feed the power up to full power, you get no slip at all.

It seems that something in the system is "sluggish" and can't keep up with a quick demand for clutch grip when "flooring it".

Someone tells me it could be a sticky solenoid, someone else tells me it's the valve block, someone else tells me it's the clutch that's worn (but then why does it grip on full power when I press right down more slowly?). Someone tells me it's the gearbox software, I've just had the software updated on the gearbox today but the symptoms persist.

Has anybody out there had experience of these symptoms? My D5 is gettling a bit old with 120k on the clock now, so I'd rather not spend 4-digit numbers on it, I can drive it normally in fully auto but then I miss the fun of quick overtakes when in manual change mode! Any help gratefully appreciated.
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Old Mar 22nd, 2013, 01:45   #12
SonyVaio
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Phil in england View Post
Any help gratefully appreciated.
Hi Phil,

First question would be when was the last time the ATF fluid was changes and Software updated?

This is really the starting point for almost any Auto Box error. Newer software will change the pressure settings and stuff in the box and you may find that is all your needing to be back to normal.

If I was in your situation I'd do the following:

Change ATF fluid with correct quality oil (JWS3309 spec)
Have a TCM update (software)
Reset adaption settings
Reset fluid counter

For the resets your going to need VIDA/DICE so help from a member with them or a dealer. Software is generally from a dealer but there are a few Indy garages with the ability to do software updates.

Then if this doesn't solve your problem you are looking at changing solenoids. A common failure is the B4 servo but not so sure the failure for that matches your symptoms.

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Old Mar 28th, 2013, 01:26   #13
Phil in england
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Default TC lockup slip

Thanks - as mentioned in my post, I'd just had the software updated by MRG Volvo on Chippenham, hoping the lockup prob would be cured but it's not helped. Strange thing is that the lockup slip/judder only occurs when I press the accelerator down at a "normal" rate. In that situation the slip/judder begins even by the time the pedal is down just a quarter of its travel. However, if I feed the power in slowly, it won't slip/judder at all, even under full power, pedal fully pressed down. Seems like something is not responding fast enough to changes in the accelerator position. If I let the slip happen too frequently, the "Transmisson Service" message comes up on the display and the torque converter lockup is disabled completely, until I next switch the ignition off and then on again. I can clear the actual message by reloading the ECU remap with my Rica handheld terminal.
I've also noticed in the last year that quite often, once warm, slow city traffic below 10 mph or so, the gearbox will drop down to 1st with a noticeable thump. This might be completely unrelated but to any expert out there, this might be something helpful in determining the fault.
I've never had the fluid changed and I've had the car since 49,000 miles and it now is at 120,000 miles. Some garages tell me that a fluid flush and change might help whereas others tell me that a fluid change can bring on a load of new problems as it might disturb some of the valves and seals and even some debris from component wear. I'm hesitant about doing this, not sure if problems with fluid changes is more of a myth or if it's the garages trying to cover their backsides or whether its a very real possibility.
The other thing is that this lockup judder is "hidden" if I use the box in fully auto rather than in manual. However, I notice that in fully auto, the gearbox is "slippy" with little evidence of which gear is selected under power and instead what seems to be a lot of activity from the torque converter rather than each gear "locking in". Any further advice really welcome as this problem isn't going to go away by itself and will only get worse I'm sure. I know auto boxes can be a money pit, I'm prepared to spend sensible money for a fix but would rather avoid the merry-go-round of replacing bits on a trial and error basis, if at all possible. My software update was worth a try for £40 but from this point onwards, any ideas as to the most cost-effective and likely route to take?
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Old Mar 28th, 2013, 01:37   #14
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Phil,

You really do want to get the ATF changed, this in itself may sort your issues out.

You will fin threads of other people doing an ATF change at the first time at approx 120,000 and that includes myself on my V50. My fluid was black! Well needing a change, I also noticed the difference too once done.

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