v70 2.5 tdi 1998 cold start problem - electrical

shahidocean · Dec 18th, 2009, 13:06

guys,
i've had this v70 for a few years now, started first time every time like a trusty old workhorse. anyway went to pick up the kids and someone in a small nippy car shot in front of me forcing me to emergency stop! the next day i had a cold start problem, cranked for about 5 mins before it fired but ran fine after that. called aa they said glowplugs, i got some off ebay and they fitted them, same problem, took it to nationwide under aa breakdown warranty, they said glowplug voltage too low on start, they sent to volvo dealer who said, ecu need replacing and maybe other things, i bought the car back home drove it! i think its a wiring issue, when i braked hard i think one of the wires or plugs in the loom has been stretched. can anyone help me and give me some pointers, which connections should i check and where they would be, also where can i find the information on this diesel version d5252t engine. thanks in advance, i am looking forward to hearing that sweet sound of firing on first turn. have a brilliant christmas!

BillB · Dec 18th, 2009, 16:58

There isn't a specific Haynes Volvo manual for the Tdi. Best one is the Audi 100/A6 manual (3504) which covers your engine. Not sure about the problem - you need the fault code. If you acquire a VADIS disc it covers the Tdi and may help with diagnosis. Regards.

Chris_Rogers · Dec 18th, 2009, 17:14

Wiring diagrams can be found here:

http://mojevolvo.pl/wiki/Volvo_V70

a '98 (could be '99 model year) the car could have either MSA 15.7 or 15.8 engine management system, if the air mass meter is mechanical it will be 15.7.

shahidocean · Jan 6th, 2010, 10:09

hello guys,
thanks for the replies it is very much appreciated,
haven't done anything with the car yet because of the weather and holidays,
infinite thanks

for the manuals, i now am looking at a circuit of the msa 15.7 DI system, that makes the problem solvable. someone also suggested clogged fuel filter, i suppose that is easy to check.

I want to assume that its a wiring harness problem, because the volvo guys would have found a code on their scan, i will ask them but i dont want to take the car to them again, i think this problem is beyond their capability anyways ...

I have a meter, whats the best way to start diagnosing the problem. I find that in these problems, finding the real source of the problem is the whole battle, so i am looking for clues, the big one is this ...

When the aa guy replaced the glow plugs when i started it, it fired first time then it stopped starting again on the second firing, so i think the breaks in the wiring system are close to the glow plugs, it also was misfiring on a few cylinders starting up, now this is what i don't understand, i thought that the glowplugs are only used in under 5degrees and that they don't operate like spark plugs, so when the compression happens, the injectors squirt a mix into the cylinders and this happens later if its colder, I want to check that circuit path make sure the that voltage is getting there, and also check the voltage at the plugs and follow the wiring back to source.
is there anything obvious that i should check. best regards

alv70d1999 · Jan 6th, 2010, 11:36

firstly, id check to see if the part of the loom that touches the top of the glow plug is a tight fit as i found mine were very slack fitting and didn't make full contact and that made it bad to start in the cold. plus it only needs one gp for it to start up very lumpy.. secondly, my local factors shows 2 sets of gp`s for the same engine, a short set and a long set.
i ordered a set of gp`s and he ordered the short ones and although they fit in the thread, they were far too short to sit in the cylinder so thats worth a check..

also if youv got a low voltage on the gp circuit, then that could be the battery so check the battery voltage at the battery when the gp`s are energized.

shahidocean · Jan 7th, 2010, 15:24

thanks guys,
my glowplugs are the correct ones, the long ones, the battery is weak,
but i have charged it up and when the aa guy connected his strong battery,
i still had the problem. i need to inspect the loom at the plugs and use a meter to make sure they are connected to where they are supposed to be and jiggle the loom to see if its loose. i would really like a picture from under the hood so that i can match the real components and connections to the circuit diagram.
i need to get out to the car but its snowed under at the moment ... its so nice and warm inside... i am doing the research first and getting all the information before i go outside and start physically diagnosing. thanks again, i will let you guys know how i get on ... enjoy your snow !

something like this...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fzIjs...eature=related

shahidocean · Jan 12th, 2010, 15:08

ok guys checked from the relay pin 3 to the glowplugs and there is continuity,
checked the voltage at the glowplugs, when i turned the key, i got 12 volts
coz the glowplugs come on for about 10 seconds in the cold, when i started,
i got 12 volts during the cranking and it started in about a minute, then i ran it took it for a run, when it was hot i started it first time three times. nothing wrong with it! so i will try starting it in the morning. i can see fuel coming in to the injectors, i think through a clear pipe so i am assuming fuel system is working, glowplugs work, ecu works, relay works, and there is continuity. what to test next?

outnumbered · Jan 12th, 2010, 15:44

what where the codes from the dealers. also it could be the pump timing is out slightly this will cause cold start issues
mike

shahidocean · Jan 13th, 2010, 02:17

also from the fuse the power passes through 2 connectors,
does anybody know where they are located
cheers guys i appreciate the support
i will try and find the codes from the dealer tommorow
they should have record of them from my
last visit to them

shahidocean · Aug 27th, 2010, 03:33

since my last post: i've overhauled the braking system, replaced the run off tubes to the injectors, cleaned out the air filter system, cleaned the maf, removed and cleaned the egr valve. recently i changed my fuel filter and replaced the battery. The fuel filter change gave me that cranking before fire. It was cutting off immediately after firing. and then hunting around idle, this is better now.

I suspect some air leaking into the fuel system now. I am getting the car fired up after a ten second crank now. i've heard that the fuel system is self bleeding. so when it is better. i post an update, it seems to be getting better daily ....

Dec 18th, 2009, 13:06	#1
shahidocean New Member Last Online: May 8th, 2011 11:36 Join Date: May 2009 Location: ip	v70 2.5 tdi 1998 cold start problem - electrical guys, i've had this v70 for a few years now, started first time every time like a trusty old workhorse. anyway went to pick up the kids and someone in a small nippy car shot in front of me forcing me to emergency stop! the next day i had a cold start problem, cranked for about 5 mins before it fired but ran fine after that. called aa they said glowplugs, i got some off ebay and they fitted them, same problem, took it to nationwide under aa breakdown warranty, they said glowplug voltage too low on start, they sent to volvo dealer who said, ecu need replacing and maybe other things, i bought the car back home drove it! i think its a wiring issue, when i braked hard i think one of the wires or plugs in the loom has been stretched. can anyone help me and give me some pointers, which connections should i check and where they would be, also where can i find the information on this diesel version d5252t engine. thanks in advance, i am looking forward to hearing that sweet sound of firing on first turn. have a brilliant christmas!

Jan 6th, 2010, 10:09	#4
shahidocean New Member Last Online: May 8th, 2011 11:36 Join Date: May 2009 Location: ip	help much appreciated hello guys, thanks for the replies it is very much appreciated, haven't done anything with the car yet because of the weather and holidays, infinite thanks for the manuals, i now am looking at a circuit of the msa 15.7 DI system, that makes the problem solvable. someone also suggested clogged fuel filter, i suppose that is easy to check. I want to assume that its a wiring harness problem, because the volvo guys would have found a code on their scan, i will ask them but i dont want to take the car to them again, i think this problem is beyond their capability anyways ... I have a meter, whats the best way to start diagnosing the problem. I find that in these problems, finding the real source of the problem is the whole battle, so i am looking for clues, the big one is this ... When the aa guy replaced the glow plugs when i started it, it fired first time then it stopped starting again on the second firing, so i think the breaks in the wiring system are close to the glow plugs, it also was misfiring on a few cylinders starting up, now this is what i don't understand, i thought that the glowplugs are only used in under 5degrees and that they don't operate like spark plugs, so when the compression happens, the injectors squirt a mix into the cylinders and this happens later if its colder, I want to check that circuit path make sure the that voltage is getting there, and also check the voltage at the plugs and follow the wiring back to source. is there anything obvious that i should check. best regards

Jan 7th, 2010, 15:24	#6
shahidocean New Member Last Online: May 8th, 2011 11:36 Join Date: May 2009 Location: ip	continuity testing on the circuit thanks guys, my glowplugs are the correct ones, the long ones, the battery is weak, but i have charged it up and when the aa guy connected his strong battery, i still had the problem. i need to inspect the loom at the plugs and use a meter to make sure they are connected to where they are supposed to be and jiggle the loom to see if its loose. i would really like a picture from under the hood so that i can match the real components and connections to the circuit diagram. i need to get out to the car but its snowed under at the moment ... its so nice and warm inside... i am doing the research first and getting all the information before i go outside and start physically diagnosing. thanks again, i will let you guys know how i get on ... enjoy your snow ! something like this... http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fzIjs...eature=related Last edited by shahidocean; Jan 7th, 2010 at 15:34. Reason: forgot a link !

Jan 12th, 2010, 15:08	#7
shahidocean New Member Last Online: May 8th, 2011 11:36 Join Date: May 2009 Location: ip	developments ok guys checked from the relay pin 3 to the glowplugs and there is continuity, checked the voltage at the glowplugs, when i turned the key, i got 12 volts coz the glowplugs come on for about 10 seconds in the cold, when i started, i got 12 volts during the cranking and it started in about a minute, then i ran it took it for a run, when it was hot i started it first time three times. nothing wrong with it! so i will try starting it in the morning. i can see fuel coming in to the injectors, i think through a clear pipe so i am assuming fuel system is working, glowplugs work, ecu works, relay works, and there is continuity. what to test next?

Jan 12th, 2010, 15:44	#8
outnumbered Lunatic from Wakefield Last Online: Apr 16th, 2023 06:33 Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: wakefield	what where the codes from the dealers. also it could be the pump timing is out slightly this will cause cold start issues mike __________________ 2012 volvo xc90 Executive Buccaneer Bermuda 2021

Dec 18th, 2009, 16:58	#2
BillB VOC Member Last Online: Apr 2nd, 2024 23:24 Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: Bristol	There isn't a specific Haynes Volvo manual for the Tdi. Best one is the Audi 100/A6 manual (3504) which covers your engine. Not sure about the problem - you need the fault code. If you acquire a VADIS disc it covers the Tdi and may help with diagnosis. Regards.

Dec 18th, 2009, 17:14	#3
Chris_Rogers VOC Member Last Online: Apr 10th, 2017 16:55 Join Date: Jan 1970 Location: South Kent Coast	Wiring diagrams can be found here: http://mojevolvo.pl/wiki/Volvo_V70 a '98 (could be '99 model year) the car could have either MSA 15.7 or 15.8 engine management system, if the air mass meter is mechanical it will be 15.7.

Jan 6th, 2010, 11:36	#5
alv70d1999 I've Been Banned Last Online: Sep 28th, 2010 12:05 Join Date: Apr 2009 Location: button moon	firstly, id check to see if the part of the loom that touches the top of the glow plug is a tight fit as i found mine were very slack fitting and didn't make full contact and that made it bad to start in the cold. plus it only needs one gp for it to start up very lumpy.. secondly, my local factors shows 2 sets of gp`s for the same engine, a short set and a long set. i ordered a set of gp`s and he ordered the short ones and although they fit in the thread, they were far too short to sit in the cylinder so thats worth a check.. also if youv got a low voltage on the gp circuit, then that could be the battery so check the battery voltage at the battery when the gp`s are energized.

Jan 13th, 2010, 02:17	#9
shahidocean New Member Last Online: May 8th, 2011 11:36 Join Date: May 2009 Location: ip	forgot to say lambda sensor light is on in the dashboard also from the fuse the power passes through 2 connectors, does anybody know where they are located cheers guys i appreciate the support i will try and find the codes from the dealer tommorow they should have record of them from my last visit to them

Aug 27th, 2010, 03:33	#10
shahidocean New Member Last Online: May 8th, 2011 11:36 Join Date: May 2009 Location: ip	update fuel filter since my last post: i've overhauled the braking system, replaced the run off tubes to the injectors, cleaned out the air filter system, cleaned the maf, removed and cleaned the egr valve. recently i changed my fuel filter and replaced the battery. The fuel filter change gave me that cranking before fire. It was cutting off immediately after firing. and then hunting around idle, this is better now. I suspect some air leaking into the fuel system now. I am getting the car fired up after a ten second crank now. i've heard that the fuel system is self bleeding. so when it is better. i post an update, it seems to be getting better daily ....

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